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May Timetable Change Sheffield Gainsborough Brigg to Cleethorpes

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Davedcraiglang

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Having looked at Northern Rail timetable for services via Brigg
One service each way Monday
to Friday no weekend service it seems to me Northern have no interest in the
Line and serving the community it's a
kick in the face for Lincolnshire people
and tourists trying to visit the area. This was a main line once from Sheffield to Grimsby except you have to travel through Doncaster, mind you DfT don't care except if you live in London.
 
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30907

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This was a main line once from Sheffield to Grimsby except you have to travel through Doncaster, mind you DfT don't care except if you live in London.
I suspect the inhabitants of Sheffield and Grimsby don't care which way they go either (so long as the train turns up, but that's another issue).

That effectively leaves Worksop, Gainsborough and Brigg to Cleethorpes and Brigg to Sheffield as the markets. Plus visitors to Brigg itself. Which is sadly very little to keep a railway line open from 0600-2200 (all the freight runs at night).

A minibus from Barnetby to Brigg (and on to Scunthorpe?) and from Doncaster to Worksop early evening would probably cater for the return flow from Cleethorpes.
 

Kite159

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Sadly I suspect that the daily Sheffield - Cleethorpes service will be the first to get cancelled if there is a shortage of units or staff. With Northern putting out a replacement taxi service for Brigg/Kirton Lindsey if required (passengers for Barnetby - Cleethorpes told to use TPE)
 

mocko

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For amusement value here's what happened when I asked Northern about the upcoming change. I wouldn't normally go to such lengths to publish something - it probably makes me look a bit nuts - but what's happened is proof of how low the attitude some TOCs have toward the public has sunk.

First they tried to deny it.

Then they had to admit the change was real, but said it was justified because it's more convenient to run trains on weekdays. At no point were the needs of the line's users mentioned, a factor that's apparently irrelevant to Northern. Their job, it seems, is simply to drive metal boxes full of air from Sheffield to Cleethorpes and back at the lowest cost to the DfT.

Then they tried to pretend a bus will replace the Saturday service. "Okay" I said, "if it's a railway-linked bus why isn't it in the timetable?"

Then Northern had to admit it wasn't their bus at all, and they didn't know when the service would commence. It might not be for months after the timetable change.

Later it emerged that the bus won't even go to Brigg! Either they were being "overoptimistic" or outright lying in the hope I'd give up and go away.

Then Northern claimed, absurdly, that withdrawing 100% of the well-loved Saturday service and replacing it with a useless one at weekday lunchtimes which renders all westbound journeys impossible is an "improvement".

Then, when I tried to argue, it simply deadlocked the complaint. Note that it never explained why it had initially promised, effusively, that no changes were in the pipeline when they most definitely were.

So why have I published this? I don't think anything is going to change, but I want Northern's mendacious behaviour - its denials, far-fetched excuses, bus-rustling and factually incorrect statements to be a matter of public record. It's not even about privatisation (Northern is state-owned) - more a damning indictment of how autocratic, self-serving and customer-hostile Britain's railway industry is capable of being when they think they'll get away with it.
 
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lyndhurst25

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A definite “closure by stealth” move. Can I ask what is happening to the Gainsborough Central to Sheffield shuttle service? I heard a rumour that is was also getting the chop (partly due to carpark issues at Gainsborough Central).
 

30907

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A definite “closure by stealth” move. Can I ask what is happening to the Gainsborough Central to Sheffield shuttle service? I heard a rumour that is was also getting the chop (partly due to carpark issues at Gainsborough Central).
The remaining services are withdrawn :(
 

mocko

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Another update on Northern: now it's making excuses to delay its response to my FOI request for information on how the decision to withdraw the timetable was reached. It's claiming mysterious "exceptions" may give cause to withold it, which isn't a valid response unless it states what they are within the first twenty working days.

I know the company has its defenders on here - but when you look at what it actually does when passengers try to hold it to account, the behaviour of its management is disgraceful. Maybe it's true that the DfT won't pay to run the line anymore - but if so it needs to come out and say it then follow the legal process for closure. Instead, it's made false denials to passengers and is now attempting to hush up how the decision was made.
 
