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27th January - Plan B easing - observations and usage

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greyman42

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If Johnson is noted for telling porkies that no one should believe, why should we stop wearing masks just because he says so? Or do some on here believe some of the things he says, whilst disbelieving most of his other utterings?
The reason most people who have stopped wearing flimsy masks will have had nothing to do with Boris and more to do with the science.
 

Xenophon PCDGS

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The reason most people who have stopped wearing flimsy masks will have had nothing to do with Boris and more to do with the science.
I thought many of here also disbelieved in "the science" when delivered by either of those two highly placed flanking medical and scientific cohorts who seemed to be a permanent fixture at the once daily pandemic update.

Whitty being the one remembered by most.
 

bramling

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If Johnson is noted for telling porkies that no one should believe, why should we stop wearing masks just because he says so? Or do some on here believe some of the things he says, whilst disbelieving most of his other utterings?

That statement is simply ridiculous. People can assess information and make up their own minds. In any case, most people on here didn’t believe Johnson when masks first came in!
 

Dent

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If Johnson is noted for telling porkies that no one should believe, why should we stop wearing masks just because he says so? Or do some on here believe some of the things he says, whilst disbelieving most of his other utterings?

Who was saying you should stop wearing a mask just because Johnson says so? I can't see the post you are responding to.
 

Dent

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It was a generalised comment made in "deference" to those who don't believe a single word that comes out of his mouth.
So basically it is nothing but a strawman. No one had said anyone should stop wearing a mask "because Johnson says so", and Johnson has not told anyone to stop wearing a mask anyway.
 

Xenophon PCDGS

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So basically it is nothing but a strawman. No one had said anyone should stop wearing a mask "because Johnson says so", and Johnson has not told anyone to stop wearing a mask anyway.
Don't call it a strawman. Have the common decency to accept a generalised comment in the manner it was so intended.

Or is this forum now subject to Momentum-type strictures where free speech and personal views are to be suppressed...<D<D<(
 

Dent

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Don't call it a strawman. Have the common decency to accept a generalised comment in the manner it was so intended.

Or is this forum now subject to Momentum-type strictures where free speech and personal views are to be suppressed...<D<D<(
You were referring to stopping wearing masks because Johnson says so, which no relation to anything anyone had said, on Johnson had said no such thing. That fits the definition of a strawman pretty well. I don't think leaving blatent logical fallacies unchallenged is a requirement of "common decency".

Who is suppressing free speech and personal views? That sounds like another strawman.
 

Xenophon PCDGS

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You were referring to stopping wearing masks because Johnson says so, which no relation to anything anyone had said, on Johnson had said no such thing. That fits the definition of a strawman pretty well. I don't think leaving blatent logical fallacies unchallenged is a requirement of "common decency".

Who is suppressing free speech and personal views? That sounds like another strawman.
You need to understand that both in media and on internet platforms, various matters have occurred where civil servants have been the prime mover, but then in comments made on those referred-to platforms, it was stressed that Johnson was the head of these by the very nature of his office as Prime Minister, so the final blame lies solely with him. I cannot believe that you are unaware of those statements yet do not allow me the ability to follow the same line of reasoning in making the similar assumption that Johnson could be said to be in the position of Prime Minister when civil servants put forward their views on mask wearing.

I have no wish to continue with your deliberate obfuscation that you employ and at the ripe old age of 76, I have had many years' experiences of dealing with matters appertaining and did not spend my last thirty-five years at the top echelon of senior management without seeing somewhat younger staff attempting to make their points known. I will cite you an oft-quoted example of attempts of young middle-management overstepping the mark. In my capacity as Senior Head of Projects, it was normal that I would hold conversation with heads of middle management. One day, during such a discussion, a young 24-year-old trainee manager climbing the ladder of sucess, deliberately came up to us whilst the discussion between us on a certain manner was in progress and bombastically burst into the conversation with a somewhat puerile attempt to sway matters, even though he had only been in the position for three weeks and knew naught of the intracies involved in the matter under discussion,

I just told him to desist then said...."Jeremy, when the doctor is talking to the patient, he does not expect the disease to "chip in". Young Jeremy then lost those weeks of management training and was sent back to the department he came from originally.

My final riposte is that I will now remove myself from this thread.
 
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bramling

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You need to understand that both in media and on internet platforms, various matters have occurred where civil servants have been the prime mover, but then in comments made on those referred-to platforms, it was stressed that Johnson was the head of these by the very nature of his office as Prime Minister, so the final blame lies solely with him. I cannot believe that you are unaware of those statements yet do not allow me the ability to follow the same line of reasoning in making the similar assumption that Johnson could be said to be in the position of Prime Minister when civil servants put forward their views on mask wearing.

