Full Brighton Mainline Closure - 13th July 2025

[Benjwri]

GTR have just notified on the 13th July there will be a full closure between Gatwick and East Croydon, no services between the two.

No trains between East Croydon and Gatwick Airport​

Urgent track repair work is required between East Croydon and Gatwick Airport, meaning that all lines will be closed for the whole day on Sunday 13 July.

Details of our service plan are still being finalised, but we are able to provide the following advice at this time:

• Customers travelling between London and Gatwick Airport should use Southern trains between London Victoria and East Grinstead for frequent bus services between East Grinstead and Gatwick Airport / Three Bridges.
• Customers travelling between London and the South Coast should use train services to/from East Grinstead, where replacement bus services will be running to/from Three Bridges for onward journeys.
• Direct Southern trains will also run between London Victoria and Gatwick Airport, via an alternative route. Please note, this alternative route will take considerably longer than the usual service between London Victoria and Gatwick Airport, so please plan ahead and leave plenty of time to reach the airport.
• Replacement buses will run between East Croydon and Redhill / Tattenham Corner and between Redhill and Tonbridge.
• Journey times will be extended when using replacement buses. Buses will be limited, and queuing systems will be in place. You may not be able to board your chosen service, so please leave plenty of time for your journey.

Please note, journey planners are not yet up to date. Details of the train service will be live in journey planners in the coming weeks, and we will provide an accurate date as soon as possible.

It strikes me this is going to be very, very messy indeed. Of course remains to be seen what services to East Grinstead are run and if additional trains are run, but I find it very unlikely they can handle the entire Gatwick and South Coast passenger load on the RRBs.

Also intrigued was 'alternate' route they have found. I can't see an obvious one from Victoria, unless they're reversing at Horsham. Presumable a skeleton service at that, if they're advising people to take the RRBs instead.

 

[DPQ]

I don't have any details, but GTR are quite used to doing these possessions now. Usually 2 trains per hour Victoria to Gatwick via Horsham, and 3 or 4 trains per hour Victoria to East Grinstead for bus connection

 

[Benjwri]

I don't have any details, but GTR are quite used to doing these possessions now. Usually 2 trains per hour Victoria to Gatwick via Horsham, and 3 or 4 trains per hour Victoria to East Grinstead for bus connection

Used to it normally, but this seems to be a far shorter notice one.

 

[dodecahedron67]

3tph to East Grinstead all day plus overnight services and a few crack expresses (VIC/LBG non-stop to EGR) according to a contact of mine who is one of the Station Managers for that branch. All 12 cars as well

 

[Tomp94]

Just seen on southern website, 'urgent'reapirs to the track are taking place meaning no trains at all from east Croydon to Gatwick Airport.

The 'urgent' repairs are not taking place until 13th July.

2 questions:

1. If the work is urgent, why wait a month?
2. What work is taking place?

 

[Sheridan]

Just seen on southern website, 'urgent'reapirs to the track are taking place meaning no trains at all from east Croydon to Gatwick Airport.

The 'urgent' repairs are not taking place until 13th July.

2 questions:

1. If the work is urgent, why wait a month?
2. What work is taking place?

When is the line shut? On the 13th July? That’s fairly short notice if so. Routine maintenance can be planned months if not years in advance. Anything which could have implications for safety or have a significant impact on train running will be dealt with straight away. ‘Urgent’ suggests a level between those two to me, and sounds about right.

I suspect if anything needed doing sooner the railway would refer to it as ‘emergency’ works rather than ‘urgent’.

 

[Wilts Wanderer]

It might mean that between now and 13th July (possibly the earliest a major closure could be practically planned with the train operators and Network Rail) there will be mitigation such as a temporary speed restriction, or elements of the network out of use, such as a particular set of points or signals or similar. The disruption caused by this would certainly define the upcoming engineering block as ‘urgent’.

 

[james_the_xv]

Just seen on southern website, 'urgent'reapirs to the track are taking place meaning no trains at all from east Croydon to Gatwick Airport.

The 'urgent' repairs are not taking place until 13th July.

2 questions:

1. If the work is urgent, why wait a month?
2. What work is taking place?

I'd imagine it will be something where the risk can be mitigated in the short term by a Temporary Speed Restriction, but needs sorting sooner than what can be organised under (pre agreed) medium term engineering access arrangements

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Also intrigued was 'alternate' route they have found. I can't see an obvious one from Victoria, unless they're reversing at Horsham. Presumably a skeleton service at that, if they're advising people to take the RRBs instead.

That's what they usually do isn't it? Therefore... I think that's what they are planning on.

