Railcard Issues

heritageflower · 26 Jun 2019

Hi all,

I am extremely worried and would just like advice on what to do or if anyone can help me. I am not sure if there is a number I could be provided with to at least chase up my case with the prosecutions unit. I want to rectify this as best as I can, I acted in good faith by co-operating at the time and would have never purposely used an expired railcard if I had known it needed renewing.

I have been going through a really stressful tough period in my life, my grand-father is very unwell and I am extremely worried about him and not having heard anything from Greater Anglia is giving me even more anxiety.

So, On the 24th May 2019, I was at Tottenham Hale Station in a rush to get a train ticket towards London Stansted for 8:15pm to catch my airplane flight (I was already running late). I am a 23-year-old, studied for my Masters and I genuinely did not realise my 16-25 YPRC needed renewing. I bought my train ticket from the ticket machine at Tottenham Hale Station and I pressed the 16-25 railcard option as I knew I had a railcard (unfortunately, I did not check the expiry date of the railcard and due to human error I have ended up in this unfortunate situation). I am not a fare evader, this has never happened to me before and I put my hands up and accept I made a honest mistake of assuming my YPRC was still valid and that I could still use it. I had received my YPRC at the start of my studies and it was valid for 4 years, I used it when studying during my bachelors degree as my course was in the West Midlands so that is when I needed to use it for travel. My masters course was within London so I used my Oyster Card and have not needed to use my YPRC recently, but out of habit I assumed my YPRC was still valid (16-25) I am 23 but did not check when exactly it was expiring. During the 4 years, I had been using my railcard appropriately out of habit and not being too attentive because I knew it was valid for a few years so that is also why I had not noticed when it expired and needed to be renewed in order to be valid until 25.

When I got to London Stansted, I showed the ticket officer my ticket and he asked to see my railcard, it was only at that point when I gave him my railcard that I then realised it needed renewing as it was out of date. The reason I had pressed the 16-25 railcard option on the machine when buying my ticket earlier at Tottenham Hale for London Stansted was because I knew I had a railcard in my purse and thought it was still valid to use as I have not used it, but I did not realise it had expired. At the ticket machine, I did not need to take my railcard out to look at it when purchasing my tickets, so I assumed it was still valid after all these years. I made an honest mistake of not checking my card and knowing whether it needed to be renewed (also I was in a rush at the station), regardless I will never make such a mistake again.

I told the ticket officer that I did not know that it needed renewing, I was genuinely unaware that it was out of date as I have not actively used the card since. I said it was my honest mistake which I deeply apologise for all the trouble it had caused. I offered to pay any penalty fine if there was one, I also insisted on paying the full fare of the ticket or for a new ticket or the difference for the ticket. I told him I have not had this happen to me before and I gave him my railcard to keep and I told him to check the history of my railcard because I have not used it inappropriately. I gave him all my correct details, my driving licence for my identification and he told me that as he was a senior officer he would have to interview me under caution or warning and that because I bought a ticket and travelled using the expired railcard that I could be prosecuted for fraud and that he would have to write up a letter of prosecution and I could get a criminal record. He said I should receive a letter in 4 weeks and that I should respond immediately to that letter otherwise things would escalate. I wanted to cry and have been feeling depressed ever since, I co-operated nicely with him at the time and I gave him everything he asked for. He told me that depending on the letter I get, that I would MAYBE be able to offer a monetary out-of-court settlement and avoid having to go to court. Obviously, I do not want to go to court at all and I do not want a criminal record as it will most certainly harm my future career and I would NEVER have purposely use an expired railcard. It has been 4 weeks since this incident and I still have not received any letter. Is there a number I could call or somebody I could contact? I do not want to leave this any longer as I have been unhappy in this limbo and I would like to sort this issue out. I was not offered the option to pay a penalty fare at the time either. I really want to sort this out, I know it was my mistake for not having checked my railcard but it was a genuinely honest mistake and this has never happened before.

Please help me, I feel hopeless and upset and I don't know what to do

RailUK Forums

heritageflower · 26 Jun 2019

anyone have any advice?

