A bit of Train Watching in 'N' (1970/80s West Coast)

[Andy R. A.]

A 25 minute splicing together of some video clips of the layout over the past couple of weeks, with some added non-DCC sound effects.

 

[Iskra]

Excellent work, I just popped that on the TV and it made me feel like I was there in the station! I particularly like the Tube stock, motorail service and TPO train. I’ve got to say N-gauge really does give a great impression of the speed of fast intercity services dashing through a platform

Can I request the pair of class 20’s feature in the next video (if they are operable) please?

How easy is the layout to operate?

 

[Cowley]

A 25 minute splicing together of some video clips of the layout over the past couple of weeks, with some added non-DCC sound effects.

That was brilliant Andy. To see all those prototypical length trains in their natural surroundings is wonderful.

 

[Andy R. A.]

Excellent work, I just popped that on the TV and it made me feel like I was there in the station! I particularly like the Tube stock, motorail service and TPO train. I’ve got to say N-gauge really does give a great impression of the speed of fast intercity services dashing through a platform

Can I request the pair of class 20’s feature in the next video (if they are operable) please?

How easy is the layout to operate?

Strange, I had to look back through some of my past videos to find them at work. Will have to include them in the next video I do. However here are a pair operating a while back on an earlier video.

The layout was designed from the start so it could be operated by one person. The Controls are arranged around the Central Control area so that you can use an Office Swivel chair to access everything. The four main lines can be put into 'Auto' via the 10 road storage yards for each line. A Heathcote Electronic unit will cycle through each siding in turn so as one train arrives the next departs. This way you can operate the DC/New Line end to end section in manual.

 

[Iskra]

Wow! That is quite the set up! That must have been quite the build! Definitely worth it though

 

[Cowley]

@Andy R. A. - Am I right in remembering that you did a video with a camera fitted for a drivers eye view?

 

[Andy R. A.]

@Andy R. A. - Am I right in remembering that you did a video with a camera fitted for a drivers eye view?

Yes, I got a miniature 'Cube Cam' which cost £13.98. It's probably not the best of quality as it tries to focus while moving. It's surprising just how 'undulating' the track is, when it looks quite level at normal viewing distances. However it was useful as I spotted loads of things from the Driver's eye view that needed looking at. This is the one that is on You Tube. I did some others for the Layout's Facebook page but the quality seems to have deteriorated over time.

 

[Cowley]

Yes, I got a miniature 'Cube Cam' which cost £13.98. It's probably not the best of quality as it tries to focus while moving. It's surprising just how 'undulating' the track is, when it looks quite level at normal viewing distances. However it was useful as I spotted loads of things from the Driver's eye view that needed looking at. This is the one that is on You Tube. I did some others for the Layout's Facebook page but the quality seems to have deteriorated over time.

View attachment 146904

Brilliant thank you.

 

[Peter C]

A 25 minute splicing together of some video clips of the layout over the past couple of weeks, with some added non-DCC sound effects.

I've just been giving this one a watch Andy, and I think it's brilliant! Obviously the modelling is great by itself, but having the the sounds just adds that little extra bit of atmosphere. Being able to watch a scale-length express storm past (or a full-length freight, for that matter) is just amazing - it's making me wonder whether I should've gone for N gauge to begin with...

-Peter

 

[Andy R. A.]

I've just been giving this one a watch Andy, and I think it's brilliant! Obviously the modelling is great by itself, but having the the sounds just adds that little extra bit of atmosphere. Being able to watch a scale-length express storm past (or a full-length freight, for that matter) is just amazing - it's making me wonder whether I should've gone for N gauge to begin with...

-Peter

Thank you for those kind words.

 

[Cowley]

it's making me wonder whether I should've gone for N gauge to begin with...

-Peter

Yes, yes you should have.

Move to dark side Peter…

 

[Andy R. A.]

As the last video was well received I cobbled together another selection into a 27 minute Youtube creation made over the last seven days. With added non-DCC sound.

 

[Class15]

That’s an absolutely amazing layout! Inspirational to say the least! Do you have a rough estimate of how much all that cost by any chance, so I can think about trying something like that myself?

 

[Andy R. A.]

That’s an absolutely amazing layout! Inspirational to say the least! Do you have a rough estimate of how much all that cost by any chance, so I can think about trying something like that myself?

