Euston overcrowding

[Bald Rick]

But the issue here isn't so much about having exits outside the main line station but only having exits outside the main line station.

Like at Victoria, Cannon St, & Fenchurch St.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Like at Victoria, Cannon St, & Fenchurch St.

Victoria is technically outside but I think still under the outer canopy and is straight in front of you with no double back needed, so it isn't quite the same.

Cannon St will have hardly any onward Tube travel, most people are going into the City and will choose Victoria services if going elsewhere (indeed if I recall the Tube station formerly wasn't open Sundays at all and possibly not Saturdays either, I forget). Fenchurch St is just an oddity with no direct Tube connection at all.

 

[AF91]

But the issue here isn't so much about having exits outside the main line station but only having exits outside the main line station.

But Euston has two other exits that are within the station; the one to the suburban platforms and the stairs up to next to the booking office.

 

[Roy Badami]

What's with some services shown as boarding having the platform number flash up for a couple of seconds and then disappear for 5 seconds.? You have to be staring at the departure boards for quite a long while to be sure of seeing that there's a platform number displayed.

Also, when they do flash up, they seem to be sometimes, randomly, greyed out to various degrees. At their faintest, I imagine passengers with poor eyesight may have difficulty reading them ...

 

[Dr Hoo]

But Euston has two other exits that are within the station; the one to the suburban platforms and the stairs up to next to the booking office.

The latter with the only lifts.

 

[Roy Badami]

What's with some services shown as boarding having the platform number flash up for a couple of seconds and then disappear for 5 seconds.? You have to be staring at the departure boards for quite a long while to be sure of seeing that there's a platform number displayed.

Also, when they do flash up, they seem to be sometimes, randomly, greyed out to various degrees. At their faintest, I imagine passengers with poor eyesight may have difficulty reading them ...

To follow up on my own post, I can see that an intermediate semi-suppressed platform status (i.e. platform technically announced, but deliberately hard to notice/read on the boards) could help reduce the intensity of the rush for the platforms.

But what I noticed this evening is that some trains remained semi-suppressed right up to departure - I fear this will cause some people to fail to notice the platform has been called and potentially miss their trains.

I'm particularly concerned about the use of low-contrast fonts that make the platform numbers sometimes potentially hard to read. If this is intentional, I hope someone's done an equalities impact analysis on this because it seems potentially problematic to me.

 

[modernrail]

But Euston has two other exits that are within the station; the one to the suburban platforms and the stairs up to next to the booking office.

But there are clearly not intended nor have the capacity to be the main or even a significant entrance or exit.

Whilst the change in the configuration of the tube entrance, in its current form, is just silly - it is all fair to say that the whole tube station set up at Euston is sub-optimal.

Most other stations the size of Euston do have multiple proper scale entrances and exits and yes some of them bypass the train station bit completely,

The ticket hall itself is also pretty poor in terms of design and people movement. Did it go in with its current design at the same time as the current main station?

 

[Bald Rick]

Did it go in with its current design at the same time as the current main station?

The ticket hall is where it has always been, if that’s what you mean.

 

[ScottGallagher]

But there are clearly not intended nor have the capacity to be the main or even a significant entrance or exit.

Whilst the change in the configuration of the tube entrance, in its current form, is just silly - it is all fair to say that the whole tube station set up at Euston is sub-optimal.

Most other stations the size of Euston do have multiple proper scale entrances and exits and yes some of them bypass the train station bit completely,

The ticket hall itself is also pretty poor in terms of design and people movement. Did it go in with its current design at the same time as the current main station?

The ticket hall was nicer back in the 90s when it was a travel centre, so all desks behind glass, very different design altogether but would struggle now so I guess that's why it was changed.

 

[waveyswirley]

What's with some services shown as boarding having the platform number flash up for a couple of seconds and then disappear for 5 seconds.? You have to be staring at the departure boards for quite a long while to be sure of seeing that there's a platform number displayed.

Also, when they do flash up, they seem to be sometimes, randomly, greyed out to various degrees. At their faintest, I imagine passengers with poor eyesight may have difficulty reading them ...

I've noticed this too and find it absolutely maddening

 

[Harpo]

Like Fenchurch St.

If only Fenchurch St had a LU station at all. Only those who know of the Coopers Row exit would consider that requirement to be almost met by the proximity of Tower Hill.