ForTheLoveOf · 26 Jun 2019

chaturamaya said:
Hi all,

I am extremely worried and would just like advice on what to do or if anyone can help me. I am not sure if there is a number I could be provided with to at least chase up my case with the prosecutions unit. I want to rectify this as best as I can, I acted in good faith by co-operating at the time and would have never purposely used an expired railcard if I had known it needed renewing.

I have been going through a really stressful tough period in my life, my grand-father is very unwell and I am extremely worried about him and not having heard anything from Greater Anglia is giving me even more anxiety.

So, On the 24th May 2019, I was at Tottenham Hale Station in a rush to get a train ticket towards London Stansted for 8:15pm to catch my airplane flight (I was already running late). I am a 23-year-old, studied for my Masters and I genuinely did not realise my 16-25 YPRC needed renewing. I bought my train ticket from the ticket machine at Tottenham Hale Station and I pressed the 16-25 railcard option as I knew I had a railcard (unfortunately, I did not check the expiry date of the railcard and due to human error I have ended up in this unfortunate situation). I am not a fare evader, this has never happened to me before and I put my hands up and accept I made a honest mistake of assuming my YPRC was still valid and that I could still use it. I had received my YPRC at the start of my studies and it was valid for 4 years, I used it when studying during my bachelors degree as my course was in the West Midlands so that is when I needed to use it for travel. My masters course was within London so I used my Oyster Card and have not needed to use my YPRC recently, but out of habit I assumed my YPRC was still valid (16-25) I am 23 but did not check when exactly it was expiring. During the 4 years, I had been using my railcard appropriately out of habit and not being too attentive because I knew it was valid for a few years so that is also why I had not noticed when it expired and needed to be renewed in order to be valid until 25.

When I got to London Stansted, I showed the ticket officer my ticket and he asked to see my railcard, it was only at that point when I gave him my railcard that I then realised it needed renewing as it was out of date. The reason I had pressed the 16-25 railcard option on the machine when buying my ticket earlier at Tottenham Hale for London Stansted was because I knew I had a railcard in my purse and thought it was still valid to use as I have not used it, but I did not realise it had expired. At the ticket machine, I did not need to take my railcard out to look at it when purchasing my tickets, so I assumed it was still valid after all these years. I made an honest mistake of not checking my card and knowing whether it needed to be renewed (also I was in a rush at the station), regardless I will never make such a mistake again.

I told the ticket officer that I did not know that it needed renewing, I was genuinely unaware that it was out of date as I have not actively used the card since. I said it was my honest mistake which I deeply apologise for all the trouble it had caused. I offered to pay any penalty fine if there was one, I also insisted on paying the full fare of the ticket or for a new ticket or the difference for the ticket. I told him I have not had this happen to me before and I gave him my railcard to keep and I told him to check the history of my railcard because I have not used it inappropriately. I gave him all my correct details, my driving licence for my identification and he told me that as he was a senior officer he would have to interview me under caution or warning and that because I bought a ticket and travelled using the expired railcard that I could be prosecuted for fraud and that he would have to write up a letter of prosecution and I could get a criminal record. He said I should receive a letter in 4 weeks and that I should respond immediately to that letter otherwise things would escalate. I wanted to cry and have been feeling depressed ever since, I co-operated nicely with him at the time and I gave him everything he asked for. He told me that depending on the letter I get, that I would MAYBE be able to offer a monetary out-of-court settlement and avoid having to go to court. Obviously, I do not want to go to court at all and I do not want a criminal record as it will most certainly harm my future career and I would NEVER have purposely use an expired railcard. It has been 4 weeks since this incident and I still have not received any letter. Is there a number I could call or somebody I could contact? I do not want to leave this any longer as I have been unhappy in this limbo and I would like to sort this issue out. I was not offered the option to pay a penalty fare at the time either. I really want to sort this out, I know it was my mistake for not having checked my railcard but it was a genuinely honest mistake and this has never happened before.