Hmmm... Really hard to say. Some of the things have been reused over the past 40 years or so, along with a steadily accumulated amount of Locos and Rolling Stock. Other things were 'stockpiled' over a few years while waiting for the space to become available, so with increasing prices it would only an 'off the top of my head' guess at what it would cost nowadays, bot certainly not less than 10k I would imagine.

 

[Cowley]

Hmmm... Really hard to say. Some of the things have been reused over the past 40 years or so, along with a steadily accumulated amount of Locos and Rolling Stock. Other things were 'stockpiled' over a few years while waiting for the space to become available, so with increasing prices it would only an 'off the top of my head' guess at what it would cost nowadays, bot certainly not less than 10k I would imagine.

Andy, couple of questions from me - Do you run much Graham Farish Poole era stuff now or have you replaced them with newer models?

Also with the older models did you upgrade them in any way (finer scale wheels etc)?

Do you run any Dapol models and if so how do you find them?

 

[Andy R. A.]

Andy, couple of questions from me - Do you run much Graham Farish Poole era stuff now or have you replaced them with newer models?

There are still a number of the earlier Poole era Graham Farish Models I still run. The ones that had the brass gears or white nylon ones run quite well still, but I have spent some time rooting out various 'split gears' on the later Poole ones. There have been a few 'failures' with the early three pole motors, but in most cases I removed most of the motor and gears to leave an un-powered version, with a lot of still serviceable spare parts going to keep the others running. The un-powered ones still come in useful to populate the Depot area while the 'runners' do the work on the Main Line. It is noticeable on the amount of detail that's missing off the early ones, but I did go to the effort of getting some detailing packs with things like etched brass roof grills. However, not all the early models have got them. While newer models have been added I was a bit loathe to part with my earlier ones, each has its own story where I would travel widely to the four corners of the country visiting the once extensive network of Model Shops, the majority of which no longer exist.

Also with the older models did you upgrade them in any way (finer scale wheels etc)?

There were few that I actually got round to 'upgrading'. I did change quite a few of the old three pole motors for five pole, but some of the locos still have their original wheels, but haven't encountered many problems running on fine scale track. Many of the early Farish coaches/wagons, and Peco wagons have had their wheelsets changed for blackened metal ones. Even so there are still some items of Rolling Stock running with the old 'Pizza Cutter' wheelsets. Having now switched to a 'Retirement Budget' the replacement programme has 'hit the buffers' to use that worn out phrase. I did part with some of my Coaching Stock fleet which consited of older models. (Yes I did run Lima Mark 1s, Deltics and 31s many moons ago, but they were the first to be sold off. The Lima 86s were retained and had their bodies 'stretched' and now run on Farish 87 mechanisms). I retained a lot of the old Farish coaches which had the removeable window strips, and were converted to other vehicles/EMU/DMUs using the old Taylor inserts, which still run today. Others, plus the old Minitrix Mark 1s were converted to other stock with etched Brass sides from the likes of B H Enterprises and Worsley Works. I suppose you could call me a consummate hoarder who is loathe to part with anything as they might come in useful some time.

Do you run any Dapol models and if so how do you find them?

I have quite a number of Dapol models now. The largest group consists of the 86s with ten now in service, and I must say I find them a very good model. They pull a normal twelve coach set at scale speeds with the Power setting on the controllers in the three quarters setting. They go up the Main Line gradients of 1 in 70 with ease. A couple I 'modified' the flexicoil bogies to turn them into 86/0s. So far, fingers crossed, I haven't had a bad runner yet out of the ten or so examples I have. I have one Dapol 56 which is slightly less powerful than the Farish examples I have, but still runs reasonably well. I have a handful of the 73s, which I find are quite capable of handling most of the loads on the layout, although I usually 'double up' these when supposedly running on Diesel Power. I have a couple of 'Hymeks', and some 26s, which come out every so often, and run okay. There are also a couple of Dapol 'Bubble Cars' which run well. As yet I haven't encountered any running trouble with any of my Dapol models.

Later this morning I hope to upload another 25 minute session on Youtube from the past week or so.

 

[Andy R. A.]

The latest edition compilation video from the past week.

