25/6.25 kV electrification removed

[alf]

I walked it after it was de wired during the improvements for the virgin pendolinos. It smelt of rats especially where it went under the canal. The other 6 or 7 Euston tracks go over the canal.
It also had a laddered escape hatch which we were invited to explore. It led to a single story cabin which is still next to the most easterly up fast line.

 

[Merle Haggard]

Yes, I did it in one of a pair of the Manchester based 303s on a railtour in 1982:

https://www.sixbellsjunction.co.uk/80s/820904wi.htm

I don't want to doubt you, but are you certain?. The Down Empty Carriage Line which burrows from the East side of Euston to the Down Fast (occasionally used for departures from platforms 1-4 going out fast line) is sometimes referred to, incorrectly, as the 'Rat Hole'. The real Rat Hole was further North (entered around Camden) with a severe dip and reverse curve in the middle. It was said to be so tight that if a loco stalled at the bottom it was physically difficult to leave the cab. Certainly, OLE clearances through a single bore tunnel would be tight and also I thought it closed soon after the Euston rebuilding.

 

[Beebman]

I don't want to doubt you, but are you certain?. The Down Empty Carriage Line which burrows from the East side of Euston to the Down Fast (occasionally used for departures from platforms 1-4 going out fast line) is sometimes referred to, incorrectly, as the 'Rat Hole'. The real Rat Hole was further North (entered around Camden) with a severe dip and reverse curve in the middle. It was said to be so tight that if a loco stalled at the bottom it was physically difficult to leave the cab. Certainly, OLE clearances through a single bore tunnel would be tight and also I thought it closed soon after the Euston rebuilding.

The train definitely went through a narrow tube-like tunnel with stewards in each car making sure that nobody tried to poke their heads out of any of the windows. I've always called it the 'Rat Hole' but am I wrong?

 

[jfollows]

The up empty carriage line as per the attached diagram was definitely wired and I did it on an ECS working from Stonebridge Park/Willesden to Euston back in the late 1970s (with AC electric and Mark 1 stock).

 

[Tester]

The train definitely went through a narrow tube-like tunnel with stewards in each car making sure that nobody tried to poke their heads out of any of the windows. I've always called it the 'Rat Hole' but am I wrong?

I don't think you are wrong.

The line colloquially known as the rat hole was indeed the Up Empty Carriage line, which ran from just south of the Primrose Hill slow line tunnel, branching off from the Up Camden Road line, which itself branched off the Up Slow line, reappearing on the down side further south. It was definitely wired - would have been useless otherwise!

As distinct from the Up Engine line, which ran parallel with the Down Departure line (previously the Down Empty Carriage line), but 'wrong road' i.e. right hand running, much nearer to Euston station.

Both the Up Empty Carriage line and the Up Engine line are gone, but the Down Departure line remains in regular use.

One of my first installation jobs as a trainee in the early 1970s was upgrading the Down Empty Carriage line to passenger standards to become the Down Departure line (which included changing various platform departure route indicators to show 'D' instead of 'C').

I remember at the time fancying a walk through the rat hole but that was a definite no no without a possession, due to the lack of refuges.

 

[jfollows]

My diagrams also show the Up Engine Line No. 2 and the down empty carriage line down departure line. The base diagram dates from the 1960s with my changes from the 1970s as Tester notes in the previous post.

The link from Beebman makes it pretty clear that it was the up empty carriage line used by the 1982 railtour on its return journey. https://www.28dayslater.co.uk/threa...arriage-line-another-one-london-feb-12.69025/ shows pictures from inside the line. #25 believes it was disused since early this century - 2002.

 

[Merle Haggard]

My diagrams also show the Up Engine Line No. 2 and the down empty carriage line down departure line. The base diagram dates from the 1960s with my changes from the 1970s as Tester notes in the previous post.

The link from Beebman makes it pretty clear that it was the up empty carriage line used by the 1982 railtour on its return journey. https://www.28dayslater.co.uk/threa...arriage-line-another-one-london-feb-12.69025/ shows pictures from inside the line. #25 believes it was disused since early this century - 2002.

The former down empty carriage line was passed for passenger use by 1974, when the first Northampton 'Cobbler' service, the 17.15 down, was introduced and booked to use it - my usual commute home from its introduction. Back then it was the only passenger train that used it, but it's much more commonly used now.
The original 'rat hole' was further north, and buried down from the East side at the top of Camden Bank and emerged on the West side near Camden shed. If anyone has 'The Euston and Crewe Companion' that book has side - strips which show it, but at the moment I can't find mine. It was a single track tunnel with sharp curves and gradients subject to flooding. I think that all traces at track level have gone.
I accept that the Up Engine Line no 2 and Down departure/empty carriage lines are now called the 'rat hole' but that was not always the case.