Those exitting through Fenchurch Sts main concourse get to choose a decent walk to Tower Hill, Bank or Aldgate although C2C very disingenuously insists that Liverpool Street is ‘a short walk away’ whenever it diverts there!

 

[CyrusWuff]

Felt like the issue had shifted from Euston to Liverpool Street this evening, with platforms for services on the West Anglia side only being announced two or three minutes before departure. London Overground staff were still dispatching their services on time though, resulting in people missing trains.

 

[Russel]

I used Euston last Friday evening and my Avanti service was advertised 15 minutes prior to departure...

Either things are starting to improve, or I got lucky!

 

[modernrail]

I saw on another thread that guards at Euston load the reservations.l rather than station staff. Thinking about it, I have boarded trains at Euston with reservations still loading more than at any other terminus long distance station.

Is this correct I wonder and if so could this be another source of delays in getting the doors open and starting boarding? As in, train ready, cleaned but don’t report it as ready until reservations loaded, guard turns up late (less than 20 mins in advance) for whatever reason. System plays up a bit… Time ticks on…

 

[43066]

As in, train ready, cleaned but don’t report it as ready until reservations loaded, guard turns up late (less than 20 mins in advance) for whatever reason. System plays up a bit… Time ticks on…

Is being at the train less than 20 mins in advance of departure “late”? You’d need to check their Ts and Cs, but I doubt it given how tight crew diagramming tends to be.

On the stock I sign the reservations are loaded by the previous crew for that reason.

 

[modernrail]

Is being at the train less than 20 mins in advance “late”? You’d need to check their Ts and Cs, but I doubt it.

On the stock I sign the reservations are loaded by the previous crew for that reason.

I am not sure how long prior to departure guards are meant to be with their trains. That is a question in itself. As is what is the average timetabled allowance for boarding. I am still unclear whether the timetable is meant to allow a minimum boarding time at Euston, all other things being equal, and if so what that is, 20 mins, 15 mins.

As is whether that guard needs to be in place before the train can be boarded or whether the train can be boarded with platform staff only in place.

Then there is the question on what might cause any delay in anybody being happy to state the train is ready to board, for instance seat reservations being loaded up.

Is it an instruction to incoming crews to load up outgoing reservations? That does seem like the most appealing norm. If it is an instruction, is it followed unless there is a technical problem, or are lots of trains arriving with it not having been done?

Then I suppose is the question, is the reservations system uploading reliable enough or does is let us down enough to cause some of the problems with boarding times.

 

[43066]

I am not sure how long prior to departure guards are meant to be with their trains. That is a question in itself. As is what is the average timetabled allowance for boarding. I am still unclear whether the timetable is meant to allow a minimum boarding time at Euston, all other things being equal, and if so what that is, 20 mins, 15 mins.

As is whether that guard needs to be in place before the train can be boarded or whether the train can be boarded with platform staff only in place.

Then there is the question on what might cause any delay in anybody being happy to state the train is ready to board, for instance seat reservations being loaded up.

Is it an instruction to incoming crews to load up outgoing reservations? That does seem like the most appealing norm. If it is an instruction, is it followed unless there is a technical problem, or are lots of trains arriving with it not having been done?

Then I suppose is the question, is the reservations system uploading reliable enough or does is let us down enough to cause some of the problems with boarding times.

All good questions, to be fair, that would take an insider to answer….

 

[frodshamfella]

I was at Euston around lunch time on Sunday. It was horrendous, the crush of people waiting for departures was quite dangerous. Was going for the 13.23 to Liverpool, late announcing platform, followed by the inevitable stampede. One of our party, has balance issues, she wouldn't have managed it alone, I was concerned that she didn'tget knocked over. find the way passengers are treated at Euston appalling.

 

[Roy Badami]

This afternoon the platform numbers were flashing more normally - if still somewhat erratically. None of these 8 seconds pauses between flashes - so hopefully that was just a bug.

Still curious what the difference is between a steady platform number and a flashing platform number ..

 

[Bletchleyite]

This afternoon the platform numbers were flashing more normally - if still somewhat erratically. None of these 8 seconds pauses between flashes - so hopefully that was just a bug.

Still curious what the difference is between a steady platform number and a flashing platform number ..

A flashing number means a platform alteration from that booked. That's the standard pretty much nationally.

 

[Dr Hoo]

I see from another thread that King’s Cross has just been ‘closed’ due to overcrowding during disruption.

