First South West (Kernow & Buses of Somerset)

[Callum15632]

I would agree - it looks like most of the 335xx examples and also, potentially, 33420/21 as well.

Yeah I said I think those but I wasn't 100% sure as I heard a rumour that these are getting withdrawn.

 

[Goldfish62]

I've just seen a post on a private Facebook group with an attached notice to staff announcing that FSW have lost the Cornwall College contract. That's 16 routes, on top of losing all the Cornwall school contacts. Whichever way you look it at it it means a massive contraction in Cornwall at the end of the summer term.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I've just seen a post on a private Facebook group with an attached notice to staff announcing that FSW have lost the Cornwall College contract. That's 16 routes, on top of losing all the Cornwall school contacts. Whichever way you look it at it it means a massive contraction in Cornwall at the end of the summer term.

Hmmm.... the shape of the business will undoubtedly change. In simple terms, you can't sustain the same overheads.

 

[Scotrail88]

Who’s picked the work up?
Seems like writing on the wall and area will become fully go ahead operated

 

[richard13]

I've just seen a post on a private Facebook group with an attached notice to staff announcing that FSW have lost the Cornwall College contract. That's 16 routes, on top of losing all the Cornwall school contacts. Whichever way you look it at it it means a massive contraction in Cornwall at irst the end of the summer term.

We will lose our Truronian coaches and random buses serving Bicton College in East Devon. They make a contrast to the Stagecoach, Dartline and Axe Valley vehicles on the A3052 if you hit the right time.
Any Cornwall operator struggles with this part. Go Ahead would use Dartline, who are nearby.

 

[Goldfish62]

Who’s picked the work up?
Seems like writing on the wall and area will become fully go ahead operated

Allegedly Stagecoach.

 

[Lynford1976]

Post deleted.

 

[Lizard1324]

With the introduction of new electric buses over the first fleet. Anyone know when the Truro p+r will get there’s and what buses have been purchased for it

 

[fgwrich]

I've just seen a post on a private Facebook group with an attached notice to staff announcing that FSW have lost the Cornwall College contract. That's 16 routes, on top of losing all the Cornwall school contacts. Whichever way you look it at it it means a massive contraction in Cornwall at the end of the summer term.

Ouch. If the business carries on like this, I can’t see First retaining Kernow for much longer. I’d be interested to know how much of centralising the First Bus management has played its part in the downfall of FK / South West. At least in the Carter / MMH era they were fairly present!

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Ouch. If the business carries on like this, I can’t see First retaining Kernow for much longer. I’d be interested to know how much of centralising the First Bus management has played its part in the downfall of FK / South West. At least in the Carter / MMH era they were fairly present!

Whilst it may be part of the issue, there are other bigger issues at play. The remuneration on capped fares is one but really, I think a lot of this comes back to not winning the TfC work in 2019. That issue was sort of lost in the general turmoil of Covid but you can't lose that much 52 week p.a. work and replace it with 38 week p.a. work (of which much is well away from natural territory) and some highly seasonal experiments.

I'd not be surprised to see operations concentrated on 3 or 4 locations.

 

[aswilliamsuk]

With the introduction of new electric buses over the first fleet. Anyone know when the Truro p+r will get there’s and what buses have been purchased for it

It's understood that there is a batch of Wrightbus GB Kites coming for it (alongside the nine going to Taunton) at some point this year.

 

[DaveHarries]

It's understood that there is a batch of Wrightbus GB Kites coming for it (alongside the nine going to Taunton) at some point this year.

Last I recall hearing was that the ones for Minehead (not Taunton) are due in June.

Dave

 

[Goldfish62]

Whilst it may be part of the issue, there are other bigger issues at play. The remuneration on capped fares is one but really, I think a lot of this comes back to not winning the TfC work in 2019. That issue was sort of lost in the general turmoil of Covid but you can't lose that much 52 week p.a. work and replace it with 38 week p.a. work (of which much is well away from natural territory) and some highly seasonal experiments.

I'd not be surprised to see operations concentrated on 3 or 4 locations.