 

[Harpo]

I'd imagine it will be something where the risk can be mitigated in the short term by a Temporary Speed Restriction

If something is deteriorating (as the job suggests) there are many other possible mitigations such as more frequent inspection frequencies and maintenance interventions or even placing watchmen* put on site.


* Can’t say I’ve heard a gender-neutral version of that.

 

[trainmania100]

Does anyone know where the speed restrictions are in place between the aforementioned stations, if there are any? I have only seen boards at Haywards heath and tinsley green (three bridges), nothing north

 

[stadler]

What times does the closure start and finish? The use of "the whole day" is rather vague. In the past sometimes the closures runsm in to the previous day and next day. Or sometimes trains in the early hours still run before the line closure starts. It only mentions the 13th but is it possible that late evening trains on the 12th or early morning trains on the 14th are also affected?

 

[Mcr Warrior]

It only mentions the 13th but is it possible that late evening trains on the 12th or early morning trains on the 14th are also affected?

Good question. Have the relevant timetables been updated yet?

 

[The Planner]

What times does the closure start and finish? The use of "the whole day" is rather vague. In the past sometimes the closures runsm in to the previous day and next day. Or sometimes trains in the early hours still run before the line closure starts. It only mentions the 13th but is it possible that late evening trains on the 12th or early morning trains on the 14th are also affected?

A Sunday block tends to be around the 29 hour mark in engineering work planning.

 

[Benjwri]

Good question. Have the relevant timetables been updated yet?

No timetables haven’t been updated yet. They say a few weeks time they will be on the page.

 

[westcoaster]

Currently no speed restrictions between either of these points, only works currently happening is the replacement of the foot bridge at Salfords station.

Major issues yesterday at East Croydon due to points failure.

Due to both the Caterham/Tattenham and Tonbridge closed could be something to do with the third rail.

 

[IrishDave]

I don't have any details, but GTR are quite used to doing these possessions now. Usually 2 trains per hour Victoria to Gatwick via Horsham, and 3 or 4 trains per hour Victoria to East Grinstead for bus connection

Yes, they're used to doing them in January or February, when the demand for both air travel out of Gatwick and seasiders to Brighton is at its lowest. A block like this in July is a very, very different beast.

This is the discussion thread from the previous occasion on which "Back Road" Diverts (i.e. Victoria-Gatwick via Epsom and Horsham) ran:

BML closed between Gatwick Airport and East Croydon (various routes) on 12 January

The Redhill / Quarry lines and branches to Reigate / Tonbridge / Caterham / Tattenham Corner will close for engineering works on Sunday, so no Gatwick Express service. London passengers will have the choice of a Southern 2tph Victoria-Gatwick service via Epsom and Horsham (calling at Clapham...

www.railforums.co.uk

 

[D3WY]

I'm assuming they will just run more services Via dorking which is pretty restrictive but is the best work around I could think of, I'm no planner though

 

[Benjwri]

I'm assuming they will just run more services Via dorking which is pretty restrictive but is the best work around I could think of, I'm no planner though

Pretty difficult to path any more. I assume they aren’t planning to from the pushing of people towards the RRB option.

 

[stadler]

Why are they doing this complex routeing of rail replacement buses to East Grinstead and trains from there and trains via the Dorking route. Would it not make much more sense to have rail replacement buses running from Gatwick Airport to East Croydon directly. Run an intensive non stop Gatwick Airport to East Croydon rail replacement service (plus a stopping service too of course) with buses at least every ten minutes. Gatwick Airport is right on the M25 so i would think getting to East Croydon directly by rail replacement bus (and then changing there for onward London trains) would be much quicker than the bus to East Grinstead and train route or the train via Dorking route.

 

[The Planner]

Why are they doing this complex routeing of rail replacement buses to East Grinstead and trains from there and trains via the Dorking route. Would it not make much more sense to have rail replacement buses running from Gatwick Airport to East Croydon directly. Run an intensive non stop Gatwick Airport to East Croydon rail replacement service (plus a stopping service too of course) with buses at least every ten minutes. Gatwick Airport is right on the M25 so i would think getting to East Croydon directly by rail replacement bus (and then changing there for onward London trains) would be much quicker than the bus to East Grinstead and train route or the train via Dorking route.

Google says its 20 minutes to East Grinstead vs 40 to East Croydon at the moment. Much like train diagramming, the same constraints will apply to RRB. How many coaches and drivers can you get and how they are utilised.

