Lothian Buses and ECB Discussion

Auld reekie · 24 Jul 2019

scosutsut said:
At the risk of showing my age here, exactly how many children have debit cards? Or have I missed something?

These concession cards are marvellous.

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ScotRail158725 · 24 Jul 2019

scosutsut said:
At the risk of showing my age here, exactly how many children have debit cards? Or have I missed something?

ive had my debit card for 2 years, since i was 14 and quite a few people i know have had them since they were under 16 aswell

Darklord8899 · 24 Jul 2019

ejstubbs said:
Rode a 400XLB on the number 4 route for the first time this morning. Might not be the first time they've run on that route - I usually take the bus about an hour later to avoid the peak. Also saw a 400XLB on the 27 route, again not seen one before myself.

I would have thought the 44 would be a better choice of route for the 100-seater, given how rammed it gets in the morning and evening peaks. I did wonder whether the turn out of Ardmillan Terrace on to Slateford Road might be a bit tricky for the long wheelbase but of course the 4 takes the same route from Princes Street as far as Slateford.

Last night, at the tail end of the evening peak on Lothian Road, I caught the second of two 400XLBs running two minutes apart on the number 11 route. (Driver didn't seem all that keen to stop to pick up me and the other half dozen stragglers who'd just missed the previous bus.) By the time we got to Fairmilehead I was the only passenger on board. Felt a bit guilty having a 100-seat bus all to myself!

I believe the issue with the XLB's and the 44 are the turns around the Park and Choose at Wallyford
....I imagine Macbeth Moir Road would be "challenging" for them as well
(It can be difficult enough getting a standard length single up/down there)

gghdeo · 24 Jul 2019

SpeedbirdA350 said:
I think it's more of an oversight than anything re children contactless tickets. Some might be angry and outraged but they need to remember this only came in to play this week, still, it's an oversight imo that the company never thought about.

It's not an oversight, it's just not implemented yet. Their website says the ability to buy other [paper] ticket types using contactless is coming with a future update. At that point, I think Lothian will be one of the first bus operators in the UK to offer both Pay As You Go with capping *and* contactless paper ticket purchase on board. It'll be worth waiting for!

Regarding the debit cards for 11 years +, I guess the problem for now is that they'd still be charged adult fares. That might be solved with this future update, when they can specifically ask for a child ticket and pay using contactless. I wonder, though, if it might be possible in future for parents to register their kids' contactless cards with Lothian's system so that they automatically get child fares.

ejstubbs · 24 Jul 2019

SpeedbirdA350 said:
Route 4 has not had the B8L on it as far as I know. What you are seeing are the ex london B9TL dual doors which have been running on route 4 over the past few days. Gemini 2

Would seem that you are correct: I saw one of the B9TLs on the 4 on Shandwick Place just now.

scotrail158713 · 24 Jul 2019

Darklord8899 said:
I believe the issue with the XLB's and the 44 are the turns around the Park and Choose at Wallyford
....I imagine Macbeth Moir Road would be "challenging" for them as well
(It can be difficult enough getting a standard length single up/down there)

Yeah. I’ve been on a 44 along there a few times and “challenging” is probably the best way to put it.

Jordan Adam · 24 Jul 2019

With contactless child tickets i can see both sides. Personally if i had a 13 year old child i wouldn't want them going out with a bank card. I just think it's too risky, yes they may be mature enough but at the end of the day they're still a child at that age. However on the flip-side i can see the benefits it could have, especially for parents knowing that their child wouldn't need to worry about cash and can get home safely.

(Random story time...) I know when i was younger there once was a time where my bus ticket had got wet and all the ink had smudged, luckily i got on the bus for 20p below the single fare as First Aberdeen policy at the time was that a driver shouldn't leave a child behind, even if they don't quite have enough for the fare. However not all operators adopt this policy so having a contactless card and being able to pay child fares would stop that kind of situation. Of course you could break or loose a bank card, however they're more durable than a bus ticket!

Grumpyscot · 24 Jul 2019

scosutsut said:
At the risk of showing my age here, exactly how many children have debit cards? Or have I missed something?

My grand-daughter and her pals - all 12/13 have them and use them regularly on the ECB 124/X24/X5 services and the Prentice 111 & 118. They're a tad disappointed that they can't use their card on the 26 or 30 route which they also regularly use.

SpeedbirdA350 · 24 Jul 2019

Jordan Adam said:
With contactless child tickets i can see both sides. Personally if i had a 13 year old child i wouldn't want them going out with a bank card.

It's not just bank card but paying with your phone ie apple pay. Most kids have a smart phone or some sorts be it an iPhone or android and both have the ability of using phone to pay for things. So while they might not have a card with them, they probably would their phone.

Jordan Adam · 24 Jul 2019

SpeedbirdA350 said:
It's not just bank card but paying with your phone ie apple pay. Most kids have a smart phone or some sorts be it an iPhone or android and both have the ability of using phone to pay for things. So while they might not have a card with them, they probably would their phone.

Can you not get child tickets on the mobile app either? If so then that seems odd.

SpeedbirdA350 · 24 Jul 2019

Jordan Adam said:
Can you not get child tickets on the mobile app either? If so then that seems odd.

No, you can't buy child tickets with mobile app either. Only pre paid citysingles and cash allowed for children.

scosutsut · 24 Jul 2019

Consider me educated then! Hopefully child tickets via contactless will be something that will follow in a future update, given the gaps in functionality and promise of further change, I'd be hopeful.

Tom B · 24 Jul 2019

Some of the comments in the evening news are comic. People left scrabbling for change, outrage about child tickets etc. It's a system new today, folk have had to pay with cash for 100 years, if I were travelling I'd be sure to take cash in anticipation of minor teething issues.

