Class 701 'Aventra' trains for South Western Railway

[Towers]

my mistake.

Well, clearly they are “in service” today, by they’ll very swiftly be not in service again! It’ll be some while yet I would think, assuming the statements about there being no driver training plan in place etc are true.

 

[Samzino]

ABDO wouldn’t have made a difference to the need for a guard to reopen the doors quickly during dispatch, there will still be a system for this but it’ll be the awfully time consuming method of sending very long buzzer codes up and down the train.

ABDO was part of the reason aswell as this was mainly supposed to be the drivers responsibility to release doors by design if need be

Total Length Of 701/0 = 203.11 m
Total Length Of 2x5car 458 = 203.68 m(+1m tolerance)

Shouldn't be longer, the whole point of the revised cab design compared to other Aventras was to enable them to fit in the existing platform lengths and have the doors in a similar position to the 458s, even when it's 2x 5car 701s coupled together

 

[Towers]

ABDO was part of the reason aswell as this was mainly supposed to be the drivers responsibility to release doors by design if need be

Indeed, that’s where the disappointing element comes in! If the capability exists, even if it isn’t used, for a guard to be dispatching and closing the doors, then they should have the ability to re-release them during dispatch if necessary.

As an example, on some Hitachi 80x/IET stock the driver alone has control of door release, including SDO requirements, via the TMS, however a guard is still able to reopen them during dispatch if they need to. Hitting the release buttons from a guards’ panel will re-release whatever was opened in the first place, be that the full train or just part of it if SDO was used. This really ought to be a standard system now, anything else is poor by comparison.

 

[Samzino]

Indeed, that’s where the disappointing element comes in! If the capability exists, even if it isn’t used, for a guard to be dispatching and closing the doors, then they should have the ability to re-release them during dispatch if necessary.

As an example, on some Hitachi 80x/IET stock the driver alone has control of door release, including SDO requirements, via the TMS, however a guard is still able to reopen them during dispatch if they need to. Hitting the release buttons from a guards’ panel will re-release whatever was opened in the first place, be that the full train or just part of it if SDO was used. This really ought to be a standard system now, anything else is poor by comparison.

Agreed. It's cost cutting and laziness I've seen with some approaches like the 701s for example.

 

[D7666]

Did it Waterloo > Richmond, then had to leave it to head off to work.

Claire Mann in person came and chatted with my group for a while; one of our lot got in on a BBC South TV interview

 

[markle]

Took a ride on my way in to London this morning.

Overall very nice but my goodness those seats feel like a downgrade compared to the 455s. The 455s have a ~2 inch spacer between the window seat and the sidewall, and another 2 inch spacer between each seat.

No such spacers on the 701. Window seats are very cramped and even for my relatively modest frame I can't sit comfortably without spilling over onto the other seat.

A real shame on what is otherwise a big improvement.

 

[Kite159]

Another case of '3-1+2' style seating with no spacers between the seats creating a wide aisle which no doubt will be full of people overhanging the seats when busy?

 

[swt_passenger]

Another case of '3-1+2' style seating with no spacers between the seats creating a wide aisle which no doubt will be full of people overhanging the seats when busy?

Yes, this has been known about since it was first discussed in this thread over 4 years ago…

 

[Robbouk]

I had a trip from Clapham Jct to Waterloo on the return leg. A huge improvement over the current local/metro rolling stock. Nice that the PIS at Clapham Jct annouced the service as an "SWR Arterio service to Waterloo".

 

[Goldfish62]

Another case of '3-1+2' style seating with no spacers between the seats creating a wide aisle which no doubt will be full of people overhanging the seats when busy?

Not exactly a revelation. We've known all along they'd be like this as that's what the DfT wants (it specifies a minimum gangway width).

 

[H&I]

Here are a few photos of the first Class 701 train in passenger service! I have recorded a video of the full return journey and will be uploading to YouTube shortly.

 

[traji00]

On return at Waterloo:

 

[OneTrackMinded]

Does anyone have all the RTT services for the 701 today? If so do you mind posting them here, thank you

 

[markle]

Not exactly a revelation. We've known all along they'd be like this as that's what the DfT wants (it specifies a minimum gangway width).

Apologies for not seeing it in the 247 pages in this thread!

They do seem to be even closer together than the seats on the Thameslink 700s.

There's a lot to like with the class 701 - especially in terms of capacity / performance / climate control. But as someone who'll be using them regularly, the seats are a bit of a let down and I'll at least miss that aspect of the 455s.

