'Night Riviera' cancellations

[williamn]

Of course there are lots of marginal Tory/Lib Dem constituencies in the South West - dropping the sleeper would not be a positive news story in the run up to the election.

 

[railfan99]

Referring to patronage, currently almost every berth booked out. Still plans for G exam on locos (not 312) and C6 for coaching stock. Also the pre covid plan to increase to 5 SLEP mon to Thurs with 6 on fri/sun is still being talked about. The service is safe, makes a profit and the 57/mk3 combo will be around for years yet.

Very pleasing!

 

[FGW_DID]

I often wonder, with so much expertise on these forum, why todays railways seem to be in such a state?

 

[railfan99]

Enjoy your trip here.

Thanks. Last year, I coped with two rail strike days: one hopes there aren't more. Grand Central 'rescued' me by providing a train from Bradford Interchange to London on the day I was meeting my better half at Heathrow.

In a worst case, maybe in UK one can't resort to 'sleeping' on a platform as stations like Crewe may 'close' for a few hours until 0400 or 0500. No such problems in Norway a few years ago when I was unable to book last minute accommodation due to a special event (of which I was unaware) and had to stay in the waiting room on a Saturday night. And never any problems in India!

The latter know the cost of everything & the value of nothing.

Sadly typical of many bureaucrats and politicians worldwide.

Hopefully in the case of 'Night Riviera' some have used it, or at least their families and friends, and have been complimentary about it. That helps in the battle to retain it, notwithstanding present cancellations.

 

[Horizon22]

I often wonder, with so much expertise on these forum, why todays railways seem to be in such a state?

Because such people are generally not politicians or senior leaders. There's sometimes some idealism here which doesn't appreciate the constraints that have to be worked within or because there's lot of people very good in their individual areas but that is struggled to be brought cohesively together.

 

[Deafdoggie]

I haven't travelled by train for a few years, but am getting the sleeper from Penzance to London in a couple of weeks. Only booked it last week and was expecting to have to have seats as berths would be sold out, but berths available and I'm actually in coach D, they used to book coaches in alphabetical order, so if they still do it's certainly no where near full.

 

[co-tr-paul]

I haven't travelled by train for a few years, but am getting the sleeper from Penzance to London in a couple of weeks. Only booked it last week and was expecting to have to have seats as berths would be sold out, but berths available and I'm actually in coach D, they used to book coaches in alphabetical order, so if they still do it's certainly no where near full.

Not booked out like that anymore since the adoption no longer having a fixed formation. Any berth can now be a double or single. It is possible you have a contingency berth of which there are a couple in D including the easy access berth.

 

[Deafdoggie]

Not booked out like that anymore since the adoption no longer having a fixed formation. Any berth can now be a double or single. It is possible you have a contingency berth of which there are a couple in D including the easy access berth.

That would make more sense. There are two of us and it offered a choice of two adjacent singles or one twin. If they aren't fixed single/twin then we could have had the last two!

 

[williamn]

There's an article in this months Modern Railway that mentions locomotive replacements. No indication that the service is to be done away with.

 

[co-tr-paul]

The 57s are having a G Exam rebuild. Nothing on market that meets power/loading gauge restrictions/emissions .

 

[irish_rail]

The 57s are having a G Exam rebuild. Nothing on market that meets power/loading gauge restrictions/emissions .

Good news.

 

[NEDdrv]

Union militancy is the reason this has dragged on for a year plus?

Oh of course it is!
Not the Government refusing the industry talks with the union for the entirety of 2022.

Then the first 'Rail Delivery Group' offer (with loads of strings attached) in January 2023 still with no talks taking place.
Imagine a union wanting discussions? Outragous! The militancy!


Then talks did did place (which were supposedly going well), but then a second offer was made which was worse than the first one.

So just to recap - there's been only two offers during this dispute. The second was worse than the first one, and the first one was made without there being any talks.

ASLEF are so militant aren't they?!


They won't accept changes to working practises because they are so militant!

Oh hang on....

Changes to working practises will be taking place at Transport for Wales, within a negotiated pay deal.


They are so militant and greedy. Oh hang on again...

Below inflation pay deals have taken place at all the Freight Operating Companies, all the Open Access Operators, Merseyrail, London Overground, and Elizabeth Line.


Yes, it must be absolutely ASLEF's fault that for an entire year of the dispute they were being militant by being available for talks.

And it must be ASLEF's fault that they won't accept changes to working practises - except they have; and be ASLEF's fault that they won't accept a below RPI increase because they are greedy - except they have.


Only the government could lump in different companies, with pay anniversaries falling in different months ranging from January to October (so inflation was at different rates in each month), different rates of pay, different terms and conditions, and expect a 'one size fits all' meshing of Terms and conditions and one woeful payrise to accept it.

Drop the strings and I reckon it would go through.

Negotiate over the strings properly, like Transport for Wales did, and the railway can move forwards.

This continued protraction is entirely the government's doing.

Probably the best post I’ve seen anywhere. The truth is hard to refute when it’s put so well

 

[father_jack]

And right on cue the other "nasty" union is trying to save the sleeper also..........