 

[Cowley]

There are still a number of the earlier Poole era Graham Farish Models I still run. The ones that had the brass gears or white nylon ones run quite well still, but I have spent some time rooting out various 'split gears' on the later Poole ones. There have been a few 'failures' with the early three pole motors, but in most cases I removed most of the motor and gears to leave an un-powered version, with a lot of still serviceable spare parts going to keep the others running. The un-powered ones still come in useful to populate the Depot area while the 'runners' do the work on the Main Line. It is noticeable on the amount of detail that's missing off the early ones, but I did go to the effort of getting some detailing packs with things like etched brass roof grills. However, not all the early models have got them. While newer models have been added I was a bit loathe to part with my earlier ones, each has its own story where I would travel widely to the four corners of the country visiting the once extensive network of Model Shops, the majority of which no longer exist.


There were few that I actually got round to 'upgrading'. I did change quite a few of the old three pole motors for five pole, but some of the locos still have their original wheels, but haven't encountered many problems running on fine scale track. Many of the early Farish coaches/wagons, and Peco wagons have had their wheelsets changed for blackened metal ones. Even so there are still some items of Rolling Stock running with the old 'Pizza Cutter' wheelsets. Having now switched to a 'Retirement Budget' the replacement programme has 'hit the buffers' to use that worn out phrase. I did part with some of my Coaching Stock fleet which consited of older models. (Yes I did run Lima Mark 1s, Deltics and 31s many moons ago, but they were the first to be sold off. The Lima 86s were retained and had their bodies 'stretched' and now run on Farish 87 mechanisms). I retained a lot of the old Farish coaches which had the removeable window strips, and were converted to other vehicles/EMU/DMUs using the old Taylor inserts, which still run today. Others, plus the old Minitrix Mark 1s were converted to other stock with etched Brass sides from the likes of B H Enterprises and Worsley Works. I suppose you could call me a consummate hoarder who is loathe to part with anything as they might come in useful some time.


I have quite a number of Dapol models now. The largest group consists of the 86s with ten now in service, and I must say I find them a very good model. They pull a normal twelve coach set at scale speeds with the Power setting on the controllers in the three quarters setting. They go up the Main Line gradients of 1 in 70 with ease. A couple I 'modified' the flexicoil bogies to turn them into 86/0s. So far, fingers crossed, I haven't had a bad runner yet out of the ten or so examples I have. I have one Dapol 56 which is slightly less powerful than the Farish examples I have, but still runs reasonably well. I have a handful of the 73s, which I find are quite capable of handling most of the loads on the layout, although I usually 'double up' these when supposedly running on Diesel Power. I have a couple of 'Hymeks', and some 26s, which come out every so often, and run okay. There are also a couple of Dapol 'Bubble Cars' which run well. As yet I haven't encountered any running trouble with any of my Dapol models.

Later this morning I hope to upload another 25 minute session on Youtube from the past week or so.

A very comprehensive and interesting answer. Thanks Andy.

 

[Andy R. A.]

The latest bit of 'train watching' video added today.

 

[Class15]

The latest bit of 'train watching' video added today.

Great video again!

There are still a number of the earlier Poole era Graham Farish Models I still run. The ones that had the brass gears or white nylon ones run quite well still, but I have spent some time rooting out various 'split gears' on the later Poole ones. There have been a few 'failures' with the early three pole motors, but in most cases I removed most of the motor and gears to leave an un-powered version, with a lot of still serviceable spare parts going to keep the others running. The un-powered ones still come in useful to populate the Depot area while the 'runners' do the work on the Main Line. It is noticeable on the amount of detail that's missing off the early ones, but I did go to the effort of getting some detailing packs with things like etched brass roof grills. However, not all the early models have got them. While newer models have been added I was a bit loathe to part with my earlier ones, each has its own story where I would travel widely to the four corners of the country visiting the once extensive network of Model Shops, the majority of which no longer exist.

Do you use the unpowered models as one loco in a pair at all, with the other loco powering?

 

[Andy R. A.]

Do you use the unpowered models as one loco in a pair at all, with the other loco powering?

The pairing of the 25s are usually both powered models, although I have tried a powered/non-powered pair I found this proved to be a little taxing for a solitary 25 hauling the lengthy freights I run plus pulling the dummy loco. The powered pairs run well together, and I have around twenty 25s at the moment. I have a few unpowered examples which I mostly use as static 'poses' around the Depot area.

 

[D1511]

Utterly magnificent! If I had this at home I'd never go anywhere!
What models are the roarers please? I've only ever seen a N gauge 85, stretched to fit on a Dapol 86 chassis, so it's too long by over a metre.

 

[Andy R. A.]

Utterly magnificent! If I had this at home I'd never go anywhere!
What models are the roarers please? I've only ever seen a N gauge 85, stretched to fit on a Dapol 86 chassis, so it's too long by over a metre.