How often does Euston get closed in similar circumstances?

 

[bramling]

I see from another thread that King’s Cross has just been ‘closed’ due to overcrowding during disruption.

How often does Euston get closed in similar circumstances?

King’s Cross can have their moments too. The night when the 700s all sat down was very poorly handled. But all in all much less trouble than Euston.

 

[dk1]

I see from another thread that King’s Cross has just been ‘closed’ due to overcrowding during disruption.

How often does Euston get closed in similar circumstances?

I suppose Euston is better at keeping passengers penned up on the concourse whereas at Kings Cross passengers spill onto the platforms as the vast ticket gates are often not staffed causing difficulties with safe train dispatch.

 

[bramling]

I suppose Euston is better at keeping passengers penned up on the concourse whereas at Kings Cross passengers spill onto the platforms as the vast ticket gates are often not staffed causing difficulties with safe train dispatch.

The plan for King’s Cross seems to involve all staff going into hiding, and leaving the station to its own devices. Fortunately King’s Cross is better placed to cope than Euston, most of the time anyway, so it doesn’t cause as much issue.

 

[Skie]

Caught a Liverpool bound train from Euston on Tuesday. Train arrived a little late due to earlier disruption, barriers werent opened until after the departure time despite the train being sat there with no cleaners visible for a good 10 minutes. When we were eventually allowed to board they didnt bother doing ticket checks and it was a rush of people panicking because there had been no communication about when the train might actually depart.

5 minutes after being seated, TM said that they were still awaiting a driver, and we eventually left about 25 late.

So if they have changed their early boarding policy, it still gets buggered up by any prior disruption when they seem to fall back onto old practice.

 

[Hadders]

I was at Euston this afternoon and observed the following:

14:14 to Edinburgh via Birmingham New Street
At 14:09 no platform was shown with the board showing 'Expected 14:19'
At 14:14 the train was announced at Platform 1 with the board showing 'Expected 16:16'
The train disappeared from the board at 14:16

14:27 to Glasgow Central
At 14:18 no platform was shown on the board
At 14:21 the board showed 'Expected 14:29' but still no platform
At 14:22 the 14:43 departure to Liverpool Lime Street was announced as Platform 7 (I suspect this announcement, and the lack of any information about the Glasgow train, causes anxiety for passengers waiting for the Glasgow train and probably encourages them to rush for their train when it is eventually called)
At 14:25:00 the platform is still not shown on the board. An auto-annoucement is made at for platform 4 with the departure board updating at 14:25:27

14:33 to Manchester Piccadilly
This train was shown as platform 2 on the board at 14:22

There didn't appear to be any significant disruption at Euston this afternoon, just a couple of cancelled LNR trains due to lack of staff. The concourse itself was quiet, Saturday just after 14:00 is not peak departure time from London but with:

The platform for an Edinburgh train shown on the board only 2 minutes before departure
The platform for a Glasgow train shown less than four minutes before departure
The platform for a Manchester train displayed just 11 minutes before departure

It doesn't take a genius to work out why passengers feel the need to run, causing the station to become dangerous.

 

[modernrail]

I suppose Euston is better at keeping passengers penned up on the concourse whereas at Kings Cross passengers spill onto the platforms as the vast ticket gates are often not staffed causing difficulties with safe train dispatch.

Does it? I have literally never seen that happen on the mainline platforms. Maybe it’s more of a thing on the suburban which I don’t use often.

 

[dk1]

Does it? I have literally never seen that happen on the mainline platforms. Maybe it’s more of a thing on the suburban which I don’t use often.

The problem was with LNER.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Meanwhile, at Manchester Piccadilly, I went onto platform 6, seeing the 1515 Euston on the displays. It arrived and tipped out, and I boarded, the cleaners going through with people on board and still managing to do their job. There was neither rush nor stress.

The solution to all this is grindingly obvious.

 

[Discuss223]

I've been lightly following the problems at Euston and seen various things on X about dangerously crowded platforms. I gather new boarding policies are being introduced but they really ought to do something about the in-adequate departure boards in the main concourse. They replaced large ones that everyone could see with a giant advertising screen and huddled the passenger information to a small screen, meaning everyone has to crowd in a small space to see their platform (and also adds to the scramble to get on the train). Network Rail Euston seem to be very anti-passenger.