Please help me, I feel hopeless and upset and I don't know what to do

The situation you find yourself in is one which, as you'll see from other posts in this section, not an uncommon one. The good news is that the officer was incorrect in suggesting that you could be convicted of fraud. That is not an offence that is made out from the circumstances you have described.

However, the bad news is that you can still be prosecuted under two main pieces of legislation. The first would be the more serious one, namely Section 5(3)(a) of the Regulation of Railways Act 1889 (also called RoRA). This makes it an offence to travel by train without having previously paid the fare, if you intend to avoid payment of the fare.

Note, however, that the "intent" is determined primarily by reference to your actions, and whether or not those indicate intent to avoid payment. People's "claims" of being "honest" are, for obvious reasons, not always taken at face value. In your particular case, I'd say it's borderline as to whether an argument that you'd intended to avoid payment of the correct fare would succeed.

On the one hand you could simply explain that you didn't realise your Railcard had expired. In the other hand, Greater Anglia might say that it's careless not to check it at least every so often, or to set up a reminder to remember to renew it; that there isn't an innocent explanation for it and that if you hadn't have been asked for your Railcard you would have gotten away with it.

The less serious offence would be under Byelaw 18(1) of the Railway Byelaws 2005. This makes it an offence to board a train without a valid ticket, if there were the facilities to obtain a ticket prior to boarding. In other words, this is a strict liability offence like speeding, where your intent doesn't matter and the mere fact that you entered the train without a valid ticket is all that matters.

Both offences have the same sort of sentence upon conviction, namely a fine of approximately 50-150% of your weekly income, plus any fare unpaid and the costs of prosecution (typically £80-150). However, the RoRA offence is more serious because it is seen as an offence of dishonesty by some professions. It is also only spent after 1 year, whilst it appears that Byelaw offences do not generate a criminal record at all.

However, for the vast majority of careers and employers, having one conviction for a relatively minor offence such as this should not affect your employment prospects, and it is by no means the end of the world. If you can tellus what industry you work in we might be able to advise you as to whether there is usually a problem in that industry if you have a rail-related conviction.

Coming to how you might resolve the matter, the officer was also wrong to promise that you would be contacted within 4 weeks. There is no hard and fast deadline by which you must be contacted - indeed, if they wanted, they could go straight to prosecution without notifying you beforehand at all.

The only strict time limit in it all is that, if they want to prosecute then, because these are all "summary only" offences which are dealt with in the Magistrates' Court, they must file their complaint/information within 6 months of the alleged offence. You night still receive paperwork regarding a late-filed prosecution after 6 months, but that is the approximate deadline.

It would be highly inadvisable at this stage to contact Greater Anglia. They will still be reviewing the incident and determining what to do. There is even a miniscule possibility that the paperwork reporting you gets lost somewhere along the way, or that they simply decide to drop it. However, far more likely is that, at some point before the 6 months are up, you'll be asked for your account of events. On the basis of what you say and the evidence they already have they'll then make a decision as to whether or not to prosecute.

It is at the stage of responding to their request for your account that you might offer to settle the matter out of Court. It is not uncommon to agree such a settlement with train companies, and if they do decide to agree to a settlement then it is usually for administration costs of approximately £80-100 plus any fare remaining unpaid. Note, however, that there is no obligation whatsoever for the train company to agree to a settlement - it is entirely at their discretion.

For the moment there is little you can do, other than to ensure you don't come to their attention again and to potentially save up for either a settlement or a Court fine. But beyond that, simply try to keep your mind off it (obviously easier said than done!). There's nothing you can do about this at the moment; there's no way you can speed along the process and you simply have to allow it to run its course.

TurbostarFan · 26 Jun 2019

chaturamaya said:
Hi all,

I am extremely worried and would just like advice on what to do or if anyone can help me. I am not sure if there is a number I could be provided with to at least chase up my case with the prosecutions unit. I want to rectify this as best as I can, I acted in good faith by co-operating at the time and would have never purposely used an expired railcard if I had known it needed renewing.