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Failed Unit

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It is interesting that the Cleethorpes service is non-stop Sheffield - Worksop and the Lincoln - Sheffield services are not getting sped up as per the original plan when the stops would be moved to the Gainsborough - Sheffield services.

I remember when this service was a 3 times per day service - Monday - Saturday before British Rail cut it in the 1990s to Saturday only. I did use it as sometimes from Market Rasen it was the fastest way to Sheffield. I don't recall having many other passengers onboard between Barnetby and Gainsborough. (Not many people used to Gainsborough Central when it was more frequent as the service to Lea Road was more frequent)

But this really does seem a nothing service. The Saturday only service was also fairly useless but at least you could plan a day out with it. To be useful in my opinion you need at least 2 services per day (as it is not possible now to do anything going West) - Brigg - Meadowhall anyone?

With the current state of TPE, surely they could try a few more service and Orcats raid?

Just a general question, had the Sheffield - Gainsborough service survived, if they had extended it to Barnetby do people feel this would help the viability? The change would of course put people off - but I was think of a case of baby steps to solve the problem. Now that Sheffield - Gainsborough Central is gone it is academic. It would be interesting how much this change has saved? Maybe daily once per days is easier to keep the drivers knowledge upto date.
 

mocko

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Personally - as a user of the line - I'd say the 6tpd (or three out-and-back runs) on Saturday are a reasonable fit for it. In recent months since the service was restarted post-pandemic it's been loading well, I counted about 40 people on the last train of the day a couple of weeks ago.

Just a general question, had the Sheffield - Gainsborough service survived, if they had extended it to Barnetby do people feel this would help the viability?

I think passengers fit into four categories:
  • Locals for leisure/shopping - either in Sheffield or Cleethorpes/Grimsby
  • Locals starting/finishing long distance journeys
  • Enthusiasts - I meet a good few who've come for a nice day out and to see what it's like
  • People using it as an alternative to TPE's diabolical services (when you look at this in conjunction with TPE you can really see why people from North Lincolnshire would be furious with their local TOCs!)

Brigg and Kirton are never going to produce a lot of commuters. For that reason I don't think a Sheffield-Barnetby service on weekdays would have much value. If they wanted to pick up significant weekday passengers the way to do it would be offering an alternative to TPE's long-suffering passengers from Grimsby & Cleethorpes. I think there'd be a lot of mileage in Northern trying to hoover up some of them (wasn't privatisaion meant to be about competition?) but from Northern's recent actions, it seems doubtful that they've any interest in doing so.


But this really does seem a nothing service
Absolutely. Taking that kind-of-useful Saturday service and replacing it with something almost no-one can use is a huge blow for passengers. Northern can't have been unaware of this, which rather makes it look like a cynical attempt to drive people away so closure in a year or two can be justified. It's made all the worse by Northern's reluctance to publicise the change or its reasons - when I checked ten days ago it hadn't even put up posters at Brigg with the new timetable! Stealth closure indeed.


Maybe daily once per days is easier to keep the drivers knowledge upto date
My understanding - based upon what Northern admitted to me and what local groups have said - is that it saves on staff and units. This lunchtime out-and-back service on weekdays can use a crew between the morning and evening peaks that wouldn't otherwise be occupied. Northern also told me the new timetable would make it easier to maintain route knowledge - rather a case of the tail wagging the dog there, as the trains (and crews) are pointless unless they're at a time when people want to use them. I did try to point this out but they weren't interested.
 
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Adam0984

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Don't forget by running it once per day you only need 1 set of crew per day, the 3 runs on a Saturday needed 3 sets of crew so was harder to run all the trains. Hopefully it makes it more reliable if not more useless
 

Peterthegreat

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Another update on Northern: now it's making excuses to delay its response to my FOI request for information on how the decision to withdraw the timetable was reached. It's claiming mysterious "exceptions" may give cause to withold it, which isn't a valid response unless it states what they are within the first twenty working days.

