Wrexham, Shropshire & Midlands Railway updates

[Steve B]

I'm pretty sure that for longer journeys there will still be a choice between cheaper & slower and expensive & faster, purely for demand management - to stop the fast trains being overcrowded while the slower ones are empty.

Here's hoping! There's also the aspect of encouraging off peak travel to use trains that may otherwise be running around 1/4 full (or sitting in a siding somewhere). It seems like common sense to me. But my wife often reminds me that common sense isn't that common!

 

[weeklycommuter]

If the paths don't work then its going to be difficult for the ORR to say yes unless they tell NR to move Avanti around.

If the Office of Rail and Road says no to all three open access applications (WSMR, Lumo and Virgin) to run train services to and from London Euston on the West Coast Mainline, it will at least send a very clear message that unless and until HS2 phase one is completed and opened there can be no additional passenger train services to and from London Euston on the West Coast Mainline. No to all three open access applications appears to be the most likely outcome.

 

[TamedShrew]

They’re hopeful of a positive result from ORR in next few weeks and hopefully running from December

 

[Chippychips]

Two days ago, in PM Questions, Julia Buckley MP for Shrewsbury managed to put the question to the PM in front of an audience of 600 MPs.
Definitely putting the political pressure on. I cant Transcript the video but on her Facebook post she has the following description:

The Wrexham, Shropshire and Midlands Railway (WSMR) would introduce five trains daily to London, connecting us directly to the nation's capital and cutting down on travel times.

Today, during PMQs, I asked the Prime Minister to support the WSMR's open access application, which is also backed by 15 cross-party MPs along this route, and urge the Office of Rail and Road to give it the green signal.

https://www.facebook.com/share/r/16RVVnyD9P/

It seems like her passion is genuine. Stunts like this will make it hard for ORR to ignore.

 

[zwk500]

It seems like her passion is genuine. Stunts like this will make it hard for ORR to ignore.

Her passion can't invent more line capacity though, so the ORR will need to look carefully at NR's response to the application.

 

[Zontar]

I'm not sure what intrigued me most, her amusement at her own poor railway puns or the fact she was wearing a wsmr badge.

Although checking, it is actually allowed....

https://www.parliament.uk/globalassets/documents/rules-of-behaviour.pdf

"Wearing scarves, T-shirts, or large badges displaying brand names or slogans, or other forms of advertising of either commercial or noncommercial causes, is not in order. The tradition of the House is that decorations (medals, etc) of any kind and uniforms are not worn in the Chamber."

 

[Bald Rick]

It seems like her passion is genuine. Stunts like this will make it hard for ORR to ignore.

Fortunately, the ORR takes no account of MPs (or other politicians) in determining track access applications.

 

[weeklycommuter]

Does anyone know when the ORR will announce their decisions on this and all the other open access applications for the December 2025 timetable change?

 

[Clarence Yard]

Hopefully the June ORR Board will be deciding the WCML ones and the July OR Board will be deciding the ECML ones. After each Board the determination letters will then have to be crafted in full, checked for legality, and finally sent out.

If the ORR Board can’t agree on any decision, that application will go back a month until they get the info. they need to make a decision.

 

[Zontar]

Hopefully the June ORR Board will be deciding the WCML ones and the July OR Board will be deciding the ECML ones. After each Board the determination letters will then have to be crafted in full, checked for legality, and finally sent out.

If the ORR Board can’t agree on any decision, that application will go back a month until they get the info. they need to make a decision.

When is the board meeting date do you know?

 

[poffle]

BBC News are reporting that Network Rail have objected to the proposed services in their submission to ORR.

Mainly on grounds of Level Crossing safety and insufficient capacity.

There is no link provided to anything sent to ORR so it's just the BBC reporting.

Network Rail objects to direct London trains from Wrexham

Concerns over capacity on the line and the safety of a Shropshire level crossing have been raised.

www.bbc.com

 

[Y Ddraig Coch]

BBC News are reporting that Network Rail have objected to the proposed services in their submission to ORR.

Mainly on grounds of Level Crossing safety and insufficient capacity.

There is no link provided to anything sent to ORR so it's just the BBC reporting.

Network Rail objects to direct London trains from Wrexham

Concerns over capacity on the line and the safety of a Shropshire level crossing have been raised.

www.bbc.com

NR love to complain about level crossings as they did about the N. Wales coast and limiting how many trains per hour they can have but then conveniently do nothing about the level crossings that they are mainly in charge of!

 

[The exile]

NR love to complain about level crossings as they did about the N. Wales coast and limiting how many trains per hour they can have but then conveniently do nothing about the level crossings that they are mainly in charge of!