Edit the original query from Elec man (sorry don't know how to link his name) was 'was the rat hole ever electrified?' which does suggest asking about something that no longer exists - perhaps it was the original one he had in mind.

 

[jfollows]

The former down empty carriage line was passed for passenger use by 1974, when the first Northampton 'Cobbler' service, the 17.15 down, was introduced and booked to use it - my usual commute home from its introduction. Back then it was the only passenger train that used it, but it's much more commonly used now.

1B06 shows as the 17:33 in the 1974 timetable I have.
But, indeed, it's now commonly used and much faster, without the horribly slow turnout at the end.

 

[Albaman]

The August 2014 edition of British Railways Illustrated has an article by Peter Costner describing the work involved when installing OHL in this tunnel. I quote below the concluding paragraph :-

"I see from Google Maps that the tunnel is now disused and has no tracks. I wonder why we bothered, but still, it was fun."

 

[Merle Haggard]

1B06 shows as the 17:33 in the 1974 timetable I have.
But, indeed, it's now commonly used and much faster, without the horribly slow turnout at the end.

Yes, memory playing tricks, it was 17.33

I have now remembered another incident, suggesting that it was cleared for passenger use slightly earlier. About 1970 a curious new late working was introduced, a S.O. (? or SuO?) return Watford - Euston old line using the 2 car d.m.u. from the St. Albans branch (I can't remember the rationale - perhaps the new line was closed for some reason). The down departure, about 22.00 or 23.00., was booked out via the former down carriage line. On its first night some of my (Eversholt House) colleagues decided to experience it. Through the tunnel a novel experience but it never got as far as the 'slow turnout at the end' - a down express was signalled and the driver of the d.m.u. presumably misread signals, did a SPAD and then ran through the trap nearly into a wall. (the maps don't quite show this junction, which as you can guess, is trailing into the Down Fast with a trap)

EDIT I think the d.m.u. working might have been Watford-Euston-Bletchley to go to the DED for maintenance, struggling to remember but it was over 50 years ago!

 

[Ken H]

Have the carriage sidings to the west of Stockport station been continuously wired, or were they de-wired and then re-wired. I thought they had been closed for a while but I dont know if the OHLE was removed.

 

[Cricketer8for9]

Thanks for the various replies. I think the answer to my question is “yes” and that this is one more piece of de-electrified overhead track (and in this case not used at all).

I assume the original purpose was to get locos from the up slow over to the departure side of Euston, which were the higher numbered platforms.

 

[jfollows]

The original 'rat hole' was further north, and buried down from the East side at the top of Camden Bank and emerged on the West side near Camden shed. If anyone has 'The Euston and Crewe Companion' that book has side - strips which show it, but at the moment I can't find mine. It was a single track tunnel with sharp curves and gradients subject to flooding. I think that all traces at track level have gone.

Last time I looked I think the up end portal of the up empty carriage line was still visible on the west side of the formation, with some large piece of signalling equipment plonked immediately in front of it.

 

[Merle Haggard]

Last time I looked I think the up end portal of the up empty carriage line was still visible on the west side of the formation, with some large piece of signalling equipment plonked immediately in front of it.

Maybe slightly cross purposes - when I said there was no trace I meant the underpass at the top of the bank.

As an aside (and from my not always reliable memory) the up end portal had boards over each line which read 'LINE X' and 'LINE 0'. Does anyone know what the significance was ?

 

[jfollows]

As an aside (and from my not always reliable memory) the up end portal had boards over each line which read 'LINE X' and 'LINE 0'. Does anyone know what the significance was ?

Line X is the former down departure line, see diagrams posted at #27

 

[adrock1976]

The up empty carriage line as per the attached diagram was definitely wired and I did it on an ECS working from Stonebridge Park/Willesden to Euston back in the late 1970s (with AC electric and Mark 1 stock).

Regarding the lines that are labelled "Euston Electric", are those the present day Watford DC lines?

 

[jfollows]

Regarding the lines that are labelled "Euston Electric", are those the present day Watford DC lines?

Yes they are. “DC Electric” today.

 

[adrock1976]

Yes they are. “DC Electric” today.

Many thanks.

 

[QueensCurve]

The Liverpool Grid Iron, reportedly enough equipment being scrapped to electrify the entire Chat Moss route.

Can someone enlighten me as to what the Edge Hill Grid Iron was?