9 August 2023


To: Branches, Regional Councils & Regional Offices


Dear colleague

NIGHT RIVIERA SLEEPER SERVICE – GREAT WESTERN RAILWAY

Our Penzance No1 Branch recently submitted the following resolution for consideration by your National Executive Committee:

“Penzance No.1 Branch is deeply concerned that that GWR are cancelling the Night Riviera sleeper train for any minor reason.

They cancel it when there is engineering work where they could simply amend the route/timing of the train. Over a 100-days are planned this winter for the same.

They cancel it when there is an overtime ban.

This was regarded as high-priority service and the branch thinks that these actions will lead to the sleeper becoming unviable.

Furthermore, the rolling stock is 1970’s MKIII slam door, the engines are class 57 – all coming to the end of their natural life without investment are approaching the G exams, with no apparent plan in place.

Scotland have invested in new sleeper rolling stock, the concern remains is that the DFT/GWR and trying to line up to cancel the train permanently by stealth.

We call upon the General Secretary and the EC to consider all strategies and industrial measures possible to raise the profile of the sleeper to try and counteract these threats, which we think are real to our members jobs.”

The NEC has considered the matter and noted that a meeting has taken place of the Full Time Officer, On Trains Divisional Council Secretary and Penzance No.1 Branch Secretary, as well as the NEC member for the South West of England to consider this matter.

The meeting discussed what is clearly a managed decline of this critical service by GWR, with the planned cancellation of 104 days going into the winter and identified 30 members of staff that are directly affected by the continuous cancellation of services, comprising of Customer Hosts and Engineers based in Penzance Long Rock and Reading Depots.


It was also noted that there has been significant investment locally by Cornwall Country Council to upgrade the facilities which has highlighted the importance of this service for the region.

Your NEC has therefore instructed me to:

• Initiate a campaign ‘Save Our Sleeper’
• Consider raising an Early Day Motion (EDM) via our RMT Parliamentary Group
• Formulate a template that can be shared amongst our members to lobby their local MPs and Councillors
• Produce fresh propaganda for this campaign
• Organise a meeting and demonstration at our Penzance location with media and press invites
• Raise this issue through the collective bargaining machinery within GWR and seek assurances from the company on the future of this service

I am currently acting on these instructions and will keep you advised of any further developments on this matter as they arise. In the meantime, I would be grateful if you could distribute the contents of this circular to your members.

Yours sincerely

Michael Lynch
General Secretary

 

[williamn]

The same Modern Railways article I mentioned above makes the valid point that the stock doesn't yet need replacing because they're the youngest Mk3 builds that there are, and they have done comparatively very little milage, given they do just one run a day.

 

[co-tr-paul]

Also getting C6 soon....

 

[43096]

And right on cue the other "nasty" union is trying to save the sleeper also..........

The usual lack of self awareness we’ve come to expect from the union. Biggest threat to the sleeper is the actions of the unions.

 

[irish_rail]

The usual lack of self awareness we’ve come to expect from the union. Biggest threat to the sleeper is the actions of the unions.

The Riviera is safe. Its consistently well used and there is no talk of it going. Certainly safer than the Edinburgh/ Glasgow sleeper id say...

 

[JamieL]

The Riviera is safe. Its consistently well used and there is no talk of it going. Certainly safer than the Edinburgh/ Glasgow sleeper if say...

...if say what?

 

[irish_rail]

...if say what?

Corrected

 

[Surreytraveller]

The Riviera is safe. Its consistently well used and there is no talk of it going. Certainly safer than the Edinburgh/ Glasgow sleeper id say...

Well used and no talk of it going does not mean its safe

 

[dk1]

Well used and no talk of it going does not mean its safe

Nothing in life is guaranteed or safe.

 

[irish_rail]

Nothing in life is guaranteed or safe.

Of course but in the grand scheme of things this one would be pretty unlikely to be axed.

 

[dk1]

Of course but in the grand scheme of things this one would be pretty unlikely to be axed.

Oh yes of course. The MD said as much in the MR interview this month. Long may the west of England beds continue.

 

[irish_rail]

Oh yes of course. The MD said as much in the MR interview this month. Long may the west of England beds continue.

Indeed. The vast majority travel to St Erth or Penzance, which by daytime train take over 5 hours, which puts it strongly in the territory of worthy of an overnight option.

 

[trebor79]

Indeed. The vast majority travel to St Erth or Penzance, which by daytime train take over 5 hours, which puts it strongly in the territory of worthy of an overnight option.

I've used it for business reasons a few time to St Austell. There's a leisure centre not far from the station which is open early and good for a shower and swim to wake up.

 

[irish_rail]

I've used it for business reasons a few time to St Austell. There's a leisure centre not far from the station which is open early and good for a shower and swim to wake up.

Even St Austell from London takes longer than London to Glasgow. Too be fair a few get off at Truro as well.

 

[800301]

1C50 is being operated with 800319 tonight

 

[Benjwri]

1C50 is being operated with 800319 tonight

How did that happen? Total failure of the rake of coaches or something? Going to be some very unhappy passengers who won't get a sleep tonight.

 

[Bill57p9]

1A50 seems to be losing time fairly rapidly, which doesn’t inspire confidence.
Both directions routed via Yeovil too.

 

[BJames]

1C50 is being operated with 800319 tonight

Has the sleeper been switched out for standard rolling stock before? Anyone know the last time if so?

Better than a cancellation - not ideal though!