They will all have been risk assessed at their current usage level (presumably both rail and road). If either rises significantly (or in borderline cases, at all), then work may be required for which there is no money or no local support (we’d like to replace this crossing with a bridge - choose whether we demolish this care home or that mediaeval church, war memorial and primary school to enable us to do it)

 

[The Middle]

Full Network Rail response to the WSMR and all other competing track applications can be found on this page:

Competing track access applications | Office of Rail and Road

Information on how competing and complex applications for the December 2024, May 2025 and December 2025 timetable changes will be considered.

www.orr.gov.uk

 

[DavidGrain]

I think Sutton Park could be the level crossing problem as this is a public footpath within a park. The line is currently only used by freight although I have been over the line on a diverted passenger train.

 

[Harpo]

NR love to complain about level crossings as they did about the N. Wales coast and limiting how many trains per hour they can have but then conveniently do nothing about the level crossings that they are mainly in charge of!

By ‘do nothing’, I presume you mean upgrades? Something which needs additional funding. The other (safest) alternative is closure and there are plenty that have been closed.

 

[weeklycommuter]

BBC News are reporting that Network Rail have objected to the proposed services in their submission to ORR.

Mainly on grounds of Level Crossing safety and insufficient capacity.

There is no link provided to anything sent to ORR so it's just the BBC reporting.

Network Rail objects to direct London trains from Wrexham

Concerns over capacity on the line and the safety of a Shropshire level crossing have been raised.

www.bbc.com

The following final Network Rail representation on the WSMR open access passenger train service application makes particular mention of the Viaduct footpath level crossing which is also mentioned in the BBC report. However the BBC report also states that Network Rail plans to install crossing lights at this level crossing by December this year.

https://www.orr.gov.uk/sites/default/files/2025-05/2025-05-09-nr-final-representations-wsmr-s17.pdf

Level Crossings
We flagged a level crossing risk increase at Weston Rhyn level crossing between Wrexham and Shrewsbury in our previous letter dates 02 May 2024 and we have been able to conclude that the risk increase is tolerable at this location on this occasion.
However, we have identified that the increase in risk at Viaduct footpath crossing is not tolerable at this time without further risk mitigation measures installed.

We have considered all available options and recommend that the only suitable mitigation at Viaduct level crossing to support the introduction of WSMR services in Wales and Borders is the installation of Overlay Miniature Stop Lights (OMSL). OMSL will reduce the risk ‘so far as is reasonably practicable’ (SFAIRP).

Network Rail objects to direct London trains from Wrexham

Concerns over capacity on the line and the safety of a Shropshire level crossing have been raised.

www.bbc.co.uk

Network Rail's report, which has been sent to the Office of Rail and Road, highlighted a number of crossings where it believed there would be an increased risk.
They include the Viaduct level crossing in Shropshire, which it said was "used by large groups and is also a hot spot for trespassing and fatalities".
The operator said work would need to be carried out to make it safe.
North Shropshire MP Helen Morgan has previously spoken out on the safety of the crossing, which is close to the Chirk Viaduct.
She has written to Network Rail to request additional safety measures be put in place.
Network Rail said it had reviewed the safety of the crossing and brought forward plans to install crossing lights, which should be in place in December this year.

 

[Tazi Hupefi]

I rather suspect Network Rail had a bit of a panic, when they objected on the basis of a crossing that apparently is so serious in terms of unmanaged risk (and they described rather a lot of incidents and predicted future incidents), told all that to the track access part of ORR, seemingly forgetting that other parts of ORR (e.g. HMRI/enforcement) would also see that statement, and rather quickly identifed that there is clearly an unmanaged risk there that they may not have been aware of previously!

Better fix or mitigate it, quickly - regardless of open access!!

 

[Harpo]

I rather suspect Network Rail had a bit of a panic……………. and rather quickly identifed that there is clearly an unmanaged risk there that they may not have been aware of previously!

Quite an insult to the safety professionals responsible for that bit of railway.

 

[AlanL]

A quick update is that the MP for Shrewsbury has today written a letter to the ORR/Dft/Treasury supporting the WSMR and she has 'indicated' that she thinks the ORR is likely to make decision on the WSMR very soon, possibly as early as next week - it will be interesting to see the outcome!

 

[Tazi Hupefi]

Quite an insult to the safety professionals responsible for that bit of railway.

Not really, ORR and Network Rail are in regular battles over failings / improvements being urgently required in all sorts of areas.

Also see most RAIB reports relating to infrastructure- Network Rail's (mis)management and (mis)understanding of their assets is a regular theme.

There are also plenty of "local" Network Rail staff who would say that their recommendations and views are regularly disregarded or overruled or told there is insufficient budget to rectify whatever the matter is, and issues become conveniently reclassified in terms of their priority.

 

[Bald Rick]

A quick update is that the MP for Shrewsbury has today written a letter to the ORR/Dft/Treasury supporting the WSMR and she has 'indicated' that she thinks the ORR is likely to make decision on the WSMR very soon, possibly as early as next week - it will be interesting to see the outcome!

It needs a decision at the ORR Board. And that is not next week.

