Class 345 progress

samuelmorris · 29 May 2017

Tweet from 9 hours ago still got a reply of 'no date', so it seems unlikely. I'd be curious to know what sort of union activity is holding the process up, though I understand such information is often sensitive.

RailUK Forums

kevjs · 29 May 2017

samuelmorris said:
Having an LCD exterior display wouldn't really work in my opinion - the viewing angles it needs are too great and it has to compete with direct sunlight, reflections etc. - the only colour outdoor displays that really work are those retina burning LED pixel boards, which apart from being too big to fit to the side of a train, also aren't really that clear up close. No, as far as I'm concerned it pretty much looks like they've nailed the side destination display on the 345, as long as they program it correctly and there are enough of them.

What about those that new buses use as destination boards?

Particularly useful for any trains/buses which run different routes (e.g. circle and hammersmith and city(?) trains could switch colour on demand), and the font size is also flexible which on buses can be quite useful - "National Water Sports Centre via Meadows" and "Derby" don't need to be the same size :lol:

samuelmorris · 29 May 2017

Don't think the changing colour meets the disability requirements - has to be that particular orange or nothing these days sadly.

announcements · 29 May 2017

700007 said:
I'm not too sure. I heard a rumour it was Emma Hignett as 'she is the voice of all things TfL' now (having done iBus, London Overground and some one-off announcements elsewhere such as the DLR). However Sarah Parnell (voice of the 2009 and S-stock) is quite popular with TfL, so you can't rule her out.

Ideally I'd want Julie Berry back for another generation on TfL's trains. She's got a very well spoken voice and it's more professional than the other two that I have mentioned.

Not to mention the iBoat!

I agree with you and subsequent posters, Julie would be best. Perhaps they will stick to Julie as per the current TfL Rail trains until the Elizabeth line goes live in 2018, after which they may switch to a different voice. Who knows.

spark001uk · 30 May 2017

samuelmorris said:
After what TfL did to the Northern line announcements, no thanks. Again, no problem with the voice actor, but it's got to be programmed correctly.

As I was just saying over in another discussion, I think it's as much to do with the quality of the playback components as it is the actor's voice and its recording.

class387 · 30 May 2017

Does it make any difference that this run is showing as '583P' instead of just 'FRGT'?

spark001uk · 30 May 2017

class387 said:
Does it make any difference that this run is showing as '583P' instead of just 'FRGT'?

That just means the working has been activated. Although today I see that the incoming service for that, 577P - 0920 Ilford depot to Gidea siding still hasn't left yet.

700007 · 30 May 2017

Really sorry guys, just been told once again that today's passenger run has been cancelled.... No date confirmed.

spark001uk · 30 May 2017

700007 said:
Really sorry guys, just been told once again that today's passenger run has been cancelled.... No date confirmed.

Don't worry mate it's not your fault. Thanks for the info.

Do you know if testing is cancelled today as well? I know that is a bit hit and miss also!

iphone76 · 30 May 2017

The test train did leave a Ilford and was in the yard at Gidea a Park when I passed it about 40 minute ago. I'm not sure what it is doing though.

spark001uk · 30 May 2017

583P, 588P, 589P, 593P, 596P, 598P, 502Q all cancelled today by the looks.

506Q, 511Q and one other are still showing, but I have a feeling they will get cancelled too.

spark001uk · 30 May 2017

Having said that - 597P Gas factory jn to Chadwell heath turnback is showing as cancelled throughout, however the signalling diagram shows it running and it's just arrived at Gidea Park.
So the usual rtt pinch of salt applies.

skyhigh · 30 May 2017

kevjs said:
What about those that new buses use as destination boards?

Particularly useful for any trains/buses which run different routes (e.g. circle and hammersmith and city(?) trains could switch colour on demand), and the font size is also flexible which on buses can be quite useful - "National Water Sports Centre via Meadows" and "Derby" don't need to be the same size

I think you'll find those are still LED displays as opposed to LCD. I'm not sure what legislation there is around displays - they certainly don't have to be orange (as shown by the trial white platform displays around the country and on newer buses).

Domh245 · 30 May 2017

skyhigh said:
I think you'll find those are still LED displays as opposed to LCD. I'm not sure what legislation there is around displays - they certainly don't have to be orange (as shown by the trial white platform displays around the country and on newer buses).

Looking at the RVAR section 11.8, it says "Subject to sub-paragraph (9), in displays on the exterior of a rail vehicle the first letter of, and numbers used in, visual announcements must not be less than 70 millimetres high on displays mounted on the front of the vehicle and not less than 35 millimetres high on displays mounted on the side of a rail vehicle, and all letters and numbers must contrast with their background." - where contrast is defined simply as "contrast in the amount of light reflected" - so I think you can get away with more or less anything other than dark shades on a black background display.

class387 · 30 May 2017

Here's the latest screenshot of the interior from the BBC programme last night, must say they look quite nice:

A question: are those actually blue(ish) lights or is it just the angle? Also, I see from the same programme the first mock-up had Fainsa seats!

macaronlover · 30 May 2017

class387 said:
Here's the latest screenshot of the interior from the BBC programme last night, must say they look quite nice:

A question: are those actually blue(ish) lights or is it just the angle? Also, I see from the same programme the first mock-up had Fainsa seats!

I really don't get why the poles are black. This was never used on LU Northern line hence I don't understand why this rolling stock has it. If I were visually-impaired, I'd have serious issues trying to distinguish those poles from the rest of the carriage. A lilac colour would've been better IMHO.

Domh245 · 30 May 2017

macaronlover said:
I really don't get why the poles are black. This was never used on LU Northern line hence I don't understand why this rolling stock has it. If I were visually-impaired, I'd have serious issues trying to distinguish those poles from the rest of the carriage. A lilac colour would've been better IMHO.