The Roarers were mostly made by shortening a Farish 87 body, filling in the original bodyside detail, and inserting new windows and grills. The cab windows were replaced, and a bit of re-profiling of the front ends with a file. The shortened body was then fitted onto a Minitrix class 27 mechanism with a little revision of the topside wiring to lower the body height. Some pictures of a conversion can be seen here. All the early AC types were made in the same manner by positioning the various grills and windows accordingly. Recently I modified some Dapol 86s in the same manner.

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.142104899761362&type=3

 

[Cowley]

The Roarers were mostly made by shortening a Farish 87 body, filling in the original bodyside detail, and inserting new windows and grills. The cab windows were replaced, and a bit of re-profiling of the front ends with a file. The shortened body was then fitted onto a Minitrix class 27 mechanism with a little revision of the topside wiring to lower the body height. Some pictures of a conversion can be seen here. All the early AC types were made in the same manner by positioning the various grills and windows accordingly. Recently I modified some Dapol 86s in the same manner.

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.142104899761362&type=3

You make it sound easy Andy but that’s a hell of a project to take on.

Like everything on your railway it’s very impressive.

 

[D1511]

The Roarers were mostly made by shortening a Farish 87 body, filling in the original bodyside detail, and inserting new windows and grills. The cab windows were replaced, and a bit of re-profiling of the front ends with a file. The shortened body was then fitted onto a Minitrix class 27 mechanism with a little revision of the topside wiring to lower the body height. Some pictures of a conversion can be seen here. All the early AC types were made in the same manner by positioning the various grills and windows accordingly. Recently I modified some Dapol 86s in the same manner.

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.142104899761362&type=3

That's fantastic work, and your understated and modest description of how you've essentially made them yourself underplays the incredible skills and attention to detail you have. They look really superb and well worth the many hours I'm very sure they each took to make.
The absence of factory models of AL1 to AL5 is an odd hole in the N gauge catalogue if you ask me, as 81s and 85s in particular were the backbone of the WCML for the thick end of 30 years, and many of us were very fond of them. A sound-fitted roarer would surely be a popular model!
Your layout is really wonderful, and is set exactly at the time when my active rail enthusiasm was at its peak, and I could quite genuinely watch your videos on repeat for hours on end. Thank you so much for sharing them and for fuelling my nostalgia and prompting so many fond memories.

 

[Andy R. A.]

That's fantastic work, and your understated and modest description of how you've essentially made them yourself underplays the incredible skills and attention to detail you have. They look really superb and well worth the many hours I'm very sure they each took to make.
The absence of factory models of AL1 to AL5 is an odd hole in the N gauge catalogue if you ask me, as 81s and 85s in particular were the backbone of the WCML for the thick end of 30 years, and many of us were very fond of them. A sound-fitted roarer would surely be a popular model!
Your layout is really wonderful, and is set exactly at the time when my active rail enthusiasm was at its peak, and I could quite genuinely watch your videos on repeat for hours on end. Thank you so much for sharing them and for fuelling my nostalgia and prompting so many fond memories.

Here are some photos from some of the latest conversions I have done in the last couple of years, this time using a Dapol 86. The original Dapol mechanisms didn't go to waste, as I used them to replace some of my older Farish Class 87 mechanisms. The replacement for the shortened 86 body are still Minitrix class 27 mechanisms, and surprisingly loads still turn up on the secondhand market for as little as £30 to £35. Bargain. These Minitrix mechanisms are really powerful, and haul my 18 vehicle Motorail set with ease. I should say that the body length is still about 3mm out from the true size, but I built the conversions to fit the available chassis.




This is my latest video compilation of trains running on the layout for those who may have not already seen it. 30 minutes of 70s/80s action.

 

[D1511]

Brilliant stuff again. Great to see the detail of how you make them in the pictures, and I thoroughly enjoyed the video again. That's quite a collection of locos and rolling stock you have.....I don't think I've seen the same formation twice in viewing all of your videos!

These are the 85s that Leicester modellers are 3D printing and selling on Ebay that I'm sure you will have seen, but the spaces between the windows are too big and overall it's about a metre too long in scale, although it looks pretty decent in this view. You get battery boxes and suspension parts to adapt the donor 86 chassis, so everything except the length is fine. Roof details are decent too, as you can see.

 

[Andy R. A.]