I have been going through a really stressful tough period in my life, my grand-father is very unwell and I am extremely worried about him and not having heard anything from Greater Anglia is giving me even more anxiety.

So, On the 24th May 2019, I was at Tottenham Hale Station in a rush to get a train ticket towards London Stansted for 8:15pm to catch my airplane flight (I was already running late). I am a 23-year-old, studied for my Masters and I genuinely did not realise my 16-25 YPRC needed renewing. I bought my train ticket from the ticket machine at Tottenham Hale Station and I pressed the 16-25 railcard option as I knew I had a railcard (unfortunately, I did not check the expiry date of the railcard and due to human error I have ended up in this unfortunate situation). I am not a fare evader, this has never happened to me before and I put my hands up and accept I made a honest mistake of assuming my YPRC was still valid and that I could still use it. I had received my YPRC at the start of my studies and it was valid for 4 years, I used it when studying during my bachelors degree as my course was in the West Midlands so that is when I needed to use it for travel. My masters course was within London so I used my Oyster Card and have not needed to use my YPRC recently, but out of habit I assumed my YPRC was still valid (16-25) I am 23 but did not check when exactly it was expiring. During the 4 years, I had been using my railcard appropriately out of habit and not being too attentive because I knew it was valid for a few years so that is also why I had not noticed when it expired and needed to be renewed in order to be valid until 25.

When I got to London Stansted, I showed the ticket officer my ticket and he asked to see my railcard, it was only at that point when I gave him my railcard that I then realised it needed renewing as it was out of date. The reason I had pressed the 16-25 railcard option on the machine when buying my ticket earlier at Tottenham Hale for London Stansted was because I knew I had a railcard in my purse and thought it was still valid to use as I have not used it, but I did not realise it had expired. At the ticket machine, I did not need to take my railcard out to look at it when purchasing my tickets, so I assumed it was still valid after all these years. I made an honest mistake of not checking my card and knowing whether it needed to be renewed (also I was in a rush at the station), regardless I will never make such a mistake again.

I told the ticket officer that I did not know that it needed renewing, I was genuinely unaware that it was out of date as I have not actively used the card since. I said it was my honest mistake which I deeply apologise for all the trouble it had caused. I offered to pay any penalty fine if there was one, I also insisted on paying the full fare of the ticket or for a new ticket or the difference for the ticket. I told him I have not had this happen to me before and I gave him my railcard to keep and I told him to check the history of my railcard because I have not used it inappropriately. I gave him all my correct details, my driving licence for my identification and he told me that as he was a senior officer he would have to interview me under caution or warning and that because I bought a ticket and travelled using the expired railcard that I could be prosecuted for fraud and that he would have to write up a letter of prosecution and I could get a criminal record. He said I should receive a letter in 4 weeks and that I should respond immediately to that letter otherwise things would escalate. I wanted to cry and have been feeling depressed ever since, I co-operated nicely with him at the time and I gave him everything he asked for. He told me that depending on the letter I get, that I would MAYBE be able to offer a monetary out-of-court settlement and avoid having to go to court. Obviously, I do not want to go to court at all and I do not want a criminal record as it will most certainly harm my future career and I would NEVER have purposely use an expired railcard. It has been 4 weeks since this incident and I still have not received any letter. Is there a number I could call or somebody I could contact? I do not want to leave this any longer as I have been unhappy in this limbo and I would like to sort this issue out. I was not offered the option to pay a penalty fare at the time either. I really want to sort this out, I know it was my mistake for not having checked my railcard but it was a genuinely honest mistake and this has never happened before.

Please help me, I feel hopeless and upset and I don't know what to do

Wait for Greater Anglia to contact you, there is nothing to be gained in contacting them now.

heritageflower · 26 Jun 2019

ForTheLoveOf said:
The situation you find yourself in is one which, as you'll see from other posts in this section, not an uncommon one. The good news is that the officer was incorrect in suggesting that you could be convicted of fraud. That is not an offence that is made out from the circumstances you have described.