Lilac poles would be very difficult to see against the moquette, so black gives the necessary contrast but also looks smart. Around the doors, lilac could have worked, but you are then into issues with having a mix of lilac and black poles, whereas the current arrangement has black (and silver (passable as another shade of black!) central grab poles - not really sure about those!) only. Also kind of disappointed to see that the floor appears to be entirely flat - flooring with grooves cut into it á la S stock is far better for grip when wet.

class387 said:
A question: are those actually blue(ish) lights or is it just the angle? Also, I see from the same programme the first mock-up had Fainsa seats!

As for the colour - It looks to me to have the same warm lighting as the S stock - it looks like just a trick of the lights in the photo.

simple simon · 30 May 2017

class387 said:
Here's the latest screenshot of the interior from the BBC programme last night, must say they look quite nice:

A question: are those actually blue(ish) lights or is it just the angle? Also, I see from the same programme the first mock-up had Fainsa seats!

Handrails along the ceiling are too high. Only people 6ft tall will reach them.

Large picture windows are good.

Not enough longitudinal seating - the trains should be similar to S8, not S7.

btw, its official; the launch of these trains has been delayed.

http://londonist.com/london/transport/crossrail-trains-launch-has-been-delayed

But is it because this is a brand new design of train (so is being tested more thoroughly) or because this specific fleet of trains will be more complex than usual, as it is designed for three different signalling systems plus for stations with and without platform screen doors???

If the former then does it mean that these trains are also smoothing the path for the Class 710 variants?

Simon

phoenixcronin · 30 May 2017

I agree with the point about the seats. FAAAAAR too many longitudinal seats. A whole 3 cars (the first and last and the middle wheelchair car) are longitudinal only, which is too much

skyhigh · 30 May 2017

Domh245 said:
Looking at the RVAR section 11.8, it says "Subject to sub-paragraph (9), in displays on the exterior of a rail vehicle the first letter of, and numbers used in, visual announcements must not be less than 70 millimetres high on displays mounted on the front of the vehicle and not less than 35 millimetres high on displays mounted on the side of a rail vehicle, and all letters and numbers must contrast with their background." - where contrast is defined simply as "contrast in the amount of light reflected" - so I think you can get away with more or less anything other than dark shades on a black background display.

Thanks for that, very helpful

306024 · 30 May 2017

phoenixcronin said:
I agree with the point about the seats. FAAAAAR too many longitudinal seats. A whole 3 cars (the first and last and the middle wheelchair car) are longitudinal only, which is too much

With the stations in the central core having entrances at each end, it is likely passengers arriving at the last minute will crowd to the front and end cars, which is why they have longitudinal seats to create more space. Similar in the middle car where wheelchair users need space to manoeuvre. Once you get 1500 people aboard that design won't look so daft.

dosxuk · 30 May 2017

samuelmorris said:
the only colour outdoor displays that really work are those retina burning LED pixel boards, which apart from being too big to fit to the side of a train, also aren't really that clear up close.

LED matrix displays can be built in pretty much any size and resolution, and the brightness can be turned down. I've used 1mm pitch (1mm between each pixel) and you don't notice the individual pixels from about a metre away.

Sheffield Supertrams have been driving around with full colour LED external signage for several years now.

spark001uk · 30 May 2017

I like the flip-disc screens as seen on the desiro, bit more complex but clever. Like how they're reflective in the day and LED lit at night.

class387 · 31 May 2017

According to Londonist, train launch has been delayed until June:

http://londonist.com/london/transport/crossrail-trains-launch-has-been-delayed?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

The first Elizabeth Line services for London's £14.8bn Crossrail project have been pushed back until next month, for thorough testing of the train to be completed.
The first new train was meant to enter passenger service between Liverpool Street Main Line and Shenfield by the end of this month, but Transport for London (TfL) has now confirmed it will be later; likely in June.

urpert · 31 May 2017

For some reason they remind me of the original BART train interiors:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/87/BART_B_interior.jpg

route:oxford · 31 May 2017

simple simon said:
Handrails along the ceiling are too high. Only people 6ft tall will reach them.

Well, the handrails will have to be sufficiently high enough to so as not to be in the way of tall people. Looking around my office, 6'9" is the tallest bloke and 6'3" is the tallest woman - although when she's got her heels on she's closer to 6'7".

It's important to design around real people - there are fewer and fewer people who are short as a consequence of women rejecting short men as sub-prime partners.

theking · 31 May 2017

Anyone that uses the current tfl rail stock will be glad at the amount of longitudinal seating!

Also I think tfl want this to be identified as a tube line than a national rail line hence actually giving it a tube line name rather than distinguishing it like London overground or the DLR

spark001uk · 31 May 2017

6 longitudinal seats = approx 8 transverse seats. Or am I wrong?

Railman158 · 31 May 2017

Hi all
Being new to this forum and returning to Rail Photography/Spotting after almost 30 years I intend as part of a day out in London place myself at Bethnal Green and would be happy to report any 345 movements Thanks for the Interesting thread Lets hope I can add a photo or two here as well.

Evvy73 · 31 May 2017

A friend of mine took these of the interior of 345007.

Not sure about the colour scheme myself.

Class 345 progress

Established Member

RailUK Forums

Member

Established Member

Member

Established Member

Established Member

Established Member

Established Member

Established Member

Member

Established Member

Established Member

Established Member

Established Member

Established Member

Attachments

Member

Established Member

Member

Member

Established Member

Established Member

Established Member

Established Member

Established Member

Member

Established Member

Member

Established Member

New Member

Member

Attachments