Brilliant stuff again. Great to see the detail of how you make them in the pictures, and I thoroughly enjoyed the video again. That's quite a collection of locos and rolling stock you have.....I don't think I've seen the same formation twice in viewing all of your videos!

There are 10 Storage Roads for each of the four Main Lines, and the trains run in sequence through Roads 1 to 10 on each before repeating the sequence again. Although some sets remain captive to either the Up or Down direction several sets like the Postal, Motorail, Manchester and Liverpool Pullmans do get swopped about every so often for either the southbound or northbound direction. I have made marshalling the sets slightly different to try and make the running sequences more 'interesting'. Having been doing the various conversions of AC Electrics over many years means I don't have to 'flog to death' certain members of the class, and change them over every few circuits or so to even out the requirement for any maintenance a bit.
This is the list of the early AC Electrics running, which are joined by 35 x 86s and 10 x 87s, not counting the varied and many diesel types.

These are the 85s that Leicester modellers are 3D printing and selling on Ebay that I'm sure you will have seen, but the spaces between the windows are too big and overall it's about a metre too long in scale, although it looks pretty decent in this view. You get battery boxes and suspension parts to adapt the donor 86 chassis, so everything except the length is fine. Roof details are decent too, as you can see.

Yes I have seen the Leicester modellers versions, which look really good, and I assume the bodies have been made longer as they couldn't find any suitable mechanisms to fit them ? The Minitrix class 27 mechanisms I have used are relatively simple to modify, but I have to say that I find taking off a fair bit of the metal moulded bogies a little exhausting to say the least, but worth it in the long run.

 

[D1511]

There are 10 Storage Roads for each of the four Main Lines, and the trains run in sequence through Roads 1 to 10 on each before repeating the sequence again. Although some sets remain captive to either the Up or Down direction several sets like the Postal, Motorail, Manchester and Liverpool Pullmans do get swopped about every so often for either the southbound or northbound direction. I have made marshalling the sets slightly different to try and make the running sequences more 'interesting'. Having been doing the various conversions of AC Electrics over many years means I don't have to 'flog to death' certain members of the class, and change them over every few circuits or so to even out the requirement for any maintenance a bit.
This is the list of the early AC Electrics running, which are joined by 35 x 86s and 10 x 87s, not counting the varied and many diesel types.View attachment 149916


Yes I have seen the Leicester modellers versions, which look really good, and I assume the bodies have been made longer as they couldn't find any suitable mechanisms to fit them ? The Minitrix class 27 mechanisms I have used are relatively simple to modify, but I have to say that I find taking off a fair bit of the metal moulded bogies a little exhausting to say the least, but worth it in the long run.

Crikey that's an impressive list alright! Lovely to see both my favourite 81 (020) and 83 (011) are present in your fleet!
Your number of classes 81-85 alone is nearly the size of my current entire loco fleet! (which is about the same as the number of just 86s and 87s you have!) I recall reading further up the thread that you have around twenty 25s for example, and I'm sure other classes are equally well represented, so the scope you have for continued interest for the viewer is eyewatering!
I've seen your panels in the photos earlier in the thread that does the clever stuff in the background, but I can't begin to think about how complicated that would be for me to operate, especially in DC - or how long it's taken to get it running so perfectly!
Just as impressive as the smooth operation and all your locos, is your rolling stock, and wagons in particular, which I find quite a long winded process to assemble in numbers like yours. Coach rakes are easier to assemble in my experience, but there's a lot of scouring the internet needed to get hold of 34 16T NCB hoppers, or 22 Esso TTAs or Blue Circle PCAs or whatever. Your freightliner is particularly impressive in that regard....I've been trying to assemble a train like that for 6 months, checking the internet pages of model shops and eBay meticulously, and I've only managed to assemble a load 11 so far!
As for the 3D printed 85, I assume they stretched it specifically to fit the 86 chassis, presumably because it's a readily available model and DCC ready and only minor chassis tweaks are needed (and they're not assuming the general punter has your build skills!)
I agree it looks good though and probably the best option that's commercially available that I've managed to find so far.
I was talking to a chap at Warley on a stand (can't remember which one) who was busily scratch building one and filing down a GF 87 chassis to put it on, but the purpose of him being there appeared to be just to tantalise the likes of me, as it wasn't going to be for sale!

 

[Andy R. A.]

The latest bit of video from the layout with some 'scenic stills' included, along with the usual non DCC added sound effects.