However, the bad news is that you can still be prosecuted under two main pieces of legislation. The first would be the more serious one, namely Section 5(3)(a) of the Regulation of Railways Act 1889 (also called RoRA). This makes it an offence to travel by train without having previously paid the fare, if you intend to avoid payment of the fare.

Note, however, that the "intent" is determined primarily by reference to your actions, and whether or not those indicate intent to avoid payment. People's "claims" of being "honest" are, for obvious reasons, not always taken at face value. In your particular case, I'd say it's borderline as to whether an argument that you'd intended to avoid payment of the correct fare would succeed.

On the one hand you could simply explain that you didn't realise your Railcard had expired. In the other hand, Greater Anglia might say that it's careless not to check it at least every so often, or to set up a reminder to remember to renew it; that there isn't an innocent explanation for it and that if you hadn't have been asked for your Railcard you would have gotten away with it.

The less serious offence would be under Byelaw 18(1) of the Railway Byelaws 2005. This makes it an offence to board a train without a valid ticket, if there were the facilities to obtain a ticket prior to boarding. In other words, this is a strict liability offence like speeding, where your intent doesn't matter and the mere fact that you entered the train without a valid ticket is all that matters.

Both offences have the same sort of sentence upon conviction, namely a fine of approximately 50-150% of your weekly income, plus any fare unpaid and the costs of prosecution (typically £80-150). However, the RoRA offence is more serious because it is seen as an offence of dishonesty by some professions. It is also only spent after 1 year, whilst it appears that Byelaw offences do not generate a criminal record at all.

However, for the vast majority of careers and employers, having one conviction for a relatively minor offence such as this should not affect your employment prospects, and it is by no means the end of the world. If you can tellus what industry you work in we might be able to advise you as to whether there is usually a problem in that industry if you have a rail-related conviction.

Coming to how you might resolve the matter, the officer was also wrong to promise that you would be contacted within 4 weeks. There is no hard and fast deadline by which you must be contacted - indeed, if they wanted, they could go straight to prosecution without notifying you beforehand at all.

The only strict time limit in it all is that, if they want to prosecute then, because these are all "summary only" offences which are dealt with in the Magistrates' Court, they must file their complaint/information within 6 months of the alleged offence. You night still receive paperwork regarding a late-filed prosecution after 6 months, but that is the approximate deadline.

It would be highly inadvisable at this stage to contact Greater Anglia. They will still be reviewing the incident and determining what to do. There is even a miniscule possibility that the paperwork reporting you gets lost somewhere along the way, or that they simply decide to drop it. However, far more likely is that, at some point before the 6 months are up, you'll be asked for your account of events. On the basis of what you say and the evidence they already have they'll then make a decision as to whether or not to prosecute.

It is at the stage of responding to their request for your account that you might offer to settle the matter out of Court. It is not uncommon to agree such a settlement with train companies, and if they do decide to agree to a settlement then it is usually for administration costs of approximately £80-100 plus any fare remaining unpaid. Note, however, that there is no obligation whatsoever for the train company to agree to a settlement - it is entirely at their discretion.

For the moment there is little you can do, other than to ensure you don't come to their attention again and to potentially save up for either a settlement or a Court fine. But beyond that, simply try to keep your mind off it (obviously easier said than done!). There's nothing you can do about this at the moment; there's no way you can speed along the process and you simply have to allow it to run its course.

Thank you for your response.
It is so stressful and upsetting with the idea of it being a 6 month wait... :'(

ForTheLoveOf · 26 Jun 2019

chaturamaya said:
Thank you for your response. I am just so worried because he said he was a senior officer, and that I would definitely receive a letter within the 4 weeks (it has been 4 weeks)

It's rather irresponsible of him to have promised a response within a specific timeframe if that's what he said. Are you sure he didn't say something like "you'll usually get a response within 4 weeks"?

chaturamaya said:
if not then it will definitely be a court matter which I do not want it to escalate and become that

Unfortunately you have little control over whether or not it proceeds to Court.

chaturamaya said:
I am not well off either, so saving up for even that kind of money will be hard as it is.

