I want to go Lime Street -Runcorn(halton curve) -Chester and return Chester-Crewe-Runcorn-Lime Street. Northern rail shows the return journey every 55 minutes past the hour. Its shown as a off peak CDR with railcard. (£4.75) Will I have any problems returning via Crewe, is it a valid journey/ticket. Or do I have to screenshot the booking.
-
Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!
Liverpool-Chester-Crewe ticket query
- Thread starter negone
- Start date
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R
RailUK Forums
Statto
Established Member
Yes you will have issues using a Liverpool - Chester ticket returning via Crewe, i think that ticket is not valid via Crewe.
One ticket that is valid for that type of journey is a Cheshire Day Ranger, not valid until after 9am Monday to Friday though, but is valid anytime weekends & Bank Holidays
One ticket that is valid for that type of journey is a Cheshire Day Ranger, not valid until after 9am Monday to Friday though, but is valid anytime weekends & Bank Holidays
northwichcat
Established Member
You could consider for your return journey Chester-Greenbank, walk to Hartford, then Hartford-Liverpool. However, the price of Runcorn to Greenbank singles is extortionate. Possibly they are still priced based on Runcorn-Crewe-Chester-Greenbank?
enclose screenshot
Attachments
Last edited:
185
Established Member
- Joined
- 29 Aug 2010
- Messages
- 5,004
Liverpool - Chester is not valid to Acton Bridge, only via Halton Curve to Frodsham, its currently a very cheap TfW-set fare too (compared to Crewe). Cheshire Day Ranger is probably best.
The £4.75 CDR you are looking at is a Liverpool-Chester ticket routed via Runcorn. Technically speaking this is valid via Crewe by virtue of the 'split route check' (see this thread for details of what that means) but I think you would have difficulties using it this way. I don't think any booking site would offer you an itinerary to back up that validity.
Thank you - this interests me, so I think the details are:
- There is no defined valid route for "any permitted" tickets Liverpool-Runcorn-Chester
- Clearly a ticket would be valid on a through train
- There is a "VIA RUNCORN" ticket
- The 'split route check' allows valid routes Liverpool-Runcorn and Runcorn-Chester to be considered for this ticket
- Runcorn-Chester is valid via Crewe (Liverpool-Chester isn't valid via Crewe)
- Even if there were a valid route via Runcorn for "any permitted" it's still valid to use the 'split route check' as well
There effectively are "Any Permitted" fares, they're just route dot "." (route code 01000) in this case. But the existence of route dot fares doesn't limit or extend the validity of "via Runcorn" fares, as they are cheaper.
One of the map combinations for Liverpool to Chester is CJ+JO - these maps intersect at Runcorn. So travelling via Runcorn is a mapped route.
Yes, although that wouldn't entitle you to break your journey at Runcorn etc. in the absence of the above mapped route.
That's correct. The split route check can be conducted whether or not there are permitted routes that allow travel via the specified via point(s). It's an additional way of determining validity.
Thank you for explaining further, something new to have learned for me today!
LNW-GW Joint
Veteran Member
I'd consider using a Liverpool-Crewe off peak day return "Not via Manchester" at £9.60 with railcard.
I'd expect that to be valid via Chester (either route, and therefore via Runcorn/Frodsham), as well as via Hartford.
It looks to me as though the fares system hasn't fully adapted to the options available since the opening of the Halton Curve.
There's an Avanti-only fare at £9.55 but that won't get you to Chester.
I'd expect that to be valid via Chester (either route, and therefore via Runcorn/Frodsham), as well as via Hartford.
It looks to me as though the fares system hasn't fully adapted to the options available since the opening of the Halton Curve.
There's an Avanti-only fare at £9.55 but that won't get you to Chester.
Yes, although Liverpool-Crewe doesn't have a defined route Liverpool-Runcorn-Chester-Crewe that's probably because the routeing guide wasn't updated to take the new service into account, and it'd seem reasonable to be able to go that way although not guaranteed. Liverpool-Chester-Crewe via The Wirral has always been OK as well as the route via Hartford as you way.
Thank you. I think I understand what your saying. I have ventured into unknown territory. I am sorry I posted this.
Statto
Established Member
That's not a bad idea, but wouldn't you have issues breaking at Chester on the outward leg of the ticket, as Chester has barriers?
Before the Halton Curve was reopened, would the via Runcorn, be via Runcorn then Runcorn East, rather than going via Crewe, although passengers would most likely never go this way, with the 2 Runcorn stations being quite distant from each other, & definitely not walkable.
Last edited:
Maps CV + JO at https://data.atoc.org/routeing-maps, yes.
Oh, and I was wrong - as usual - CV + JO gives a route over the new route, as Watershed said above. In the context of this discussion, it's that JO isn't included for Liverpool-Crewe routes, so it's not valid to go Liverpool-Runcorn-Chester-Crewe, whereas Liverpool-Runcorn-Chester is valid on "any permitted" as well as the cheaper "VIA RUNCORN" ticket.
Map JO seems to have had the direct Runcorn-Chester link added to it, along with the Warrington-Runcorn East-Chester line.
We're not sorry, it's all interesting stuff to some of us, you could decide for yourself if you think we ought to have better things to do ........
Actually, no, there wasn't a Runcorn walking option I don't think - the two stations aren't exactly close as you say. The direct link was added to JO and the JO+CV combination added for Chester-Liverpool at the same time, in May 2019, see https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/national-routeing-guide-update.99396/page-34#post-4008366.
Last edited:
You could always enquire with the guard at Liverpool Lime Street, showing them your Liverpool - Crewe ticket and asking if it were OK to remain onboard to Chester. I would imagine they'll be happy to take you on the basis you've paid almost £10/15 and asked politely, and it's not particularly unreasonable to want to do. Coming back in through the ticket gates at Chester isn't guaranteed with that approach though of course.
The "via Runcorn" fare was created by TfW after the Curve (re)gained regular passenger services, operated by them. It didn't exist before, nor did the map combination that now allows travel via Runcorn.
kieron
Established Member
I don't think it is valid via Crewe because of easement 700892 (added in 2019). This says:
The data for the easement also bars Chester-Liverpool South Parkway tickets.