Discrepancy between bus company timetable and bustimes.org data: Salisbury Reds route 87

[Hassocks5489]

Hi all,

I'm looking at the timetable for Saturday 25th June for the Salisbury Reds route 87 - a fairly irregular Salisbury–Salisbury service via Pitton, Winterslow and various Wiltshire villages. As it stands today, the Salisbury Reds website is showing a PDF timetable valid from March 2022 which includes a journey from Salisbury at 1005 on that morning (in fact it runs every morning Mondays to Saturdays). Google Maps also shows this journey operating tomorrow when clicking on various bus stops served by the route. However, bustimes.org data (apparently updated 20th May) does not show this journey or some of the later ones on any day of the week in the next couple of weeks: apparently the only services running are the 1535 and 1740 ex-Salisbury. (The 1005 service was on bustimes.org when I was looking at Saturday journeys a couple of months ago when I was planning my trip.)

Can anybody knowledgeable suggest whether the bustimes.org data or the timetable data is more likely to be right at this stage? This has become more important given today's rail strike announcements, because if the 1005 does not really exist I will amend my itinerary to get back to Southampton earlier and then return all the way to Hove by bus. (A long journey, I know!) If it is likely to run I will carry on with my planned itinerary and stay an extra night.

Thanks for any help anybody can offer!

 

[PeterC]

I have seen similar discrepancies elsewhere. I don't know how the data is structured but I would guess an indexing error.

 

[borage]

I think this is because some 87 journeys are operated by Stagecoach South, including the 10:05, so they're confusingly on a separate timetable on bustimes.org. There's a GPS trace of Stagecoach vehicle operating the 10:05 this morning, so it does seem to exist.

 

[Megafuss]

Hi all,

I'm looking at the timetable for Saturday 25th June for the Salisbury Reds route 87 - a fairly irregular Salisbury–Salisbury service via Pitton, Winterslow and various Wiltshire villages. As it stands today, the Salisbury Reds website is showing a PDF timetable valid from March 2022 which includes a journey from Salisbury at 1005 on that morning (in fact it runs every morning Mondays to Saturdays). Google Maps also shows this journey operating tomorrow when clicking on various bus stops served by the route. However, bustimes.org data (apparently updated 20th May) does not show this journey or some of the later ones on any day of the week in the next couple of weeks: apparently the only services running are the 1535 and 1740 ex-Salisbury. (The 1005 service was on bustimes.org when I was looking at Saturday journeys a couple of months ago when I was planning my trip.)

Can anybody knowledgeable suggest whether the bustimes.org data or the timetable data is more likely to be right at this stage? This has become more important given today's rail strike announcements, because if the 1005 does not really exist I will amend my itinerary to get back to Southampton earlier and then return all the way to Hove by bus. (A long journey, I know!) If it is likely to run I will carry on with my planned itinerary and stay an extra night.

Thanks for any help anybody can offer!

Have you looked at Stagecoach 87 on Bustimes?

 

[Hassocks5489]

Thank you all - that must be it! I can see it now on the Stagecoach page. Good! Now to book some accommodation in case of train strikes...

 

[WY Bus Spotter]

There are discrepancies all over West Yorkshire. I was waiting for a bus in Ilkley a couple of months ago; Bustimes, WYMetro, the bus stop timetable, and realtime display were all showing totally different times!

Not sure why car users would want to use public transport when they can't even find out when it's going to show up.

 

[Hassocks5489]

There are discrepancies all over West Yorkshire. I was waiting for a bus in Ilkley a couple of months ago; Bustimes, WYMetro, the bus stop timetable, and realtime display were all showing totally different times!

Not sure why car users would want to use public transport when they can't even find out when it's going to show up.

That doesn't bode well for my trip to West Yorkshire this weekend!

 

[WY Bus Spotter]

That doesn't bode well for my trip to West Yorkshire this weekend!

It isn't as rampant as my original post may imply, but it is certainly noticeable if you use a variety of sources for your times on certain routes.

 

[markymark2000]

There are discrepancies all over West Yorkshire. I was waiting for a bus in Ilkley a couple of months ago; Bustimes, WYMetro, the bus stop timetable, and realtime display were all showing totally different times!