Unfortunately such is the cost of travelling without a valid ticket. The issue is that it's difficult to tell the honest from the fare dodgers who pay when challenged, and so it's almost a case of everyone being treated equally harshly.

chaturamaya said:
I wish I had it in writing so I at least had a confirmation of what they planned on doing and how much money I would exactly be needing.

You'd never get something like that in writing from a Revenue Protection Inspector, and even if you did, it wouldn't really mean anything. All you can rely on is that, unless they drop the matter entirely (which is highly unlikely) it will cost you at least about £80-100, plus the fare, and possibly more.

chaturamaya said:
Either way, I will start saving from now.

This seems a sensible way forward.

chaturamaya said:
Even if there is that small possibility of dropping it, would they at least let me know?

They might, or they might not. They're under no obligation to let you know anything unless they decide to prosecute, in which case you'll receive, at the very least, the summons.

chaturamaya said:
Are you suggesting I just wait 6 months from May 24th (when it happened)?

They have 6 months to bring a prosecution so if, say, you haven't heard anything after 7 months it's probably safe to assume nothing has come of the matter.

chaturamaya said:
I studied biomedical science for bachelors and psychology for masters and would like to pursue a career either within the hospital or education settings.

A conviction, even under RoRA, would likely not be a significant issue for those career paths.

chaturamaya said:
I am just so upset because I genuinely never meant to travel without a valid ticket

Unfortunately it is very difficult to know who is in your boat and who is the kind of person who's suddenly sorry when they get caught fiddling. It's very difficult to have an effective system of enforcement without cracking down harshly on a few people who didn't necessarily have ill intentions.

chaturamaya said:
certainly after this horrible experience I will definitely be checking the expiry dates of any future railcards from now on...

This is definitely a good idea - set yourself a reminder (be that electronic or in a paper calendar) to check the expiry date. Same for any season tickets or anything else that expires.

chaturamaya said:
but I am just so gutted because it was never my intention to travel with the expired railcard

As I said, it's very difficult to objectively determine that this is the case.

chaturamaya said:
because I did pay for my fare

Unfortunately you didn't pay your fare if your Railcard was out of date. A Railcard discounted ticket isn't "sort of" valid upon payment of the difference if it turns out you've forgotten your Railcard or it's expired. It's simply 100% invalid.

chaturamaya said:
I never not wanted to pay for my fare and after realising my railcard was out of date, I wanted to pay the difference or pay for a full new ticket immediately with no hesitation

This certainly won't harm your case, but equally a lot of people who are in the "pay when challenged" category will be more than willing to pay when they encounter some kind of railway authority. That doesn't stop them dodging the fare at other times, so it's hard for outsiders to know whether you are genuine or not.

chaturamaya said:
I did not travel without paying any fare, the ticket was a discounted fare because I had the railcard but I admit that I mistakenly had not checked the expiry date (I assumed it still had some time left as it had been valid for all those years like I said previously)

Unfortunately this was a costly assumption. When I got a multi-year 16-25 Railcard I set myself a reminder for the expiry date, so that I wouldn't forget to renew it. It's simple but it has to be done otherwise you'll get yourself into trouble.

chaturamaya said:
so despite this, they could still convict me under RoRA?

I wouldn't be able to say with any certainty whether or not you'd be convicted. I'd say it'd be down to the judge on the day if it came to it, and whether they believed you that you made a genuine mistake or not. But yes, it's entirely possible for you to be convicted under RoRA.

chaturamaya said:
I just find it so unfair because this has been the first time any sort of thing like this has ever happened to me and I really do not want it to get to such a stage when it was a genuine mistake.

Unfortunately the fairness of it doesn't change the process or outcome. I don't disagree that it's heavy handed for a first time mistake but it's simply the way the system works.

chaturamaya said:
In total would it be costing £150?

The administration fee for a settlement, or the costs requested in a prosecution, might typically be anything up to about that much for a relatively straightforward case like this, yes. You have to add on the fare and any additional extras (e.g. the Victim Surcharge and the actual fine if it goes to Court).

chaturamaya said:
The officer did say that it would be a hefty amount if it becomes an out of court settlement but he did not give me a figure.

