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Northern Class 195: Construction/Introduction Updates
- Thread starter Haydn1971
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Xenophon PCDGS
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In the Wigan Wallgate station lines sidings about 0800 on Saturday morning, we noted a Class 195 unit whilst we were en-route to Southport, but I did not catch the fleet number. I suppose this was for training purposes.
Thanks. Considering again the 2.712m width of a 195, it is only 11.8cm narrower than a 150 or 8.8cm narrower than a 142. Looking at this length on a ruler it should not make the 195 look more cramped inside, so other factors must be at work. On the subject of AC, we only really need it for 3 months of the year at most in the UK. Having it fitted makes units heavier and use more fuel. A friend of mine (who is a retired GP) pointed out that it is healthier to have opening windows and to be able to breath in fresh air rather than recirculating air from AC. Another problem with AC is the non opening windows in the event of failure. A better option may have been having opening windows that can be unlocked by the train crew in the event of failure of the AC system.
Modern public transport HVAC systems don’t recirculate air constantly and are far more healthy than jamming loads of people together in a warm, damp enclosed space. Particularly in winter.
The main health benefit is that the HVAC system means the environment is dry. Bacteria and fungi breed in moist stagnant environments they tend to be uncomfortable and smell bad also...
There was a 195 in platform 8 at Huddersfield on Friday lunchtime. So something is happening.
Unfortunately, my experience of the 195s so far is that the aircon is pretty inadequate. By that I mean that it doesn't cool the train to a comfortable temperature. I should stress this is my only real complaint about them, I think they're excellent trains, but the aircon is either not powerful enough, or set at too high a temperature, for me.
The single trip I’ve had on one it was warm initially but then went OK.
The train was late, the guard reported software issues, so I put the initial heat down to either the unit hanging around with the doors open for a time or the software acting up.
It was a very hot day.
samuelmorris
Established Member
On a DMU I would argue it's healthier to have windows closed. The diesel fumes that come into sprinters in summer are quite intense.
How long have you been on board? A/C set to the 'correct' temperature will still seem too warm to begin with if you board on a hot day and only make you feel cool after 20-30 mins onboard. If you set it to be any more fierce than that, on long journeys you would freeze.
We have AC in my workplace, a large laboratory rammed with healthcare analysers. The robots push out so much heat if the AC goes off it’s 30°C+ quite quickly... In winter we just have a bit less AC...
There’s always a debate about wether it’s too hot or cold in the lab from my work colleagues. The AC engineers say you can only ever set a desirable temperature for 70% of users. 30% will always say it’s too hot or too cold. I’ve never researched this but after 25 years I can attest to the fact that there’s always a few staff members that are permanently cold and won’t be truly happy unless the air temp is 25°C. Conversely there’s always a Few people that prefer 18°C. I fall into the 18°C club... The thermostat is set to 21°C 24/7 365.
I’d guess this is a problem everywhere and public transport will be no different.
There’s always a debate about wether it’s too hot or cold in the lab from my work colleagues. The AC engineers say you can only ever set a desirable temperature for 70% of users. 30% will always say it’s too hot or too cold. I’ve never researched this but after 25 years I can attest to the fact that there’s always a few staff members that are permanently cold and won’t be truly happy unless the air temp is 25°C. Conversely there’s always a Few people that prefer 18°C. I fall into the 18°C club... The thermostat is set to 21°C 24/7 365.
I’d guess this is a problem everywhere and public transport will be no different.
samuelmorris
Established Member
I'm sure I've seen twitter comments complaining about the temperature of the exact same service several times. It's of course possible that the A/C was off in one vehicle but even so, I can certainly believe it.
Fairly sure that if the HVAC wasn't functioning in one car on a 195 it should've been out of service at next suitable location as the HVAC has features that tie in with the fire detection system and therefore becomes semi safety critical.
Edit, I should add that I have been on a couple of 195s with saloon temperatures on the warm side, so the functionality of the A/C might have been operational but its effectiveness perhaps left a bit to be desired and walking to another vehicle with better performing A/C tends to confirm that. There is also no way for traincrew to alter the temperature of the saloon HVAC units as the things are configured now, only the cab HVAC units are adjustable by crew. For the saloon HVAC the crew can only switch it on of off, but as I said above it works in conjunction with the fire detection system in certain circumstances so there is no way crew should be switching it off in passenger service without authorisation from Northern control.
But it's obviously still possible that something had happened which, procedurally or technically, shouldn't have happened.
Edit, I should add that I have been on a couple of 195s with saloon temperatures on the warm side, so the functionality of the A/C might have been operational but its effectiveness perhaps left a bit to be desired and walking to another vehicle with better performing A/C tends to confirm that. There is also no way for traincrew to alter the temperature of the saloon HVAC units as the things are configured now, only the cab HVAC units are adjustable by crew. For the saloon HVAC the crew can only switch it on of off, but as I said above it works in conjunction with the fire detection system in certain circumstances so there is no way crew should be switching it off in passenger service without authorisation from Northern control.
But it's obviously still possible that something had happened which, procedurally or technically, shouldn't have happened.
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If you are too cold at 18° you can put a sweater on. If you are too hot at 25° you can't get undressed in most work places.
Many thanks for the replies about the 195's, I've been camping at the Edinburgh Festival the last few days so have been offline. Much appreciated.
absolutelymilk
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Not if you are wearing smart businesswear, especially for women - there aren't many sweaters that are acceptably smart!
Seriously? You think that there is no way to wear smart businesswear that keeps you warm at 18°s? The average British summer temperature is around 20°s. How do they cope the rest of the year without freezing to death or putting the heating on to 40°. How do they leave the house when there isn't a heat wave?
Lol. That’s my argument with my work colleagues... Unfortunately driving to work wearing a T shirt in winter now seems to be the norm.
Most people don’t want to feel compelled to remove their outer clothing during their commute I’d say.
samuelmorris
Established Member
I would think a bigger issue is that on a hot day you shouldn't be bringing a sweater just in case the train is cold!
If 18°'s is too cold it's a miracle we survived as a species and even more of a miracle if we continue to survive.
18°s isn't cold. The bigger issue is if you think it is.
absolutelymilk
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That wasn't what I said, rather that it's more difficult to find such clothing. It's pretty well-known that air conditioning is normally set at levels designed for men rather than women, which affects women's performance.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...ins-work-better-in-warmer-offices-study-finds
Weirdly, people warm up when they are walking around rather than sitting still.
Anyway, do we know which 195s will be introduced next?
Should that be Manchester to Blackpool? I have not read anything before about 331s being introduced on Liverpool LS to Blackpool North services.
Thanks for the clarification.
Be lucky there. Only the instructors as yet passed out on 331's.
61653 HTAFC
Veteran Member
Was it in platform 8 or in the sidings behind? A pair of 195s have been based there for a few weeks for training. I note this evening that at some point 195111 has replaced 110, with 105 still being the other.
As the training circuit is via the Calder Valley, use of platform 8 (which can only be accessed from the West) would seem unlikely.
331 training will be stepping up markedly so I believe, very soon hopefully once Croft Street and Stockport CS are signed off. Situation seems to change every day though.
Are there any plans for the express service from Liverpool to Oxford Rd to switch to the 195?
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