18:45 Waterloo, West Byfleet, Portsmouth

[Collingwood50]

Hi all, first post on the forums.

Quite an odd question I know, but I'm really interested to know the answer The other evening I got the 18:45 from London Waterloo (an hour earlier than my usual home to Haslemere) and I was surprised to see it call at West Byfleet's seldom used Platform 2. Having done some research (and many years experience on the Portsmouth Direct Line) I am fairly sure that this is the only train that includes West Byfleet as a stop, and it may be the only train that uses platform 2?

I know West Byfleet is a big commuter station, but why just the 18:45? Do all West Byfleeter's finish work at exactly 18:45? Is the extra stop a result of a bottleneck? Am I correct in saying this is the only time west byfleet becomes a stop on services to Portsmouth?

So many questions, hope someone can help!

Cheers,
Colly

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Welcome!

The 1845 WAT-PMH is booked to use p2, maybe it was just a one-off exception the night you got it

 

[Collingwood50]

Hey Matt,

I meant Platform 2 sorry!

But why is it booked for West Byfleet? I mean, why does this Portsmouth bound train stop there and not others?

Thanks

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Hey Matt,

I meant Platform 2 sorry!

But why is it booked for West Byfleet? I mean, why does this Portsmouth bound train stop there and not others?

Thanks

It does look like nothing M-F is booked to serve p3.

Anyhow, that is one of the great timetabling mysteries that exist in Britain. I am guessing it may be a late commuter service to relieve the Woking stopper / Alton trains. How many get on / off?

 

[Collingwood50]

It does look like nothing M-F is booked to serve p3.

Anyhow, that is one of the great timetabling mysteries that exist in Britain. I am guessing it may be a late commuter service to relieve the Woking stopper / Alton trains. How many get on / off?

Yes lots got off actually! I was really surprised! But I believe there are 4 trains an hour from Waterloo to West Byfleet, I wonder why 18:00-18:00 requires a fifth. It must just be, as you say to relieve the commuter trains, West Byfleet is a big commuter station! I wonder if any research went into adding this stop!

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Yes lots got off actually! I was really surprised!

That answers your question then. Obviously it just serves the demand then, and is the most convenient train to stop without blocking up the main line and any other trains

 

[thefab444]

I imagine it is intended to provide a fast service to the "influential" West Byfleet commuters leaving work in the City around 18:00. There is an earlier fast service at 17:53 (for people leaving work at 17:00 - 17:30) from Waterloo, although this train also calls at Surbiton, and a later one at 19:25 from Waterloo, which also calls at Clapham Junction. The only other direct services from West Byfleet to Portsmouth are at 05:47 and 06:03! There are no services going the other way.

In the pre-December 2004 timetable, there used to be a 17:54 Waterloo - Haslemere which was fast to West Byfleet then Guildford!

 

[MidnightFlyer]

In the pre-December 2004 timetable, there used to be a 17:54 Waterloo - Haslemere which was fast to West Byfleet then Guildford!

What else changed in that timetable? It seems to crop up a lot with discussions of this nature.

 

[thefab444]

Literally everything. It was a complete recast of all SWT's services, which resulted in additional padding and more stops. The upside of this is that virtually all of SWT's services run on time now even if they are a few minutes slower, whereas previously there was quite a lot of minor late running.

 

[Collingwood50]

I imagine it is intended to provide a fast service to the "influential" West Byfleet commuters leaving work in the City around 18:00. There is an earlier fast service at 17:53 (for people leaving work at 17:00 - 17:30) from Waterloo, although this train also calls at Surbiton, and a later one at 19:25 from Waterloo, which also calls at Clapham Junction. The only other direct services from West Byfleet to Portsmouth are at 05:47 and 06:03! There are no services going the other way.

In the pre-December 2004 timetable, there used to be a 17:54 Waterloo - Haslemere which was fast to West Byfleet then Guildford!

Fascinating thanks! Does research go into this sort of thing? Or do SWT just start stopping there and the good people of West Byfleet started using it?

 

[thefab444]

Fascinating thanks! Does research go into this sort of thing? Or do SWT just start stopping there and the good people of West Byfleet started using it?

There is supposed to be consultation with rail users groups and other interested parties, which is sometimes successful on a minor level e.g. getting an extra stop on a particular service, but often not very successful on a major level e.g. ALUA's campaign against the slower off-peak WAT - AON journey times since '04.

 

[The Colonel]

In the pre-December 2004 timetable, there used to be a 17:54 Waterloo - Haslemere which was fast to West Byfleet then Guildford!

There has been a fast train down in the evening 1st stop W Byfleet for years. It used to be my local station so am familiar with it. It is the only service to use P2. The above stopping pattern does cause the unknowing a few problems. IIRC it used to be a train which was W Byfleet then Farnborough and more than a few punters have sailed through Woking. There used to be a couple of up workings in the late 70's/early 80's that were non stop up from there too. They used to cross from the up slow to fast at Weybridge and the signal protecting the crossover was approach controlled and if it didn't clear a station stop resulted in hoardes joining at Weybridge for a fast run up. When there was a stock shortage once it was regularly formed of CEP units when some were on loan to the SWD.

 

[swt_passenger]

Literally everything. It was a complete recast of all SWT's services, which resulted in additional padding and more stops.

I think the old SWT in house magazines did a report on this at the time, and they were apparently the first, or one of the first, TOCs to use some sort of clever European software to validate the existing timetable, and it was found that operating that timetable relied more on luck than anything, with all sorts of junction conflicts being present if everything ever ran on time...

When the longer dwell times required by the power doors on the new mainline stock were added to the old timetable it was definitely unusable anyway.