Firstgroup Agreement To Acquire Ensign Bus Company

[WAB]

Interesting, seems First have become more confident in the bus side of the business despite the retrenchment in some areas. I suppose by having a bus sales/maintenance arm as well it means that you can make money selling services to your competitors (like go ahead and Hants and Dorset Trim), especially as more low emission zones come into effect and they require new or refurbished/modified complaint buses which you are well placed to supply.

Or it's buying out the competition and getting some newer buses as part of the bargain.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I agree with this. A sale to GoAhead would allow the company to maintain its own fleet, livery etc, whereas First Group will probably soon homogenise the company within First Group. The press release refers to the young fleet Ensign has, and that no capital expenditure wil be required for a few years. I read that as there will be no new buses for Ensign, and their fleet will soon be as old and shabby as the rest of First Group.

As it's an announcement to the city, the statement is to show that they haven't bought an absolute crock that will require a load of money to put right.

 

[scosutsut]

As it's an announcement to the city, the statement is to show that they haven't bought even more absolute crock that will require a load of money to put right.

Fixed that for you

 

[richw]

Someone that I know who works at First Travel Sol has been informed that they are taking on the C2C contract as part of the Ensign buyout.

First have also won some tfl rail replacement. Starting this weekend between Uxbridge and harrow on the hill, operating out of Slough using drivers coming in from across the south

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Fixed that for you

It depends.

That was the case when they bought Cawlett Holdings. When they bought Finglands, then the vehicles didn't transfer across so a different challenge. The purchase of Truronian was more similar to this in that they bought a business with a relatively decent fleet (and it wasn't sent around the country either - one of the Solos is still with First in Cornwall!)

 

[fgwrich]

It depends.

That was the case when they bought Cawlett Holdings. When they bought Finglands, then the vehicles didn't transfer across so a different challenge. The purchase of Truronian was more similar to this in that they bought a business with a relatively decent fleet (and it wasn't sent around the country either - one of the Solos is still with First in Cornwall!)

As is, sort of, one of the Darts too (The GWR Painted one). It was impressive how long those Truronian Solo's stuck around for considering how often vehicles are transferred around - being mostly Merc engined examples they were pretty rapid too.

Speaking of Truronian Darts, it's nice to see TT03TRU has entered preservation and is now back in Truronian Red and Silver again.

 

[RELL6L]

This is a great shame - as is Southdown PSV. I suspect it is really difficult for smaller companies to make money at the moment. Ensign has been a good quality operator in Grays and Thurrock for a number of years as well as interesting to enthusiasts. I can see it being attractive to First, a simple adjacent add-on to First Essex and no London contracts. The bus dealership may give access to a stock of second hand vehicles but will First's competitors start going elsewhere if they see themselves handing First an advantage here?

I hope the wonderful heritage fleet survives intact and continues to get used.

 

[stevenedin]

This is a great shame - as is Southdown PSV. I suspect it is really difficult for smaller companies to make money at the moment. Ensign has been a good quality operator in Grays and Thurrock for a number of years as well as interesting to enthusiasts. I can see it being attractive to First, a simple adjacent add-on to First Essex and no London contracts. The bus dealership may give access to a stock of second hand vehicles but will First's competitors start going elsewhere if they see themselves handing First an advantage here?

I hope the wonderful heritage fleet survives intact and continues to get used.

I was thinking the same about the competitors. I think it would be wise to keep the same name of Ensign and to prove that they don’t give themselves preferential treatment over other operators.

 

[Whiteway215]

This is a great shame - as is Southdown PSV. I suspect it is really difficult for smaller companies to make money at the moment. Ensign has been a good quality operator in Grays and Thurrock for a number of years as well as interesting to enthusiasts. I can see it being attractive to First, a simple adjacent add-on to First Essex and no London contracts. The bus dealership may give access to a stock of second hand vehicles but will First's competitors start going elsewhere if they see themselves handing First an advantage here?

I hope the wonderful heritage fleet survives intact and continues to get used.

At the moment Ensign seem to buy up the majority of the vehicles that are withdrawn from the various London fleets and I do wonder if that would continue.

 

[stevenedin]

At the moment Ensign seem to buy up the majority of the vehicles that are withdrawn from the various London fleets and I do wonder if that would continue.

They also seem to have been buying a lot of the old Lothian stock too.

 

[fgwrich]

I hope the wonderful heritage fleet survives intact and continues to get used.

The heritage fleet isn't part of the sale and is staying with the Newman family.

