If the buses switch stabling points each day, wouldn't that put paid to the theroy that the vehicles worked by MWT were the Enviro200s?
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TrawsCambria / TrawsCymru
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TheGrandWazoo
Veteran Member
I tend to agree, if MWT are providing overnight stabling, fuel and drivers why should it matter what the vehicles are, after all wouldn't First want to carry out their own maintenance. If we assume the 0640 ex Aber returns on the short working 0940 ex Aber to Llanbedr returning to Aber at 23.57, then to enable the 0740 ex Aber driver and or vehicle to return to Aber drivers have to change vehicles at some point be it at either terminus vis a meal break of en route which wouldn't really be suitable for the passengers and the possibility of vehicles having problems making the connection times.
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TheGrandWazoo
Veteran Member
I assume that the trick will mainly be Tycroes drivers having breaks at Aber to ensure they're legal? Can't say without looking at rotas
WelshBuses93
Member
Bwsbro
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Has anyone been on the new TrawsCymru T1 Service.
Are the buses comfortable as i require to travel between Aberystwyth and Aberaeron on both the Mid Wales Travel Service and First Cymru Service.
Also regarding the TrawsCymru T9. Has the buses operated by First been cascaded to NAT Group?
Are the buses comfortable as i require to travel between Aberystwyth and Aberaeron on both the Mid Wales Travel Service and First Cymru Service.
Also regarding the TrawsCymru T9. Has the buses operated by First been cascaded to NAT Group?
WestyAds
Member
Comfort varies depending on the various buses being used. The Enviro 300s, of which there are three, are very comfy, with high-backed leather seats and a fair amount of legroom. The two Enviro 200s aren't quite so comfy, as they lack the high-backed seats (although they are still leather, with a fair amount of padding) and offer a little less legroom.
That said, I spotted a standard First-branded Pulsar doing the route the other day, so it looks like there's still a chance you could get anything if one of the five TrawsCymru-liveried buses isn't available.
That said, I spotted a standard First-branded Pulsar doing the route the other day, so it looks like there's still a chance you could get anything if one of the five TrawsCymru-liveried buses isn't available.
TheGrandWazoo
Veteran Member
You mean an Eclipse? Wonder if that's the cover the X13 too?
WestyAds
Member
Oh, it might have been an Eclipse. I'm terrible with these things at a distance.
TheGrandWazoo
Veteran Member
Have you logged in to access the tender docs?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
To be fair, those Wright bodies are very similar, esp at a distance! First don't have any Pulsars. They do have Solars (Scania chassis) elsewhere such as Potteries but Cymru has Eclipses.
No, I don't think I have an account. Unless you can log in with a Google account?
Bwsbro
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Having attached the tenders for the TrawsCymru T1,T2 and T3 onto this website once again it is time for more TrawsCymru retendering this time for the T5.
The tender is being tendered by Ceredigion Council who are also retendering may of its supported bus services at the same time
Available is the Tender for the T5 Monday - Sunday and also the specification for the route. Also attached is the tender for X50 Aberteifi - Aberaeron Service alongside the current timetable for service 412 Aberteifi - Haverfordwest Service operated by Richard Bros
Do share your views on this tenders. Also send any questions i can put up to the tendering authority
Still no news on the new operators for the T2,T3 Services although i will keep you all posted with further news
The tender is being tendered by Ceredigion Council who are also retendering may of its supported bus services at the same time
Available is the Tender for the T5 Monday - Sunday and also the specification for the route. Also attached is the tender for X50 Aberteifi - Aberaeron Service alongside the current timetable for service 412 Aberteifi - Haverfordwest Service operated by Richard Bros
Do share your views on this tenders. Also send any questions i can put up to the tendering authority
Still no news on the new operators for the T2,T3 Services although i will keep you all posted with further news
Diolch Bwsbro for the info. Some observations on the proposed new T5 timetable:
- The proposed Mon-Sat timetable is an inferior service to the existing X50 (some examples below).
- The Sunday service is a welcome addition.
- The loss of the 07:20 Aberaeron to Cardigan service is crazy. This means that no one in New Quay or Aberporth can travel to Cardigan for a 9:00 start. Earliest bus gets to Cardigan at 10:00 which is useless for those travelling to work. No one can travel by bus to work at MOD/QinetiQ Aberporth from the north.
- There isn't a bus leaving Cardigan to the north between 16:00 and 17:36. There is an hourly service for the rest of the day but not at the busiest time of day when shoppers and workers want to travel. Another backward step from the existing timetable.
- The late night Sunday service Aberystwyth to Synod Inn is interesting. There is an advertised connection with T1 at Aberaeron but there isn't a T1 at this time. Do they mean the 701 service which is about to be withdrawn? Is this going to be replaced by a T1?