I know the company has its defenders on here - but when you look at what it actually does when passengers try to hold it to account, the behaviour of its management is disgraceful. Maybe it's true that the DfT won't pay to run the line anymore - but if so it needs to come out and say it then follow the legal process for closure. Instead, it's made false denials to passengers and is now attempting to hush up how the decision was made.
I totally agree. I have seen some exchanges between members of the Brigg line user group and Northern It echos what you say.

Personally - as a user of the line - I'd say the 6tpd (or three out-and-back runs) on Saturday are a reasonable fit for it. In recent months since the service was restarted post-pandemic it's been loading well, I counted about 40 people on the last train of the day a couple of weeks ago.



I think passengers fit into four categories:
  • Locals for leisure/shopping - either in Sheffield or Cleethorpes/Grimsby
  • Locals starting/finishing long distance journeys
  • Enthusiasts - I meet a good few who've come for a nice day out and to see what it's like
  • People using it as an alternative to TPE's diabolical services (when you look at this in conjunction with TPE you can really see why people from North Lincolnshire would be furious with their local TOCs!)

Brigg and Kirton are never going to produce a lot of commuters. For that reason I don't think a Sheffield-Barnetby service on weekdays would have much value. If they wanted to pick up significant weekday passengers the way to do it would be offering an alternative to TPE's long-suffering passengers from Grimsby & Cleethorpes. I think there'd be a lot of mileage in Northern trying to hoover up some of them (wasn't privatisaion meant to be about competition?) but from Northern's recent actions, it seems doubtful that they've any interest in doing so.



Absolutely. Taking that kind-of-useful Saturday service and replacing it with something almost no-one can use is a huge blow for passengers. Northern can't have been unaware of this, which rather makes it look like a cynical attempt to drive people away so closure in a year or two can be justified. It's made all the worse by Northern's reluctance to publicise the change or its reasons - when I checked ten days ago it hadn't even put up posters at Brigg with the new timetable! Stealth closure indeed.



My understanding - based upon what Northern admitted to me and what local groups have said - is that it saves on staff and units. This lunchtime out-and-back service on weekdays can use a crew between the morning and evening peaks that wouldn't otherwise be occupied. Northern also told me the new timetable would make it easier to maintain route knowledge - rather a case of the tail wagging the dog there, as the trains (and crews) are pointless unless they're at a time when people want to use them. I did try to point this out but they weren't interested.
But there are no morning and evening peaks (now the Gainsborough Central service are withdrawn).
 

ChrisC

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But there are no morning and evening peaks (now the Gainsborough Central service are withdrawn).
Cutting the remaining peak time Gainsborough Central trains will be quite an inconvenience for passengers from Worksop and Retford. I have used them occasionally and found them quite busy, especially between Worksop and Sheffield. The 1654 departure from Sheffield was very well loaded when I used it a few weeks ago. For me they were the only trains of the day which provided a decent connection at Worksop from the Robin Hood Line for journeys to and from Sheffield.
 

Baxenden Bank

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Just to be controversial.

The May timetable could actually be advertised as a service improvement!
Currently 6 trains per week (3 each way on Saturday). From May 10 trains per week (1 each way Monday to Friday). Which I calculate as a 66% increase in service. Virtually unusable, but perhaps 2 hours in Grimsby is quite enough.
 

IanXC

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With the current state of TPE, surely they could try a few more service and Orcats raid?

RNP are not going to sanction paying one of their operators to raid revenue from their other operator. ORCATS raid is now entirely only relevant to DfT vs OA operations.
 

jessy

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Just to add, for Saturdays, Stagecoach are introducing bus service X90, not to sure of the full route as of yet. But only from Gainsborough to Cleethorpes
 

CaptainHaddock

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Just to be controversial.

The May timetable could actually be advertised as a service improvement!
Currently 6 trains per week (3 each way on Saturday). From May 10 trains per week (1 each way Monday to Friday). Which I calculate as a 66% increase in service. Virtually unusable, but perhaps 2 hours in Grimsby is quite enough.
It's an improvement for me - I'll be able to take my bike on the train from Sheffield to Cleethorpes and cycle back on a weekday!