 

[ChrisPJ]

I'm struggling to think of an example where First have bought a company in recent years and actually grown it or at least not had to downsize it. Finglands was a particularly strange purchase.

 

[Soundwave]

This is a great shame - as is Southdown PSV. I suspect it is really difficult for smaller companies to make money at the moment. Ensign has been a good quality operator in Grays and Thurrock for a number of years as well as interesting to enthusiasts. I can see it being attractive to First, a simple adjacent add-on to First Essex and no London contracts. The bus dealership may give access to a stock of second hand vehicles but will First's competitors start going elsewhere if they see themselves handing First an advantage here?

I hope the wonderful heritage fleet survives intact and continues to get used.

If non Stagecoach operators were more than happy to buy brand new ADL vehicles despite Sir Brian Souter's direct involvement, I doubt they'll be too bothered about second hand buses bought from Ensign.

 

[RELL6L]

The heritage fleet isn't part of the sale and is staying with the Newman family.

Indeed. But will it have as good access to engineering facilities and resources as before - and will it have the same opportunities to run in service / heritage days etc? I hope so.

 

[stait.john]

I'm struggling to think of an example where First have bought a company in recent years and actually grown it or at least not had to downsize it. Finglands was a particularly strange purchase.

The mistake with Finglands was the Management and Supervisors they inherited still ran it like Finglands and lacked any enthusiasm, poor decisions were made and it was so sad to see it close after just a few years.

 

[Leyland Bus]

The mistake with Finglands was the Management and Supervisors they inherited still ran it like Finglands and lacked any enthusiasm, poor decisions were made and it was so sad to see it close after just a few years

Was it totally that though? Having worked for FGM at the time, half the fleet was made up of time expired Tridents (one of which never saw the road, despite being painted, it was so bad) and was a load of overheads that could and were forced onto other depots to save them money... You only have to look at Bury garage for that... The site was rented aswell IIRC. Infact, FirstBus' entire tenure of what was GMBuses North was to take a fairly decent operation and run it into the floor by cutting and cutting and cutting, be it staff, garages, vehicles, routes, the whole kit and kaboodle... Clueless management didn't help ofcourse, which were mostly failed bus drivers who'd say yes to anything to get along without being noticed too much or former accountants who didn't understand running buses... It was incredible how many times you'd bang your head against a wall at the most obvious things being missed or ruined...

 

[Bedford OB]

I went to Lakeside this morning. The Ensign and Stagecoach buses were pretty well immaculate as usual, despite damp muddy roads. Arriva were scruffy as usual. The First vehicles were an absolute disgrace. This wasn't a bit of road dirt, it was buses that have clearly not been properly cleaned for significant time. The buse users of Thurrock have that delight to look forward to, as a number seem to have realised already from what one is hearing from local sources and radio phone ins.

 

[fgwrich]

I went to Lakeside this morning. The Ensign and Stagecoach buses were pretty well immaculate as usual, despite damp muddy roads. Arriva were scruffy as usual. The First vehicles were an absolute disgrace. This wasn't a bit of road dirt, it was buses that have clearly not been properly cleaned for significant time. The buse users of Thurrock have that delight to look forward to, as a number seem to have realised already from what one is hearing from local sources and radio phone ins.

Well, For a bit of balance here was the rear of my Stagecoach Hampshire vehicle this morning. The side windows weren’t that much better either, though as I was sat in the middle seat I couldn't get a decent photo.

 

[Busaholic]

This is a great shame - as is Southdown PSV. I suspect it is really difficult for smaller companies to make money at the moment. Ensign has been a good quality operator in Grays and Thurrock for a number of years as well as interesting to enthusiasts. I can see it being attractive to First, a simple adjacent add-on to First Essex and no London contracts. The bus dealership may give access to a stock of second hand vehicles but will First's competitors start going elsewhere if they see themselves handing First an advantage here?

I hope the wonderful heritage fleet survives intact and continues to get used.

Wholeheartedly agree with you. Unfortunately, I think the age of the medium size, well-run independent is almost over, in England at least. There'll still be the odd exception (Delaines?) but local authorities will always favour having fewer operators to deal with, whether by franchising, running bus services themselves again at one remove, or existing alternatives. Ensignbus without the Newmans would be a considerably diminished resource imo, but nothing lasts forever.

The heritage fleet's survival intact is a worry. Should I have won the lottery tonight I'd like to think I could help!