- A later Mon-Sat service out of Aberystwyth would be a welcome addition (and would be more use than the proposed late Sunday service). Ceredigion/Arriva used to run a late service from Aberystwyth to NQ and it was very popular on Fri/Sat nights especially.
trawscymru27
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Thanks for posting those, very interesting. The requirement for 'TrawsCymru green grab rails' is unusual - I would imagine that that means new vehicles are almost a certainty; otherwise exisiting vehicles under 3 years old would have to have an interior refit.
The Service Specification also states that 'Contractors are required to ensure that all advertised connections between the T5 and 412 services are provided at Cardigan (10 minutes variation permitted on the scheduled departure time)', which is odd as most of these 'connections' involve a wait of at least 40 minutes, and in some cases over an hour. The exceptions are the last two buses of the day. The T5 seems to be a like-for-like retendering of the current X50, rather than a combination of the X50 and 412 services giving a through Aberystwyth - Haverfordwest service. A great shame, in my view.
The Service Specification also states that 'Contractors are required to ensure that all advertised connections between the T5 and 412 services are provided at Cardigan (10 minutes variation permitted on the scheduled departure time)', which is odd as most of these 'connections' involve a wait of at least 40 minutes, and in some cases over an hour. The exceptions are the last two buses of the day. The T5 seems to be a like-for-like retendering of the current X50, rather than a combination of the X50 and 412 services giving a through Aberystwyth - Haverfordwest service. A great shame, in my view.
WelshBuses93
Member
I've just looked at the T5 timetable and noticed it saying on the document (T5 South arrives/ departs) and the Sunday timetable showed full Haverfordwest to Aberystwyth. 
Thanks to Bwsbro for posting the information.
The Sunday service is a big plus, however apart from that the T5 timetable is a disapointment. For one thing, my comments at the bus users' surgery that New Quay, Aberporth and direct services should have different numbers to avoid confusion seems to have fallen on deaf ears. Not only does the T5 number cover the multiple routes but the remnant X50 service will not be a single route either. Apart from that, my big gripe is that they intend to call it a TrawsCymru service. TrawsCymru is of course supposed to provide long-distance strategic routes, but the current X50 and 412 (which it seems will simply be renumbered as the T5) are hopeless as end-to-end routes. Long-distance it may be, but really it is a number of local services stuck together and not strategic route material at all. It is a decent service of course, just I think the Welsh Government will be making a mistake if they try to call it a strategic long-distance through route (and given the inaccurate marketing I have already pointed out for the T1, I wouldn't be supprised if they try to claim it is "your direct link between Cardigan/Haverfordwest and Aberystwyth". It is far from direct Welsh Government, so don't try to claim it is).
The X50/554 timetable posted my Bwsbro includes the 07:20 Aberaeron to Cardigan journey and a 16:30 return, with a 17:00 554 departure from Cardigan. Looks like those journeys are still there but not part of the T5 service.
Indeed, 'connections' between 412 and X50 at Cardigan have been pretty much non-existant for some time. I think some miss each other by two minutes. One journey which used to be ok was the 13:00 412 from Haverfordwest, the vehicle from which used to run the 14:xx X50 Cardigan to Aberystwyth which then formed the 16:05 return. I think that is no longer the case now that the X50 goes via New Quay.
The ITT is very unclear as to what will constitute 'T5 south', my guess is there is/will be a seperate ITT from Pembrokeshire Council for the other part of the route on Mon-Sat.
The Sunday service is a big plus, however apart from that the T5 timetable is a disapointment. For one thing, my comments at the bus users' surgery that New Quay, Aberporth and direct services should have different numbers to avoid confusion seems to have fallen on deaf ears. Not only does the T5 number cover the multiple routes but the remnant X50 service will not be a single route either. Apart from that, my big gripe is that they intend to call it a TrawsCymru service. TrawsCymru is of course supposed to provide long-distance strategic routes, but the current X50 and 412 (which it seems will simply be renumbered as the T5) are hopeless as end-to-end routes. Long-distance it may be, but really it is a number of local services stuck together and not strategic route material at all. It is a decent service of course, just I think the Welsh Government will be making a mistake if they try to call it a strategic long-distance through route (and given the inaccurate marketing I have already pointed out for the T1, I wouldn't be supprised if they try to claim it is "your direct link between Cardigan/Haverfordwest and Aberystwyth". It is far from direct Welsh Government, so don't try to claim it is).