I agree with all this.

One thing they won't have to worry about from the end of this year is the fare cap, which the government has re-stated won't be extended, plus Cornwall Council have stated that with the last of the fares pilot funding running put fares will return to full commercial rates by year end.

 

[KendalKing]

Allegedly Stagecoach.

Correct

 

[MarkC]

Have Stagecoach won the lot? All run from Plymouth? Whom won the cornwall council school tenders out of interest?

 

[Goldfish62]

Have Stagecoach won the lot? All run from Plymouth? Whom won the cornwall council school tenders out of interest?

Yes, Stagecoach have won the lot, as well as all the Callywith College work.

I know GSW have won some of the school tenders, but I don't know about other operators, apart of course that FSW haven't won anything!

 

[MarkC]

Yes, Stagecoach have won the lot, as well as all the Callywith College work.

I know GSW have won some of the school tenders, but I don't know about other operators, apart of course that FSW haven't won anything!

Really? Thanks for info. So that's all Plymouth citybus/go cornwall Callywith college routes to Stagecoach. They are doing well on tenders having recently picked up loads of Plymouth city Council routes and Devon county ones too, as well as some night services in Plymouth too

 

[Andyh82]

Yes, Stagecoach have won the lot, as well as all the Callywith College work.

I know GSW have won some of the school tenders, but I don't know about other operators, apart of course that FSW haven't won anything!

I’ll be interesting to see how Stagecoach run the CPR1 service in West Cornwall

The Duchy ones are close enough to Plymouth and Barnstaple depots, and the Bicton ones will presumably be run from Exeter

Go Ahead losing Callywith College work is also big news, as I believe they predate the big 2020 TfC launch, and were Plymouth Citybus routes before then

 

[Goldfish62]

Here are the details for Callywith College:

1 buyer​

• Callywith CollegeTruro

1 supplier​

• Stagecoach DevonExeter

Description​

Callywith College are looking for a supplier(s) of Student Transport Services for a 5 year contract commencing 1 September 2025. There will be the opportunity of 2 x 12-month contract extensions. Includes Lots: Lot 1: Lot 1 - Bus no 170 Lot 2: Lot 2 - Bus No 171 Lot 3: Lot 3 - Bus No 172 Lot 4: Lot 4 - Bus No 174 Lot 5: Lot 5 - Bus No 175 Lot 6: Lot 6 - Bus No 176 Lot 7: Lot 7 - Bus No 177 Lot 8: Lot 8 - Bus No 178 Lot 9: Lot 9 - Bus No 179 Lot 10: Lot 10 - Bus No 180 Lot 11: Lot 11 - Bus No 181 Lot 12: Lot 12 - Bus No 182 Lot 13: Lot 13 - Bus No 183 Lot 14: Lot 14 - Bus No 184 Lot 15: Lot 15 - Bus No 185 Lot 16: Lot 16 - Bus No 187 Lot 17: Lot 17 - Bus No 188 Lot 18: Lot 18 - Bus No 189 Lot 19: Lot 19 - Bus No 190 Lot 20: Lot 20 - all routes To access this competition: Registered: Login to https://suppliers.multiquote.com and view the opportunity CA15131. Not registered:

Award Detail​

1	Stagecoach Devon (Exeter) Value: £486,308

http://bidstats.uk/tenders/2025/W16/844562919

 

[Lynford1976]

Tenders for the new contract for Truro & Penwith College were due in yesterday, to start in September.

I believe that's now the last of the big educational contracts currently operated by FSW?

 

[Goldfish62]

Tenders for the new contract for Truro & Penwith College were due in yesterday, to start in September.

I believe that's now the last of the big educational contracts currently operated by FSW?

That's interesting, because in the past few years FSW were running these routes commercially.