That aside, I have some sympathy for @mocko - I had similar responses from Northern when I queried why there's a 90 minute gap on the Sheffield Barnsley stoppers in the evening followed by two trains 7 minutes apart. They basically admitted that their timetable is for the benefit of the train crew rather than their passengers!
 

PeterY

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I hope it runs on Monday 22nd, I intend to "bash" the line. I know I'm going to need a lot of luck. o_O
 

Old Yard Dog

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Bradford have just been relegated to the NPL - and one of the few upsides to look forward to was renewing my annual visits to Gainsborough Central which is very convenient for the Northolme. It's a long and tedious walk from Lea Road to the town centre and Gainsborough Trinity's football ground and the bus service is infrequent.
 

CaptainHaddock

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An inauspicious start to the new timetable; Northern's Sheffield-Cleethorpes service is cancelled in both directions due to a shortage of train crew.


 

mocko

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I intended to use this - train to Kirton and cycle back as there's no possible way of returning by train.

See the twitter thread for the odyssey I've embarked upon in trying to travel. My dad, who's 75 and less computer literate, is in the same boat over a (different) journey he wanted to make.

Northern refused to provide alternative transport until I quoted the PRO legislation at them, then grudgingly put on a 16-seater minibus but ignored the question over whether I can take my bike. Absent that, to get home on I'd presumably need to sleep on the platform at Kirton until the next train comes tomorrow! Having pressed the matter I'm now in an extended debate over DM with Northern over whether my (and my dad's) bikes have removable wheels to see if they might fit. Notably, Northern's website (which "encourages" the use of bikes) says nothing about them needing to have removable wheels.

Typical Northern Brigg Line experience - last minute cancellations, zero sh*ts about the passengers and the company tries to get away with breaking the rules by not providing alternative transport until threatened with the law.

Update: Northern has been dragged into sending a taxi which may, hopefully, have boot space for a bicycle I can use to get home on. Since I can't reach my 75 year old dad (whom like most 75 year old dads doesn't have his phone on) to find out whether his has removable wheels, Northern say they can't make any arrangements for him.

As a passenger in the north I am not feeling very leveled-up today.
 
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Llandudno

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I intended to use this - train to Kirton and cycle back as there's no possible way of returning by train.

See the twitter thread for the odyssey I've embarked upon in trying to travel. My dad, who's 75 and less computer literate, is in the same boat over a (different) journey he wanted to make.

Northern refused to provide alternative transport until I quoted the PRO legislation at them, then grudgingly put on a minibus but ignored the question over whether I can take my bike. Absent a bike to get home on I'd presumably need to sleep on the platform at Kirton until the next train comes tomorrow! Having pressed the matter I'm now in an extended debate over DM with Northern over whether my (and my dad's) bikes have removable wheels to see if they might fit in a 16-seater minibus. Notably, Northern's website (which "encourages" the use of bikes) says nothing about them needing to have removable wheels.

Typical Northern Brigg Line experience - last minute cancellations, zero sh*ts about the passengers and the company tries to get away with breaking the rules by not providing alternative transport until threatened with the law.

Update: Northern has been dragged into sending a taxi which may, hopefully, have boot space for a bicycle I can use to get home on. As I can't reach my 75 year old dad (whom like most 75 year old dads doesn't often have his phone on) to find out whether his has removable wheels, Northern say they can't make any arrangements for him. As a passenger in the north I am not feeling very leveled-up today.
This really needs exposing to the media, would make a great headline

75 year old pensioner’s train gets cancelled and told to wait in an unstaffed station bus shelter for the next train…24 hours later!

Mind you there is no guarantee that tomorrow’s train will operate either!

Perhaps Nationalisation of the rail network is not the panacea after all…?
 

mocko

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Mind you there is no guarantee that tomorrow’s train will operate either!
Mm, yes. Then since I've planned to be in Brigg this week to use the new service, Northern is going to find itself sending a good few taxis.