Fryschocream · 24 Jul 2019

Evening news.....chip paper. The councillor claiming you could take 10 children for free is fine.....if someone wants to fund that. Shall we withhold the dividend?

CM · 24 Jul 2019

Tom B said:
Some of the comments in the evening news are comic. People left scrabbling for change, outrage about child tickets etc. It's a system new today, folk have had to pay with cash for 100 years, if I were travelling I'd be sure to take cash in anticipation of minor teething issues.

Unfortunatley we now live in a world were people are incappable of thinking for themselves and can only do things if someone points it out to them.

takno · 24 Jul 2019

Tom B said:
Some of the comments in the evening news are comic. People left scrabbling for change, outrage about child tickets etc. It's a system new today, folk have had to pay with cash for 100 years, if I were travelling I'd be sure to take cash in anticipation of minor teething issues.

I for one still have a pile of change to get through - the one day's notice wasn't enough for me to start running it down. Probably a bit of a pain if you heard about it yesterday and assumed you wouldn't have to break a note buying lunch though

ScotRail158725 · 24 Jul 2019

Lothian said on a comment on their facebook post that the current airlinks are moving to Skylink

overthewater · 24 Jul 2019

Then i will ask this question again, Where is the Skylink stock going?

Jordan Adam · 24 Jul 2019

overthewater said:
Then i will ask this question again, Where is the Skylink stock going?

Common sense would dictate LCB.

scosutsut · 24 Jul 2019

Jordan Adam said:
Common sense would dictate LCB.

LCB if they have expansion due (although the one thing I still struggle to understand is the decker heavy fleet?)
ECB for B7 replacement?
Main Fleet for B7 replacement?
Decapitation for a mactour start up in Deans?

Okay, the last one might be far fetched, but the possibilities are endless.

Ricky Kane · 24 Jul 2019

can someone have a look at this and tell me what they think ( not finished yet )

scosutsut · 24 Jul 2019

Ricky Kane said:
can someone have a look at this and tell me what they think ( not finished yet )

I'd move the withdrawn and long departed vehicles to another tab rather than mucky up the main list and an index of your livery codes would be good.

That's my main suggestions, otherwise looks good.

Ricky Kane · 24 Jul 2019

scosutsut said:
I'd move the withdrawn and long departed vehicles to another tab rather than mucky up the main list and an index of your livery codes would be good.

That's my main suggestions, otherwise looks good.

thinking of removeing withdrawn ones and thanks

Darklord8899 · 24 Jul 2019

....My personal preference would be to make Skylink exclusively B5LH's and move all the B5TL's (current and the soon to be ex Airlinks) elsewhere....
I much prefer the interior layout of the B5LH's and using the 300 to/from work, I'd much prefer to be doing it on a bus that I prefer to ones that look awful inside and are uncomfortable

Sadly, I fear I will be disappointed....

scosutsut · 25 Jul 2019

Do skylink vehicles have the same age restrictions placed on them as Airlink? I'd assume no as it's not a contract?

If so what would the point be of repainting two sets of vehicles? Surely just cascade the ex Airlink Gemini 3s to wherever the end destination is!

SpeedbirdA350 · 25 Jul 2019

scosutsut said:
Do skylink vehicles have the same age restrictions placed on them as Airlink? I'd assume no as it's not a contract?

If so what would the point be of repainting two sets of vehicles? Surely just cascade the ex Airlink Gemini 3s to wherever the end destination is!

I am not sure if they do (when 35 was running in they used 57 plate scanias), however as I said a week ago when I assumed this would happen, it would be to remove 431-437 so there would be 17 and 67 plates on all skylinks and not 15/67. Would allow for 431-437 to go for refurb too.

scotrail158713 · 25 Jul 2019

I think the introduction of contactless is great but the ECB style should be used. This style just suits people travelling on their own. At least on ECB you can pay for 3 people with one card.
Call me cynical, but I don’t think contactless is going to be successful as a lot of the people who would use contactless will be travelling with children.

scosutsut · 25 Jul 2019

SpeedbirdA350 said:
I am not sure if they do (when 35 was running in they used 57 plate scanias), however as I said a week ago when I assumed this would happen, it would be to remove 431-437 so there would be 17 and 67 plates on all skylinks and not 15/67. Would allow for 431-437 to go for refurb too.

True, although refurbing 4 year old vehicles would be crazy if this wasn't Lothian we were talking about! That's not a criticism though!

Are there enough airlinks to replace 431-7 and the LCB 43 allocation as was suggested before?

That perhaps would allow the cascade of the coach seated ex Skylink to ECB and the bus seated 09s to the city fleet?

Unless all deckers are getting reseated rather than recovered at refurb now then the distribution wouldn't matter as much.

SpeedbirdA350 · 25 Jul 2019

scosutsut said:
True, although refurbing 4 year old vehicles would be crazy if this wasn't Lothian we were talking about! That's not a criticism though!

Are there enough airlinks to replace 431-7 and the LCB 43 allocation as was suggested before?

That perhaps would allow the cascade of the coach seated ex Skylink to ECB and the bus seated 09s to the city fleet?

Unless all deckers are getting reseated rather than recovered at refurb now then the distribution wouldn't matter as much.

In the current airlink fleet, you have 496-510. So 15 airlink, so you'd replace those 7 skylinks, then take those 431-7 skylinks, send them with the rest of the airlinks over to get some more seats put in and luggage racks removed (UNLESS LB plan to run Skylink 500 soon...) and then move them on to another branch ie to replace the 9 B9s on 43, with 6 going to LCB LV.

I think 431-7 need more than just seats sorted as some folk on here have commented on the smell of those for example.

Lothian285 · 25 Jul 2019

One of the ex-London open tops is at Seafield in CitySightseeing livery. Fleet number 251.

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