 

[Andyh82]

Based on some calculations I think the PVR at Kernow is about 118 now

Removing the Cornwall schools and Cornwall college would take it to about 88. They won’t need Winkleigh or Plymouth anymore and Bodmin/Callington would only have 3 workings in total, they could run them all with lengthy dead runs from Summercourt? (this is Truro college 271, 272 & 890)

Bicton College is excluded from these numbers as Exeter outstation comes under Taunton

 

[Goldfish62]

Based on some calculations I think the PVR at Kernow is about 118 now

Removing the Cornwall schools and Cornwall college would take it to about 88. They won’t need Winkleigh or Plymouth anymore and Bodmin/Callington would only have 3 workings in total, they could run them all with lengthy dead runs from Summercourt? (this is Truro college 271, 272 & 890)

Bicton College is excluded from these numbers as Exeter outstation comes under Taunton

There'll certainly be a substantial vehicle clear-out in the summer.

 

[fgwrich]

There'll certainly be a substantial vehicle clear-out in the summer.

An easy way to clear out the last of the B7s, the early B9s, and knowing First Group I wouldn’t be surprised if an MMC (either single or double) moves away either.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

An easy way to clear out the last of the B7s, the early B9s, and knowing First Group I wouldn’t be surprised if an MMC (either single or double) moves away either.

To be honest, I'd not be surprised to see the Solos head off elsewhere and replace older e200s elsewhere.

 

[Goldfish62]

To be honest, I'd not be surprised to see the Solos head off elsewhere and replace older e200s elsewhere.

Agreed. The long ones were purchased for the A17 (but found to provide insufficient capacity - unsurprisingly) and the Lizard route contracts which First lost. The short ones were purchased when it was found that the E200MMC were too wide for one or two routes for which they'd been purchased.

So essentially, apart from their first few months they've never really had a home and have been poorly utilised on schools and college work. Not the best use of a nearly-new fleet and I'm surprised they haven't already been moved elsewhere.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Agreed. The long ones were purchased for the A17 (but found to provide insufficient capacity - unsurprisingly) and the Lizard route contracts which First lost. The short ones were purchased when it was found that the E200MMC were too wide for one or two routes for which they'd been purchased.

So essentially, apart from their first few months they've never really had a home and have been poorly utilised on schools and college work. Not the best use of a nearly-new fleet and I'm surprised they haven't already been moved elsewhere.

Well, three did head to Scotland until they sold those ops to McGills but yes, they've been in need of a home for much of the last five years. How the economics of an asset with a heavy book value work on college work is a bit of a question! So you'd think that they'd be better employed in somewhere like South Wales or Bath that a) already has Solos and b) has a fleet of ageing e200s of similar capacity.

 

[fgwrich]

Agreed. The long ones were purchased for the A17 (but found to provide insufficient capacity - unsurprisingly) and the Lizard route contracts which First lost. The short ones were purchased when it was found that the E200MMC were too wide for one or two routes for which they'd been purchased.

So essentially, apart from their first few months they've never really had a home and have been poorly utilised on schools and college work. Not the best use of a nearly-new fleet and I'm surprised they haven't already been moved elsewhere.

Three of the small ones did (53860 / 863 / 864) in fact two of those that did escape are still running around Cornwall in First’s incarnation of Midland Scottish. The third expired in Bath.

Then again, somewhat old 53701 aka LK05DYO seemed to spend most of its day last week on both the 1 to Lands End and 17 to St Ives. I bet that was rather cosy, and that must be a candidate for a very early withdrawal.

 

[LAIRA]

53701 is the spare for the Mousehole so is kept in Penzance. Probably needs must when it is not in use on the Mousehole.

 

[Goldfish62]

53701 is the spare for the Mousehole so is kept in Penzance. Probably needs must when it is not in use on the Mousehole.

The M6 in theory has enough Sprinters (3 PVR + 1 spare) without needing the Solo, but FSW do seem to have issues keeping the Sprinters on the road at times. Two spares for a 3 PVR service would normally be considered OTT.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 9 May 2025 ==

I’ll be interesting to see how Stagecoach run the CPR1 service in West Cornwall

Interesting one that given how remote it is from the rest of the routes, as well as being literally as far west as you can go! Perhaps it'll be subcontracted.