Perhaps Nationalisation of the rail network is not the panacea after all…?
After Northern's disgraceful behaviour over the change - its intiial denial, followed by misleading statements about a Saturday bus that will never go to Brigg and deadlocking my complaint with a refusal to explain - I've started to think it all comes down to attitude. Northern wanted to close the line (that's not just something I'm saying, see the material my FOI request turned up) and if an operator's heart isn't in it, they'll never provide a desirable service.

As a counterpoint it's worth looking at some of the other OLR franchises. While far from perfect, in my interactions with those (eg. LNER) I get the sense that they see their job as running trains, not finding reasons not to. So the public/private debate is orthogonal to that.
 

Peterthegreat

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Mm, yes. Then since I've planned to be in Brigg this week to use the new service, Northern is going to find itself sending a good few taxis.



After Northern's disgraceful behaviour over the change - its intiial denial, followed by misleading statements about a Saturday bus that will never go to Brigg and deadlocking my complaint with a refusal to explain - I've started to think it all comes down to attitude. Northern wanted to close the line (that's not just something I'm saying, see the material my FOI request turned up) and if an operator's heart isn't in it, they'll never provide a desirable service.

As a counterpoint it's worth looking at some of the other OLR franchises. While far from perfect, in my interactions with those (eg. LNER) I get the sense that they see their job as running trains, not finding reasons not to. So the public/private debate is orthogonal to that.
Absolutely agree. The Northern Rail Journey check website shows the return service from Cleethorpes cancelled (correct). Passengers advised to take the next Northern Service....
 

mocko

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Today it actually ran. I don't know if photos are welcome but on a rare positive note, let me present to you the lesser-spotted Brigg line train.

I'd say the eastbound one had 20 passengers by Brigg - most seemingly using it to reach Grimsby/Cleethorpes as an alternative to TPE. Given yesterday's inauspicious start and the inconconvenient time it runs that's a not a bad load.

photo_2023-05-23_19-38-00.jpg

While planning my next journey on Brigg's one-train-per-day service I've noticed an oddity (mods, you may want to split this off into a new thread). Northern is still selling various Day Returns for westbound journeys. Given the first service of the day travels east, then returns west, a west-then-returning-east journey cannot be made.

This means Northern is selling tickets (e.g. Off-Peak Day Return Brigg-Sheffield @ £17.90) for a journey that's physically impossible by train.

What would happen if I bought one of these and used it? Presumably by selling it, Northern is forming a contract to get me from Brigg to Sheffield and back within a day. Would I be within my rights to go to Sheffield then, as Northern has no train to get me home on, insist on a hotel for the night or conveyance by other means under the Passenger Rights & Obligations law?

The following is what happened. It was meant to be a separate post but the forum has automerged them.

---


In the spirit of scientific investigation your intrepid Lincolnshire correspondent set out yesterday to answer the question "what happens when you buy a Day Return from a station that only sees one train a day".

Brigg - Penistone off peak, £14.10, leaving on the 11:07 changing at Barnetby & Meadowhall. As for returning - well, leaving Penistone at 19:43 would get me back as far as Barnetby. After that heaven knows. Maybe a long walk. Surely as Northern had listed the ticket for sale it'd have a plan? I wondered if it'd seen the insanity of running a service that's practically useless for return journeys and quietly put on a minibus from Barnetby in the evening to improve things.

The first four miles with Northern, to Barnetby, went well. Despite the unreliability if the service and impossibility for many of returning, 30ish passengers on (where on earth are they all going? Do they carry on into the sea at Cleethorpes and swim away?) Perhaps the nice weather and coverage in the railway press have drawn them out.

Arrived at Barnetby to find... the next two TPE trains in a row to Sheffield were cancelled. Such very TPE. Naturally its "not in service" route learner was fine, the beefy 68 rumbling away in the platform for a while then rocketing off to Cleethorpes to taunt delayed passengers by collecting five more carriages of fresh sea air.