I have no wish to continue with your deliberate obfuscation that you employ and at the ripe old age of 76, I have had many years' experiences of dealing with matters appertaining and did not spend my last thirty-five years at the top echelon of senior management without seeing somewhat younger staff attempting to make their points known. I will cite you an oft-quoted example of attempts of young middle-management overstepping the mark. In my capacity as Senior Head of Projects, it was normal that I would hold conversation with heads of middle management. One day, during such a discussion, a young 24-year-old trainee manager climbing the ladder of sucess, deliberately came up to us whilst the discussion between us on a certain manner was in progress and bombastically burst into the conversation with a somewhat puerile attempt to sway matters, even though he had only been in the position for three weeks and knew naught of the intracies involved in the matter under discussion,

I just told him to desist then said...."Jeremy, when the doctor is talking to the patient, he does not expect the disease to "chip in". Young Jeremy then lost those weeks of management training and was sent back to the department he came from originally.

I’m afraid I find it hard to follow any of this.

You’re attempting to make a connexion between

(i) the notion that Johnson initially claimed to have no knowledge of the disputed events having occurred, to which when it was subsequently proven he was actually *at* such an event the line changed to being merely that he didn’t think he was doing anything wrong.

and

(ii) that first of all we were told masks “do more harm than good”, then that we must wear them in selected settings, then it became personal choice, then that we should wear them again, and now as of last Thursday it’s again personal choice.

Two completely separate issues as far as I can see.
 

Pete_uk

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Anyway...
Town today was busy. Only a few masks in evidence and only one being worn outside.
 

Class 33

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I travelled on four buses today in Bristol. And also went shopping in Asda and B & M. Here is my short reports of the mask wearing situation....

Bus journey 1 - Only about a dozen or so people on there. Though about 80% wearing masks, which was a surprise. Mind you I seen another bus overtake this one and it looked like the mask wearing situation was the other way around on that one!

Bus journey 2 - Probably about 45 or so people on this bus during my journey. I'd say only about 50% wearing masks.

Bus journey 3 - Only about 15 or so people on there. About 60% wearing masks.

Bus journey 4 - Did get very busy on this journey, reaching up to about 75 people by the time I got off. Only about 40% wearing masks!


B & M - Only about 50% of customers wearing masks. All staff I noticed there were not wearing masks.

Asda - Only about 45% of customers wearing masks. Of the staff I noticed there, only about 10% of them wearing masks.


Just a couple of days after those mandatory face masks laws were scrapped(again!), some pretty encouraging signs I think! A fair old number of people are no longer wearing them, and more will continue to do so over the coming weeks.
 

bramling

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Bit disappointing this evening.

A quick visit to a full-size Sainsbury’s - I’d say about 80% masked.

Then a longer visit to Tesco - about 50/50.

I would have thought the amount of mask use would have been a bit less on a Saturday evening, to be honest.
 

Huntergreed

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We were in Newcastle Central station earlier, and I was pleasantly surprised at the lack of masks (I think @yorkie did a count, and at one point found only one passenger (out of many) wearing one)

I’ve been quite pleasantly surprised at how few masks I’ve seen in Newcastle in general to be honest!
 

Phil R

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Trip to that there London today for a concert.
Train up maybe 20% hiding their fizzogs.
Tube maybe a bit more than that.
Pub 0%.
Concert venue mayhem outside. Covid passes were being demanded. No prior advice of this requirement. Some seemed to be sadly abandoning ship at this point. Groups held back while they panickly downloaded new Covid passes or found expired ones or random bits of paper and obviously passed through in unchecked clumps when the security bods realised it was causing a farce.
Mask and social distance signs inside. I saw 3 people wearing a mask but there may have been more.
Bus after, maybe 20% masked, wasn't really paying attention.
Train home 10% at most.
 

johntea

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My friend set me a WhatsApp earlier ‘have you got a spare mask I’ve lost mine and Sainsburys still require them!’…I quickly corrected them on that assumption!

No staff at the local Morrisons wearing masks…I was also at a venue the other night where the staff were rather happy they no longer had to bother

Seems the elderly are far more prominent in retains their masks in my local area anyway
 

_toommm_

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My university is still harassing people to wear them. They’ve stationed a student (presumably a first-year) at the front door telling people to wear masks.

As a small class we’ve of course decided we’re not wearing them, and when she asked me I quickly shot her down that Plan B restrictions have ended meaning they’re no longer mandatory.

On a similar vein, we’ve had quite a few angry complaints about people not wearing face masks at work from the public. Some people didn’t realise they didn’t have to wear one, but were relieved when I told them it was now a personal choice!
 