Not sure why car users would want to use public transport when they can't even find out when it's going to show up.

Are you able to expand on that? Which route/routes are you referring to?

 

[Typhoon]

There are discrepancies all over West Yorkshire. I was waiting for a bus in Ilkley a couple of months ago; Bustimes, WYMetro, the bus stop timetable, and realtime display were all showing totally different times!

Not sure why car users would want to use public transport when they can't even find out when it's going to show up.

Given the amount of public transport information that is out there, that is not totally surprising.

Discrepancy with the realtime display - bus is running late/ subject to diversion. If the company has a twitter feed, it might, might indicate why if the discrepancy is a significant period of time. You don't indicate the extent of the discrepancies.
Many timetable panels now only have arrival times at that stop*, even though that stop is not a timing point so is probably a 'if you are here at this time, you almost certainly won't miss the bus' time. Near me there is a bottle neck on a summer weekend (largely caused because of delivery drivers parking irresponsible/ visitors not being able to recognise where the - narrow - pavement stops and the road begins). Buses can be up to 10 minutes later than timetabled, if it is a hot day but on time if it is pissing it down. For more on timetable panels, Roger French's blog is the place to go, the bane of his life. Particularly during lockdowns/ driver shortages emergency timetables were put into place - we still have them. They are not necessarily going to find their way into timetable panels - they should do, but we have to be realistic, companies put timetables on their website knowing most can access them. I'm not condoning this but it would be a question of priorities. There is probably a notice on the bus that you missed because you read the timetable in the panel.

bustimes is excellent and gives the date when the data was collected but if I was going to an unfamiliar place on an infrequent service, I would want to check elsewhere too. Locally, I find it useful as I know that when the bus I am going to catch reaches a certain place I need to leave knowing that I will have several minutes wait at the stop in case it can make up time. I also don't think that bustimes is widely known outside of those interested in public transport.

I was once travelling in an area unfamiliar to me, I noticed a discrepancy between the operator and the county council timetable. Figuring out that the operator (a smallish independent) should know the times as it ran the bus. I contacted them and had a response before 7am, thanking me , indicating that it was their on-line timetable that was wrong but had now been corrected. As most people on this site are presumably interested in public transport, surely when we notice inconsistencies, it is up to us to raise this? In an ideal world, it shouldn't be the case, but this is not an ideal world.

* - because they don't think people can read a timetable?

 

[D6130]

That doesn't bode well for my trip to West Yorkshire this weekend

Living in West Yorkshire for part of the year, I find that the most reliably updated source of bus timetable information is the PTE's official site:

www.wymetro.com

 

[PeterC]

My local service was rerouted on Saturdays between two existing timing points. As the PDF timetables on the council website were unchanged this didn't get onto the council updates page. What it did mean was that my local stop had suddenly had the Saturday frequency doubled but nobody knew as the departure lists at the stops hadn't been updated.

Our out if date bus stop displays started me looking at other stops in the area and I could make a career out of finding incorrect or misleading information.

I agree with a previous poster that the bustimes site isn't widely known outside the trade and the enthusiast community. My own observation of passengers in the Home Counties suggests that most rely in the printed information.

 

[duncombec]

I agree with a previous poster that the bustimes site isn't widely known outside the trade and the enthusiast community. My own observation of passengers in the Home Counties suggests that most rely in the printed information.

I've seen drivers in this area encouraging passengers to use it rather than their own company's website! (No prizes for guessing which company...)

It's important to remember that bustimes is essentially a "Garbage in, garbage out" website: if the service files that the operators upload to Bus Open Data Service, Traveline, etc. are incomplete or inaccurate, then so will be the output - hence why it can't show multi-operator services, because I imagine they would then have to be manually meshed. Similar with duplicate journeys - a local operator failed to 'code' the schoolday and school holiday journeys properly, so 90% of the service showed as duplicated all day - on its own website, bustimes, traveline, etc.

 

[GusB]

It would seem that the original query has been answered, so we'll bring this thread to a close. Thanks for your replies, everyone.