I'll give TPE this: unlike Northern's initial refusal to provide alternative transport for stranded passengers when it canceled the inaugural service on Monday, the nice lady on their help point (which kept cutting out) didn't quibble and immediately set about getting a taxi. It took a while to come so she kindly arranged for it to go all the way to Penistone. I suppose if you work for TPE you'll have a lot of practice at ordering taxis but still, seeing a TOC in the Midlands do the right thing without having to be made to was a breath of fresh air.

On the way to Penistone I tweeted Northern to enquire how my Day Return journey from Brigg was to be achieved. As most conversations with Northern seem to involve reminding it of the industry's rules I pointed out early on what the NRCoT says about its sale of a ticket forming a contract it now had to honour.

What ensued was four hours of head-scratching, "we need to refer that to someone else", "we'll get back to you" and at one point, disbelief that such a fare existed on the system and a request for a picture of the ticket.

Enlivened by these interactions the afternoon was passed on a hike down the old Woodhead route, now turned into the Trans-Pennine Trail (thankfully no relation to TPE). It's gorgeous at this time of year and so long as you have good boots, it's actually easier to travel on closed railway lines up here than open ones. Here are some pictures. Probably better enjoyed when you're not checking your phone every five minutes to find out whether you're going to be stranded, though.

By 5pm I was getting tired of Northern, who now seemed to be trying to ignore me. "Sort it out" I told them. Then came incomprehension as they appeared to believe I was complaining about my ticket being a spent Advance, even though I'd already sent them a picture of it clearly showing the words "Off-Peak Day Return". After several more terse tweets Northern finally seemed to realise something was wrong. "Phone us up" it said. Why it couldn't have said this six hours earlier, I don't know.

So I did, and after 15 minutes on hold I got through to someone who knew what he was doing and seemed interested. Initially astonished at the existence of an Impossible Day Return (who wouldn't be), he acknowledged the reality of the situation and went away to investigate what should happen. He might reasonably have said "use TPE to get as far as Barnetby" but by this point, hilariously, TPE had cancelled the train back from Sheffield as well.

"You might do better to call us up than contact the twitter team when you need help" he opined. While true (he was undeniably much better at his job) I feel this overlooks the fact that an increasing number of people want to contact Northern through digital means and it should provide good service however they reached it. Also, any conversation with Northern needs to be kept in writing as evidence for the inevitable complaint.

After more calls the plan Northern eventually arrived at was the 20:43 PNS-SHF (which is a beautiful journey on a summer evening) then a Northern-funded taxi all the way back to Brigg. Minicab drivers along the North Lincolnshire routes are having an absolute bonanza this year. "Be sure to tell everyone you know that train companies will buy them taxi rides" one recently said.

So, what have we learned:
  • Northern has messed up the fare structure for the Brigg line so monumentally badly that it'll sell you a ticket then tell you it doesn't think it exists
  • The simple, low-cost measure of a minibus to meet an evening TPE service and go BTB-KTL-GNB would do a great deal to improve our options and render the Impossible Day Return possible. Naturally Northern has not done this.
  • Getting Northern to honour its obligations is really, really hard but can be done
  • Its social media "assistance" team (the same one who promised me in March no changes were planned for the line) are diabolically bad at their job, often seemingly trying to ignore you so you'll give up. I don't know why but it needs to be fixed. Most passengers are going to be contacting them like this nowadays and with the closure of ticket offices it'll only increase
  • It's a huge challenge to get anywhere by train from north Lincolnshire, requiring determination, persistence, stout walking boots, basic legal skills and extreme masochism.
  • But when you succeed it brings a massive sense of achievement. They should hand out badges. "I completed trains on insane difficulty" they would say.
  • It actually was possible to make a return journey from Brigg, though I fear Northern is now scrambling to remove the fare from the system

Since TPE's evening cancellation delayed the journey home by an hour, for my next odyssey through the railway's deranged bureaucracy I need to figure out how much delay repay is due for an impossible journey on a train that doesn't exist that had to be replaced with the second sixty-mile taxi ride of the day, and convince someone to pay me it. Fun times.