90sWereBetter

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I had the fortunate position to be in London between Wednesday and yesterday so could experience the rules change (or lack thereof) in real time. Hardly anyone was wearing masks on my Greater Anglia train to Stratford (1300 from Norwich to Liverpool Street on Wednesday), even the conductor didn't bother with an announcement despite it still being mandatory for another couple of hours.

Thursday was a hybrid day for me. I went on a long travelling trip on TfL to continue my goal of 100% completion of the tube, bus and rail network. Mask usage was almost non-existent early mornings, but would increase in the peak. As such, with double deck routes I would wear a mask to get on the bus, then immediately take it off once I sat down. I initially wasn't so confident on tubes or single deck buses, so continued to "wear" a mask for a while. I know this is silly but I needed to build my confidence up so I felt like it wouldn't be judged by other passengers on Tfl services. I was confident enough to go maskless on Thameslink, Southern, and Southeastern services from the get go.

By Friday lunchtime I was now fully confident there would be no issues, and thus went maskless on every form of transport, and it was the most normal travelling trip in London I've done since February 2020. More of this please.

Only comment I heard about masks was from a passenger in a visor on a Thameslink service going through Elephant and Castle at Thursday lunchtime. I could hear her going through the train and muttering "no mask!" at people sat down.

Looking forward to my next trip to London at the end of February, which will be 100% maskless. :)
 

102 fan

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It's looking like masks have become dummy tits for for some adults.
 

Class 33

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Had to get a few more bits of shopping today. Was in Bristol's Broadmead shopping centre. Here are my observations.

Poundland - Only about 30% of people wearing masks! Though in there they did have the annoying PA announcement going off which they had from 19th July last year, which went something like this "At Poundland your safety is our top priority. And like you, we know it's not over. So you may like to wear a face covering and keep your distance. We're still in this together. Poundland. Keeping you safe". They need to drop this PA announcement, as I think the vast majority of people are sick and tired now of hearing about face coverings/face masks, keep your distance and "We're still in this together"!!!! Social distancing was scrapped over 6 months ago now anyway, and near enough everyone has moved on from that now! Good to see low numbers of people wearing masks in that store thogh.

Another Poundland(because that other one didn't have what I wanted in stock!) - Again probably about 30% of people wearing masks. Didn't hear that annoying PA announcement in that one. If they're not putting that PA announcement out, I'll go in that one rather than that other one where it goes off every few minutes!

Tesco Express - Only about 25% of people wearing masks!

Wilkinsons - About 40% of people wearing masks.

And in The Galleries Shopping Centre - probably only about 30% of people wearing masks.

Really encouraging the way things are going. Face mask use is dropping off much quicker compared to 19th July.
 

GC class B1

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Mask wearing today in this area is still very variable. Still about 80% in Asda but hardly anybody in Greggs. It appears that mask wearing is higher in the older age groups.
 

greyman42

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We were in Newcastle Central station earlier, and I was pleasantly surprised at the lack of masks (I think @yorkie did a count, and at one point found only one passenger (out of many) wearing one)

I’ve been quite pleasantly surprised at how few masks I’ve seen in Newcastle in general to be honest!
I spend a fair bit of time in the North East and have found that people never really bought into the mask mandates, which is great.
 

island

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At the start of last July, my church had messaging of "from 25 July it will be up to you whether to continue to wear a mask", but on the 18th this abruptly changed to "keep wearing a face covering for now". This message kept going for the rest of the year including when it became legally mandatory again. However, as of today, the newsletter has been updated and now says "you can choose whether you want to wear a mask or not".

Around 15% of the congregation were unmasked today. I expect that will grow in due course.

Meanwhile at the independent stores in the immediate area, an upmarket part of London SE3, mask-wearing is still being enforced. Chain stores predominantly don't care though a few still have signage up.

Apple Store had "masks recommended" signs and a few old "mandatory" signs but staff, who were all masked, quite properly did not make any comments towards the small handful of unmasked customers.
 

Class 33

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Am on a busy National Express coach to London. Only about. 30 percent of passengers wearing masks. Though on departure from Bristol, the pre-recorded PA announcement mentioned "it is a legal requirement to wear face coverings on public transport"!! Err.. not anymore it's not!!
 

Eyersey468

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Am on a busy National Express coach to London. Only about. 30 percent of passengers wearing masks. Though on departure from Bristol, the pre-recorded PA announcement mentioned "it is a legal requirement to wear face coverings on public transport"!! Err.. not anymore it's not!!
I drive coaches for NX and with regards to that announcement we have been told all the coaches should get their announcement CDs changed this weekend. The good news is the new announcement makes no mention of masks at all.
 
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