At least he didn't make a mistake here. I suppose £80 is a lot more than what might otherwise be a Penalty Fare for something nearer £20 or £30, but equally it's a lot less than a potentially mid-three-figure bill if you end up in Court.

chaturamaya said:
If I receive paperwork regarding the late-filed prosecution after 6 months - what will then happen in that scenario for me? Can I steal appeal?

You can still receive the paperwork after the complaint has been filed. It's the filing of the complaint/information that has the strict 6 months deadline - once the paperwork has been filed it's down to the efficiency and workload of the relevant Court as to how fast you get your summons.

chaturamaya said:
So just to confirm, there is no contact number for the Prosecutions Unit so that I can ask them if they have any updates regarding my matter?

No, there is no public number and even if someone suggests a number, I would advise in the strongest terms possible not to call them at this stage. Even later on, it's always best to keep everything in writing when it might go to Court. But pestering them now is not going to make it any faster at all. You'll simply have to be patient.

chaturamaya said:
It is so stressful and upsetting with the idea of it being a 6 month wait...

Perhaps, but there's nothing you can do now. Just sit and wait. If something like this is making you stressed out, then perhaps anxiety/stress is something you need to see a doctor about?

furlong · 27 Jun 2019

Another factor that may be taken into account is how far out-of-date it was - merely a day or two, or weeks or months - and then how many other journeys you might have made without a valid ticket. (If you paid by card, they could look for other transactions at the same train company with the same card.)

island · 27 Jun 2019

furlong said:
Another factor that may be taken into account is how far out-of-date it was - merely a day or two, or weeks or months - and then how many other journeys you might have made without a valid ticket. (If you paid by card, they could look for other transactions at the same train company with the same card.)

I was about to mention this. The longer the Railcard was out of date for, the worse it will look.

heritageflower · 27 Jun 2019

I have not made any other journeys without a valid ticket. I told the Ticket officer he can check my rail-card’s history and all my card history because I am telling the truth and it will show that I have not used it before.

Like I said, this is the first time any such thing has happened to me!

I have not had to travel to university in the West Midlands since Summer last year so I had not needed to use or look at the YPRC. When I gave him my railcard he showed me that it expired in September last year. I have not used it before though (which hopefully they will see when they check the history on the railcard)

najaB · 27 Jun 2019

chaturamaya said:
I have not used it before though (which hopefully they will see when they check the history on the railcard to prove that)

Unfortunately, there's no 'history' of use to check with Railcards.

221129 · 27 Jun 2019

chaturamaya said:
I have not made any other journeys without a valid ticket. I told the Ticket officer he can check my rail-card’s history and all my card history because I am telling the truth and it will show that I have not used it before.

Like I said, this is the first time any such thing has happened to me!

I have not had to travel to university in the West Midlands since Summer last year so I had not needed to use or look at the YPRC. When I gave him my railcard he showed me that it expired in September last year. I have not used it before though (which hopefully they will see when they check the history on the railcard to prove that)

If your railcard was 7months out of date then I'd expect a higher settlement figure or court tbh.

kristiang85 · 27 Jun 2019

chaturamaya said:
I have not made any other journeys without a valid ticket. I told the Ticket officer he can check my rail-card’s history and all my card history because I am telling the truth and it will show that I have not used it before.

Like I said, this is the first time any such thing has happened to me!

I have not had to travel to university in the West Midlands since Summer last year so I had not needed to use or look at the YPRC. When I gave him my railcard he showed me that it expired in September last year. I have not used it before though (which hopefully they will see when they check the history on the railcard to prove that)

Another thing to consider - was it loaded to your Oyster you've been using in London?

paddington · 27 Jun 2019

kristiang85 said:
Another thing to consider - was it loaded to your Oyster you've been using in London?

If it was linked correctly the railcard expiry date will be recorded and the discount will stop being applied on the appropriate date

theblackwatch · 27 Jun 2019

Thread locked - the OP does not appear to want any more advice.

Railcard Issues

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