 

[Wolfie]

I went to Lakeside this morning. The Ensign and Stagecoach buses were pretty well immaculate as usual, despite damp muddy roads. Arriva were scruffy as usual. The First vehicles were an absolute disgrace. This wasn't a bit of road dirt, it was buses that have clearly not been properly cleaned for significant time. The buse users of Thurrock have that delight to look forward to, as a number seem to have realised already from what one is hearing from local sources and radio phone ins.

I'm in Grays all weekend.... Most of the First vehicles l have seen have been absolutely fine albeit notably older than their Ensign counterparts.

 

[E-Rail]

Wholeheartedly agree with you. Unfortunately, I think the age of the medium size, well-run independent is almost over, in England at least. There'll still be the odd exception (Delaines?) but local authorities will always favour having fewer operators to deal with, whether by franchising, running bus services themselves again at one remove, or existing alternatives. Ensignbus without the Newmans would be a considerably diminished resource imo, but nothing lasts forever.

The heritage fleet's survival intact is a worry. Should I have won the lottery tonight I'd like to think I could help!

The heritage fleet will become the heritage collection and potentially grow with new restorations planned. They are no plans for an operating licence however and the buses will be for enjoyment, running days and historic purposes.

 

[richw]

I'm in Grays all weekend.... Most of the First vehicles l have seen have been absolutely fine albeit notably older than their Ensign counterparts.

Some people just like to bash first often without foundation or based on an absolute minority of fleet.
What I’ll say is that the bus wash seems to be the most unreliable piece of equipment where I work. When that fails we wash by pressure washer instead. Problem with that it takes around 20 mins to pressure wash compared to 2-3 mins per bus through the automatic wash. There isn’t the personnel resources to spend 10 times as long on each bus so only 1 in 10 buses gets washed each night when the was fails.
Stagecoach in Plymouth recently put an article in local media apologising for the length of time their wash had been broken, so it’s not just First who have reliability issues with their washes

 

[buscoaster]

Bus washes also freeze up on cold nights so there is no chance of cleaning them if that happens too - ours used to cut off at about 3 degrees to avoid the risk of freezing, so any night that was colder than that you would have no chance!

 

[SouthEastBuses]

Southdown to go ahead

Let's also not forget, around the same time, Dartline Coaches in Devon was also purchased by the Go Ahead Group. Seems that so many independents are being purchased by major groups which is quite a concern.

 

[GusB]

Could we stick to the topic of Ensign being acquired by First, please? Anything else is off-topic.

 

[Flange Squeal]

Ensignbus have posted the following on their Facebook page, confirming the date that First officially take over.

Next Thursday, 9th March will be the last day of Ensignbus ownership by the Newman family after 51 years!
After that we will be part of First Bus (the company will remain as Ensignbus).
We will be sad to see our founder, Peter Newman & his two sons Ross & Steve leave us. We have achieved some great things under their leadership and wisdom. Definitely time for a good old ‘knees up’!
All of us here wish the Newman family the very best for the future.
Interesting times await.
We will of course, continue to keep you updated on this and all future changes.

Source: https://www.facebook.com/EnsignBusCo/

 

[fgwrich]

So the resale side of the business could be an interesting one to come - Will any of the big groups continue to purchase from Ensign* being part of First, and will First use it to retail their own vehicles when they look to sell them on?

*Admittedly some of them don't (eg Stagecoach), but I think Go-Ahead has in the past?

 

[MotCO]

So the resale side of the business could be an interesting one to come - Will any of the big groups continue to purchase from Ensign* being part of First, and will First use it to retail their own vehicles when they look to sell them on?

*Admittedly some of them don't (eg Stagecoach), but I think Go-Ahead has in the past?

It used to be the case that groups cascaded buses within their own group, rather than acquire second hand acquisitions from other groups. However, over the last few years, this has not been the case so much.

Ensignbus have posted the following on their Facebook page, confirming the date that First officially take over.

We will be sad to see our founder, Peter Newman & his two sons Ross & Steve leave us.

I think that this is the first time it has been confirmed that the Newmans are leaving Ensignbus - I thought they may continue to work for them in some form.

 

[Wolfie]

I think that this is the first time it has been confirmed that the Newmans are leaving Ensignbus - I thought they may continue to work for them in some form.

I wonder if, like so many independent operators, some or all of them will reappear in a new guise?

I have to say, listening to a few Ensign staff last weekend, this is about as popular as a pork chop in a mosque.

 

[PG]

I wonder if, like so many independent operators, some or all of them will reappear in a new guise?

I'd be surprised if all would, given that Peter Newman is now 83, but you never know!