 

[Chippychips]

A quick update is that the MP for Shrewsbury has today written a letter to the ORR/Dft/Treasury supporting the WSMR and she has 'indicated' that she thinks the ORR is likely to make decision on the WSMR very soon, possibly as early as next week - it will be interesting to see the outcome!

I've just read it on her (Julia Buckley MP) Facebook page

https://www.facebook.com/search/top?q=julia buckley mp

In her post description she says this:

I am continuing to step up my campaign to secure the Direct Train Service to London (the Wrexham-Shropshire-Midlands Railway or WSMR) in advance of the regulator’s decision next week.

Following meetings with Ministers yesterday to urge for their support, I have written again to the treasury given the huge economic benefits of the additional train service.

For Shrewsbury especially, residents and businesses have been very clear of the boost it would offer our town.

I will continue to coordinate efforts with stakeholders to lobby for these extra trains, and I will leave no stone unturned until the decision next week

In her letter she goes on in some depth about the economic benefits to the Midlands area and opportunities WSMR will bring.

Her letter concludes with the following:

...Your colleagues in the department for transport have given this bid some support, and I will shortly be meeting with Lord Hendy to discuss this in greater detail. Given however the significant economic impact this line will have for the region and nation, I wanted to highlight this to you directly.

We anticipate the Office of Rail and Road will make their decision imminently, and I would be grateful for your support in ensuring that the significant economic benefits have been fully considered.

What is interesting though, is that in one of the replies to the comments to her Facebook post, she says this...

I am coordinating multiple stakeholders and 15 other MPs to keep up the pressure. We have solutions to all the points raised by Network Rail. I will leave no stone unturned!

Regardless of what happens, I don't think I've seen an MP genuinely this passionate about 'anything'. Kudos to her!

 

[Bald Rick]

I've just read it on her (Julia Buckley MP) Facebook page

In her post description she says this:

In her letter she goes on in some depth about the economic benefits to the Midlands area and opportunities WSMR will bring.

Her letter concludes with the following:

What is interesting though, is that in one of the replies to the comments to her Facebook post, she says this...


Regardless of what happens, I don't think I've seen an MP genuinely this passionate about 'anything'. Kudos to her!

Not sure why she’s written to HM Treasury. They will have no involvement in the matter.

 

[TUC]

If the Office of Rail and Road says no to all three open access applications (WSMR, Lumo and Virgin) to run train services to and from London Euston on the West Coast Mainline, it will at least send a very clear message that unless and until HS2 phase one is completed and opened there can be no additional passenger train services to and from London Euston on the West Coast Mainline. No to all three open access applications appears to be the most likely outcome.

And condemn those on WCML to continued higher fares as compared to what greater competition on the ECML has brought. Why would anyone want that?

 

[weeklycommuter]

I rather suspect Network Rail had a bit of a panic……………. and rather quickly identified that there is clearly an unmanaged risk there that they may not have been aware of previously!

It does seem a bit odd that Network Rail in their final representation on the WSMR application wrote at length of their concerns about the Viaduct footpath level crossing when they are going to install crossing lights anyway to reduce the risk to an acceptable level.

I cannot find any information about the next ORR Board meeting date so I do not know when the next ORR Board meeting will take place. According to the following list of board meeting minutes the ORR Board held two meetings in June 2024, one on 25 June and one on 27 June.

Board meeting minutes | Office of Rail and Road

ORR's board meets around ten times a year (monthly except August and December). The minutes are approved at the next meeting and these form our corporate record.

www.orr.gov.uk

 

[JonathanH]

And condemn those on WCML to continued higher fares as compared to what greater competition on the ECML has brought. Why would anyone want that?

The WCML, through the LNR option, has significantly lower fares than the ECML does, which doesn't have an equivalent.

 

[weeklycommuter]

And condemn those on WCML to continued higher fares as compared to what greater competition on the ECML has brought. Why would anyone want that?

The West Midlands has competing train services to London operated by Chiltern, London Northwestern Railway and Avanti West Coast.

 

[The Planner]

I've just read it on her (Julia Buckley MP) Facebook page

In her post description she says this:

In her letter she goes on in some depth about the economic benefits to the Midlands area and opportunities WSMR will bring.

Her letter concludes with the following:

What is interesting though, is that in one of the replies to the comments to her Facebook post, she says this...


Regardless of what happens, I don't think I've seen an MP genuinely this passionate about 'anything'. Kudos to her!

Wouldn't mind seeing her solutions to "they don't fit"

 

[Zomboid]

What is interesting though, is that in one of the replies to the comments to her Facebook post, she says this...

Regardless of what happens, I don't think I've seen an MP genuinely this passionate about 'anything'. Kudos to her!

I imagine some of her "solutions" to the problems that NR raise will be as viable as some of the proposals found in the speculative crayoning corner of this forum, but it is good to see an MP who cares a bit about something.