 

[Goldfish62]

Apologies for not seeing it in the 247 pages in this thread!

Not in this thread but there have been plenty of photos of the interiors since 2019!

They do seem to be even closer together than the seats on the Thameslink 700s.

I believe that's because the cushions are slightly wider.

 

[Vanmanyo]

Honestly when I went I them the seats weren't too bad. They are ironing boards but for the short journeys they aren't woeful at all

 

[Goldfish62]

There's a lot to like with the class 701 - especially in terms of capacity / performance / climate control. But as someone who'll be using them regularly, the seats are a bit of a let down and I'll at least miss that aspect of the 455s.

To be honest I think the seats were always going to be a let down given the trend in recent years. If as has been intimated it's also running tomorrow I shall find out for myself...

 

[H&I]

Despite the very short notice, many people were on the inaugural return journey. There was actually quite a significant number of train enthusiasts, with some boarding mid-way suggesting that they could not make it to Waterloo in time.

Whilst I did see Geoff Marshall at Waterloo, I did not see him onboard, so I don’t know if there will be a full video coming out. I also didn’t see JenOnTheMove or any of the other transport YouTubers, either.

 

[DMckduck97]

A lot of what I've read is "This guy from Staines", "I've heard this date being bounced around", never "So the date in my own brief is this". What's even more shocking is people on this forum encouraging somebody to board a unit despite it not even being on a passenger-carrying headcode. We don't know when it will run, nor can we force the first passenger carrying run to happen.

How poetic after this crusade that it turned out half the crew on the first one in service only a day later was Staines crew haha...

 

[Winthorpe]

Apologies for not seeing it in the 247 pages in this thread!

Please read all messages in the thread before posting

 

[H&I]

Honestly when I went I them the seats weren't too bad. They are ironing boards but for the short journeys they aren't woeful at all

I thought the seats were alright, but I didn’t sit for long as I was changed my location throughout the journey to get a good feel of the train. However, there is a lot more standing room, perfect for the metro-style suburban services these trains are going to run on.

 

[43066]

Another case of '3-1+2' style seating with no spacers between the seats creating a wide aisle which no doubt will be full of people overhanging the seats when busy?

And your suggestion for a train designed for high density commuter operations would be what? Narrow aisles, stuffed with too many seats, that leaves people behind on platforms?

 

[swr444]

How poetic after this crusade that it turned out half the crew on the first one in service only a day later was Staines crew haha...

I did say, but alas 43004 didn't want to believe. Also the previous dates which I had mentioned were also the original plan but things change at the last minute as we saw.

 

[norbitonflyer]

Does anyone have all the RTT services for the 701 today? If so do you mind posting them here, thank you

That's it for public services today. Just the one round trip.

 

[leshuttle]

No chance I'll have time to try one out this week. About as close as I'll probably get to seeing the 701s any time soon with a handful at Wimbledon depot.

 

[H&I]

I did say, but alas 43004 didn't want to believe. Also the previous dates which I had mentioned were also the original plan but things change at the last minute as we saw.

Don't worry, I did believe in you! Whilst I did waste a few hours on Friday and Monday going to Waterloo to see if the train would turn up, it was totally worth being able to ride the first Class 701 Arterio train in passenger service!

 

[norbitonflyer]

And your suggestion for a train designed for high density commuter operations would be what? Narrow aisles, stuffed with too many seats, that leaves people behind on platforms?

But a seat that is too narrow to sit in is a waste of space. And if you can only sit in it sideways, with your legs sticking out into the aisle, that part of the aisle is not available for standing passengers.

The seats are better than those in the 455s and 707s though

 

[CarrotPie]

And if you can only sit in it sideways, with your legs sticking out into the aisle, that part of the aisle is not available for standing passengers.

Do the DafT box-tickers care though?

 

[43066]

But a seat that is too narrow to sit in is a waste of space. And if you can only sit in it sideways, with your legs sticking out into the aisle, that part of the aisle is not available for standing passengers.

The seats are better than those in the 455s and 707s though

Well that’s true, but that’s why you put in fewer of them! Wide aisles is a strange thing to be complaining about on a train performing the role these will be.

Compare the seating arrangements in the 700s with that of the Networkers, for example.

 

[H&I]

One thing I was wondering about is whether longitudinal seating would have made sense on these trains. After all, some longitudinal seating has been retrofitted onto the Class 455s.