PS. As I write this Northern has just announced it's once again cancelled all trains due to shortage of traincrew. That's two days out of the first four - so much for an "improved" service!
 
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Baxenden Bank

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In the spirit of scientific investigation your intrepid Lincolnshire correspondent set out yesterday to answer the question "what happens when you buy a Day Return from a station that only sees one train a day".

"You might do better to call us up than contact the twitter team when you need help" he opined. While undeniably true (he was undeniably much better at his job) I feel this overlooks the fact that an increasing number of people want to contact Northern through digital means and it should provide good service to people however they reached it. Also, any conversation with Northern needs to be kept in writing as evidence for the inevitable complaint.

So, what have we learned:
  • Northern has messed up the fare structure for the Brigg line so monumentally badly that it'll sell you a ticket then tell you it doesn't think it exists
  • Getting Northern to honour its obligations is really, really hard but can be done
  • Its social media "assistance" team (the same one who promised me in March no changes were planned for the line) are diabolically bad at their job, often seemingly trying to ignore you so you'll give up. I don't know why but it needs to be fixed. Most passengers are going to he contacting them via this medium nowadays and with the closure of ticket offices it'll only increase
  • It actually was possible to make a return journey from Brigg, though I fear Northern is now scrambling to remove the fare from the system

PS. As I write this Northern has just announced it's once again cancelled all trains due to shortage of traincrew. That's two days out of the first four - so much for an "improved" service!
The ticket is a throwback to when it was possible, on a Saturday only, to make a return journey the same day. I guess the fares simply haven't caught up with the service changes. One solution is to remove the tickets from sale, perhaps meanwhile ensuring that none of the trains operate so as to prevent 'innocent travellers' being potentially stranded. An alternative would be to issue a ticket easement allowing such tickets to be used on the first train the following day (Monday if bought on a Friday, overnight accommodation at the travellers expense).

It would be possible to buy (in advance or at the time of travel) a day return ticket and use it on the last outward service for any journey on the network, but would people then expect to be provided with return travel? Your unique situation is that there are no return journeys at all due to the very limited service.

Social media is a much more convenient way of contacting companies. It is immediate and more traditional methods can be a futile, or at least frustrating, experience - how many companies provide a comprehensive response to postal letters or emails? How many still publish telephone numbers (unless premium rate). I feel many organisations see social media as a good way of getting their message out to a large audience (which it is) without anticipating, or putting resources/procedures in place to deal with incoming messages.
 

Llandudno

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25 Dec 2014
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2,225
Howabout a permanent rail replacement bus from Gainsborough to Grimsby every 2 hours, 7 days a week connecting with Sheffield trains.

Through ticketing, advertised connections and showing on all journey planners?
 

CaptainHaddock

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10 Feb 2011
Messages
2,222
Howabout a permanent rail replacement bus from Gainsborough to Grimsby every 2 hours, 7 days a week connecting with Sheffield trains.

Through ticketing, advertised connections and showing on all journey planners?
Pretty pointless because there isn't much demand for travel between Gainsborough and Grimsby; if there was a bus company it would already be running such a service.

The only service that would realistically be popular on the Sheffield-Cleethorpes via Brigg line would be a summer saturday service for holidaymakers say, for example, three trains a day in each direction. I wonder if anyone's suggested that to Northern?
 

PeterY

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Joined
2 Apr 2013
Messages
1,319
Those of us who remember the first May Day Holiday are in a minority.

An inauspicious start to the new timetable; Northern's Sheffield-Cleethorpes service is cancelled in both directions due to a shortage of train crew.


I had intended to travel over this line on Monday (22nd May) but the train was cancelled at short notice at Sheffield. I was using a North East 4 in 8 days rover. I doubt it'd be worth the effort of delay repay because I just jumped on another train. At least the Leeds to Goole ran. (Another awkward line).

I then made a plan "B" and caught it from Grimsby to Sheffield on Tuesday (22nd May) so. at least for me, the line was bashed. :D :D

On the whole, Monday 22nd May there were so many cancellations overall, including Trans Pennine excuse express.
 
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