 

[liam456]

Why are they doing this complex routeing of rail replacement buses to East Grinstead and trains from there and trains via the Dorking route. Would it not make much more sense to have rail replacement buses running from Gatwick Airport to East Croydon directly. Run an intensive non stop Gatwick Airport to East Croydon rail replacement service (plus a stopping service too of course) with buses at least every ten minutes. Gatwick Airport is right on the M25 so i would think getting to East Croydon directly by rail replacement bus (and then changing there for onward London trains) would be much quicker than the bus to East Grinstead and train route or the train via Dorking route.

Gatwick Airport is right on the M23, sure, but East Croydon is nowhere near any kind of high capacity road infrastructure!

The peak vehicle requirement for a shuttle service like that at a proposed 10 minute frequency must be very very large!

 

[IrishDave]

Pretty difficult to path any more. I assume they aren’t planning to from the pushing of people towards the RRB option.

I would assume they will push as many people towards East Grinstead as possible. When the diversions last ran in January, they were not advertised to stop anywhere between Gatwick Airport and Clapham Junction, to manage overcrowding. The previous block in January 2024 had trains calling at Three Bridges and Horsham as well, but led to something of a minor meltdown so they're trying to push as many people onto the buses as they can.

They will likely manage a half-hourly diversionary path between Victoria and Gatwick but the limiting factor is the number of drivers with route knowledge between Dorking and Horsham, as well as possibly a limit on the third rail supply on the same section. No chance of anything more frequent than that.

Why are they doing this complex routeing of rail replacement buses to East Grinstead and trains from there and trains via the Dorking route. Would it not make much more sense to have rail replacement buses running from Gatwick Airport to East Croydon directly. Run an intensive non stop Gatwick Airport to East Croydon rail replacement service (plus a stopping service too of course) with buses at least every ten minutes. Gatwick Airport is right on the M25 so i would think getting to East Croydon directly by rail replacement bus (and then changing there for onward London trains) would be much quicker than the bus to East Grinstead and train route or the train via Dorking route.

There's nowhere for the buses to turn at East Croydon - there's barely enough room for the small number of buses they have to run to cover the local stops between East Croydon and Gatwick. Plus as has been said above, Gatwick-East Grinstead is a much shorter bus journey, so you can shift more people with the same number of buses (because they can make more trips in the same length of time). Buses to/from East Grinstead have been done successfully since 2013 with no major issues that I'm aware of.

 

[dodecahedron67]

Apparently it is up to 12bph to East Grinstead. East Croydon does not have the capacity for that many buses terminating there whatsoever

 

[PGAT]

Apparently it is up to 12bph to East Grinstead. East Croydon does not have the capacity for that many buses terminating there whatsoever

It’s not just capacity buses aren’t allowed to stand at East Croydon Bus Station

 

[Minstral25]

According to the Stakeholder briefing they are replacing a crossing at Stoats Nest and need to close line for whole day. Currently to quote GTR "trains running through the area are subject to speed restrictions because of the need to repair this part of the track."

 

[steamybrian]

Apparently it is up to 12bph to East Grinstead.

Interesting as there is a long signal section such that a train cannot depart Lingfield until the train in front arrives at East Grinstead a timing of 7 minutes for stopping trains and maybe 5 or 6 minutes for fast trains therefore more realistic capacity of around 7 or 8 trains per hour for the 2 platforms at East Grinstead allowing some recovery time.

I also find interesting why the Redhill area and Caterham/Tattenham Corner branches are also blocked when as stated above the worksite is at Stoats Nest Junction?

 

[PGAT]

Interesting as there is a long signal section such that a train cannot depart Lingfield until the train in front arrives at East Grinstead a timing of 7 minutes for stopping trains and maybe 5 or 6 minutes for fast trains therefore more realistic capacity of around 7 or 8 trains per hour for the 2 platforms at East Grinstead allowing some recovery time.

I also find interesting why the Redhill area and Caterham/Tattenham Corner branches are also blocked when as stated above the worksite is at Stoats Nest Junction?

It’s 12 buses an hour, not trains

 

[dastocks]

I also find interesting why the Redhill area and Caterham/Tattenham Corner branches are also blocked when as stated above the worksite is at Stoats Nest Junction?

You can't get to Redhill without passing through Stoats Nest Junction.
The blockage on the Caterham/Tattenham Corner branch may be to enable access for the engineering trains and equipment?

 

[steamybrian]

You can't get to Redhill without passing through Stoats Nest Junction.
The blockage on the Caterham/Tattenham Corner branch may be to enable access for the engineering trains and equipment?

You can get to Redhill from Reigate, Tonbridge and places south without passing through Stoats Nest Junction. .....!