Bwsbro
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All tenders regarding T2 and T3 are still being evaluated by Gwynedd Council
The tender for the T5 service between Aberystywth and Aberteifi/Haverfordwest (Sun) is still open until noon on the 22/9
In related news Express Motors are amending the timetable of service 1 from the 14/9/14
SprinterMan
Established Member
Oooh, didn't know this, will T2 finally get proper TrawsCymru buses? Lloyds' vehicles are generally new Optares and are very good, but Express stick any of their mangey fleet on it randomly :P
Adam
The minimum 40 seats, maximum 3yrs old rule seems to have been specificied in the T2 ITT, so yes in theroy the T2 should get 'proper TrawsCymru buses' but given the Enviro 200s on the T1 (I still haven't been on one but doubt they have 40 seats without crushing passenger's legs against the seat in front) the full vehicle spec might not be met.Oooh, didn't know this, will T2 finally get proper TrawsCymru buses? Lloyds' vehicles are generally new Optares and are very good, but Express stick any of their mangey fleet on it randomly :P
Adam
WelshBuses93
Member
Also, vehicles branded for service T1 have not been given luggage compartments or next stop announcements as mentioned in the service specification. So really, the T1 buses have only been externally refurbished.
Also, in the link I've shared, shows another 3 TrawsCymru services on a map...
T6 Wrexham to Rhyl via Ruthin and Denbigh. Currently operating as G.H.A. Coaches' X50 and X52.
T7 Carmarthen to Abergavenny via Llandeilo, Llandovery and Brecon. Currently services 280/ 281 (Morris Travel), 80 (N.A.T. Group) and the X43/ 43 (Stagecoach in South Wales).
T8 Wrexham to Newtown via Ruabon, Oswestry, Welshpool and Montgomery. Currently operating as the X71/ 71 between Oswestry and Newtown, so perhaps the Wrexham portion will operate via the A5 to Ruabon and operating a 'similar' route alongside service T3 (X94).
http://www.senedd.assemblywales.org...tuart Cole - Additional information.html?CT=2
Also, in the link I've shared, shows another 3 TrawsCymru services on a map...
T6 Wrexham to Rhyl via Ruthin and Denbigh. Currently operating as G.H.A. Coaches' X50 and X52.
T7 Carmarthen to Abergavenny via Llandeilo, Llandovery and Brecon. Currently services 280/ 281 (Morris Travel), 80 (N.A.T. Group) and the X43/ 43 (Stagecoach in South Wales).
T8 Wrexham to Newtown via Ruabon, Oswestry, Welshpool and Montgomery. Currently operating as the X71/ 71 between Oswestry and Newtown, so perhaps the Wrexham portion will operate via the A5 to Ruabon and operating a 'similar' route alongside service T3 (X94).
http://www.senedd.assemblywales.org...tuart Cole - Additional information.html?CT=2
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TheGrandWazoo
Veteran Member
You do wonder why they've done the T7 to Aber; why not improve the 39 from Brecon?
Why is the Heart Of Wales line shown on that map but the Pembroke Dock, Fishguard and Conwy Valley lines aren't? Also, the T5 service on the map doesn't seem to be the same one that is out to tender, since it doesn't seem to go via New Quay on the map. South of Cardigan though, just look at that kink! 98-118% slower than driving, the 412 route is. The three routes T6-T8 seem to be the same ones mentioned in the Winkler review as having come from a TrawsCymru businees plan draft in 2013.
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Are you not being presumptuous in assuming Lloyds' and Express will run the service. There is an extra return journey in the new format that commences @ 09.35 from Aberystwyth, this could well interest Mid Wales Travel. I saw recently on a proposed timetable schedule that the current Express Motors return journey Mon - Sat is commercial, can anyone confirm this is correct?Oooh, didn't know this, will T2 finally get proper TrawsCymru buses? Lloyds' vehicles are generally new Optares and are very good, but Express stick any of their mangey fleet on it randomly :P
Adam
The T2 ITT timetable I downloaded (probably from earlier in this topic) shows the 09:15 Bangor to Aberystwyth and 13:55 Aberystwyth to Bangor as commercial. The first two journeys from Aberystwyth are 07:35 and 09:55, not 09:35.
WelshBuses93
Member
Looks like drivers at Mid Wales Travel also operate the Enviro300's.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/theanglian/15191360702/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/theanglian/15191360702/
Seems a very strange operation for First to win a tendered service then look for another operator to sub-contract part of it out. I assume they must have been confidant of winning the service and being able to sub contract part of it, otherwise they would have had the expense of setting up an out station and employing local drivers with the added costs of swapping vehicles for maintenance.
TheGrandWazoo
Veteran Member
More likely was that they approached MWT originally and it was a key and integral part of their tender.
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