 

[Wyrleybart]

Some more in the West Midlands:
Windsor Street goods - closed entirely in the 70s
Albion oil terminal - de-electrified in the late 70s/early 80s the terminal itself closed in the 90s (I think)
Wolverhampton Steel terminal - line is still open but de-electrified in the late 80s/90s

Whilst there wasn't OLE into it, I think the track on the upside leading to Tipton Gas was electrified. I remember the reach wagons in a siding there.

 

[507 001]

Can someone enlighten me as to what the Edge Hill Grid Iron was?

It was essentially a huge complex of sidings and marshalling yards located on the north side of the line between what’s now Wavertree technology park and Edge Hill.

 

[Merle Haggard]

It was essentially a huge complex of sidings and marshalling yards located on the north side of the line between what’s now Wavertree technology park and Edge Hill.

A grid iron was the (usually) cast-iron grill for meat, the yard was so called because of its resemblance in plan - parallel lines with an encircling one. The yard had two successive fans of marshalling sidings connected by a single road. This was so that not only could incoming traffic (mainly from the docks, I think) be sorted into trains for each departure but then sorted so that each train was formed in order with destination portions together - so that, at each intermediate location, wagons for that location were together at what was by then the rear of the train. In a single yard that would require several shunts.
Basically, you sorted by destination in the first yard, then from that sort built up trains in the second, but there was a little more to it than that. And all done 24hrs whatever the weather. Easy...
There have been articles about it over the years, and Clapham and later the N.R.M. had a model - don't know whether it's still on display .

 

[Beebman]

It was essentially a huge complex of sidings and marshalling yards located on the north side of the line between what’s now Wavertree technology park and Edge Hill.

On the subject of electrification at Edge Hill, some time ago I discovered the attached photo (from the Edge Hill Station website) dated 1971 which was taken at the entrance to the Waterloo Tunnel that ran down to the docks and Liverpool Riverside Station. It apparently shows 25kV OHLE running into the tunnel but on closer inspection there's an 'Electric Trains Stop Here' sign to the left and I recall reading somewhere that the wires terminated just inside the tunnel mouth.

 

[Jamesrob637]

One track in Laira Depot (Plymouth) briefly for visiting electric locomotives to show off their pantographs at an open day 30+ years ago.

 

[D6130]

On the subject of electrification at Edge Hill, some time ago I discovered the attached photo (from the Edge Hill Station website) dated 1971 which was taken at the entrance to the Waterloo Tunnel that ran down to the docks and Liverpool Riverside Station. It apparently shows 25kV OHLE running into the tunnel but on closer inspection there's an 'Electric Trains Stop Here' sign to the left and I recall reading somewhere that the wires terminated just inside the tunnel mouth.

Wonderful photo! Is that a BR class 02 or a Mersey Docks and Harbour Board shunter?

 

[Beebman]

Wonderful photo! Is that a BR class 02 or a Mersey Docks and Harbour Board shunter?

According to the photo caption on the Edge Hill website it's MDHB no.37.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

There was a long electrified siding where the new car park was built at Wakefield Westgate - never used to my knowledge but presumably put in to allow a Mark 4 set to be recessed there if needed.

That was the old car terminal mentioned in post #16. Not sure it was ever intended as a refuge siding for IC225s, as Wrenthorpe loop is also available nearby. Think it was just wired along with the rest of the area because it was there, and perhaps BR hoped that they might be able to use electric locos on freight services. Not sure anything ever used those wires while they were in place, as it fell out of use not long after electrification.

 

[Dr Hoo]

The Liverpool Grid Iron, reportedly enough equipment being scrapped to electrify the entire Chat Moss route.

Can someone enlighten me as to what the Edge Hill Grid Iron was?

I attach a map of said yards. The 'Grid Irons' were a relatively small part of a much larger complex, commonly called the Edge Hill Sorting Sidings. The connection to what we would think of as the WCML towards Runcorn is bottom centre.

I must admit that I didn't know that the yards were electrified. There appears to be no mention of it in O S Nock's book Britain's New Railway or in contemporary BR press releases or magazines. I've never seen a photograph either. It seems rather odd to have wired an 85-year old set of yards in the Modernisation Plan era of new yards (like Tyne). I realise that Lancashire never really got a modern yard.

 

[D6975]

Has anybody mentioned Tilbury Riverside yet? Only a short branch off the LTS southern main line, I did the line many years ago just before it closed.

 

[jfollows]

Has anybody mentioned Tilbury Riverside yet? Only a short branch off the LTS southern main line, I did the line many years ago just before it closed.

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