A career as a signaller

[crosskeeper]

Hi all, I've been lurking here for a while soaking up all the information but this has left me confused!
I recently got a job as a Crossing Keeper on my first try applying for NWR. I had all my hopes pinned on a grade 3 signalling job that came up local to me. After about a month I got invited to do a 'series of online psychometric tests' but it seems I might have failed.
The tests I did were the same as the ones I did to get my current position, plus one additional test that said it was designed to test your memory whilst processing other information. I'm pretty sure this is the test I've failed as I found it quite stressful. I haven't had any feedback from recruitment, just 'application unsuccessful' on Oracle.

I have read on here (for external anyway) that they keep your results on file for 6 months, is this the case for internal too? I don't think there would have been much competition for this job as its the lowest grade on the line, so I don't think I just didn't make the top percentage for interviews... I must have failed spectacularly! Can anyone shed any light on what happens now, can I apply for the next role that comes up or am I best waiting a while? Serves me right for thinking getting an operations job at NWR was easy!!!

 

[cin88]

Just apply for the next one, there's nothing to stop you from doing so.

 

[PF19]

I'd keep applying, there could be a magnitude of reasons that stopped the last one!
HR shouls happily tell you how you did on your tests though if you email them!

 

[GaryS]

All the best to everyone going through the process, whatever stage you may be at.

 

[Royal351]

Hello, just a heads up for those about to start or in the process of doing starting the new offer to the RMT involves any new external starter being paid a grade 2 role regardless of the grade entering. Then once IST is completed you'll move to a grade 4 (unless it is a lower graded post) then once competent on the first panel to move to full pay grade.

Unsure how soon these would be implemented if the deal is approved. Those that have already signed contracts should be fine I think, but my knowledge of contract law is diddly squat

 

[mrc.Welford]

Hello, just a heads up for those about to start or in the process of doing starting the new offer to the RMT involves any new external starter being paid a grade 2 role regardless of the grade entering. Then once IST is completed you'll move to a grade 4 (unless it is a lower graded post) then once competent on the first panel to move to full pay grade.

Unsure how soon these would be implemented if the deal is approved. Those that have already signed contracts should be fine I think, but my knowledge of contract law is diddly squat

Can I ask where you have heard or read this as I can't see anything about this.

 

[Royal351]

Can I ask where you have heard or read this as I can't see anything about this.

https://www.rmt.org.uk/news/publications/2-appendix-a-schedule-of-productivity-items-ope080323/

Unless I'm reading this wrong (which I may be)

 

[mrc.Welford]

https://www.rmt.org.uk/news/publications/2-appendix-a-schedule-of-productivity-items-ope080323/

Unless I'm reading this wrong (which I may be)

Well now I am worried. I am due to start on the 29th as a grade 7 relief with training on a grade 6 pay I have signed contracts etc and have an employee number so I really hope this doesn't effect people like me

 

[SuperS16v]

That’s going to be slightly annoying, I’m going for a grade 6. Isn’t grade 2 around 10k less?

 

[mrc.Welford]

That’s going to be slightly annoying, I’m going for a grade 6. Isn’t grade 2 around 10k less?

Closer to 15k I think. I think it works out just under 2.5k difference per pay grade

 

[endofthetunnel]

The training pay change has been in the RMT/NR deal from the start of negotiations, they’ve been looking to bring it in for a while.
There’s other things in there too that will affect new starters (in summary):
- You’ll go to full salary after passing out just one workstation/panel(/box if you have a relief patch) rather than currently needing to pass out all of them before getting full pay
- The 26 week and 52 week rules are coming back, so once an external candidate starts you can’t move to a new box for 52 weeks (or 26 weeks rule for internal candidates to move boxes)
- If they advertise for a signaller job and then within 18 weeks need to rehire for the same box, they can just hire a previous applicant rather than doing it again
- Similarly if you’re in a contingent pool of new starters they don’t need to interview you for every single job but can do 1 and then just give you a box when available

 

[mrc.Welford]

The training pay change has been in the RMT/NR deal from the start of negotiations, they’ve been looking to bring it in for a while.
There’s other things in there too that will affect new starters (in summary):
- You’ll go to full salary after passing out just one workstation/panel(/box if you have a relief patch) rather than currently needing to pass out all of them before getting full pay
- The 26 week and 52 week rules are coming back, so once an external candidate starts you can’t move to a new box for 52 weeks (or 26 weeks rule for internal candidates to move boxes)
- If they advertise for a signaller job and then within 18 weeks need to rehire for the same box, they can just hire a previous applicant rather than doing it again
- Similarly if you’re in a contingent pool of new starters they don’t need to interview you for every single job but can do 1 and then just give you a box when available

But where do people like me stand when we have signed contracts is there a date this is all meant to be implemented

 

[endofthetunnel]

But where do people like me stand when we have signed contracts is there a date this is all meant to be implemented

I’ve no idea when it will start, nor how it works, but if you’ve a contract signed then I’d be surprised if they can change it.
Just ask your union rep/LOM once you start if you’re still worried

 

[Llanigraham]

If you have signed your contract then that is what will apply to you, not the new proposals

 

[SuperS16v]

Closer to 15k I think. I think it works out just under 2.5k difference per pay grade

Does anyone have the current pay scales per grade?

 

[Paul88]

Does anyone have the current pay scales per grade?

 

[SuperS16v]

Thank you

 

[Quintus]

Hi, newbie here.

I've been invited to interview for a G6 West Midlands position in a couple of weeks.

A massive thanks to everybody who has contributed to this thread... it's a goldmine of information!

 

[kenneth wright]

Hi Guys can anyone tell me what area woolley signal box in Barnsley controls please.I have an interview for that box in a couple of weeks.Also any other info on that box would be a great help.Thank you in advance.

 

[GaryS]

That’s going to be slightly annoying, I’m going for a grade 6. Isn’t grade 2 around 10k less?

Closer to 15k I think. I think it works out just under 2.5k difference per pay grade

Which is 10k... 6 - 2 is 4 grades lower, 4 x 2.5

 

[mrc.Welford]

Which is 10k... 6 - 2 is 4 grades lower, 4 x 2.5

Sorry for me as a 7 it was nearly 15 on a 6 yeah you are right. It's still a lot of money either way

 

[endofthetunnel]

Sorry for me as a 7 it was nearly 15 on a 6 yeah you are right. It's still a lot of money either way

It’s definitely a lot of money but that’s why they’re changing it. In fact that’s part of what’s paying for the payrise for us all (including the trainees)!

There are people joining externally at for example somewhere like Liverpool St G9 who take almost 2 years from starting signalling school to passing out all their workstations (normally it’s about 6 months in the box until their first workstation) earning a G8 throughout, some with no real incentive to get upto full G9 and milking the training roster for all its worth.

Now the idea is everyone goes through school on the same pay, and then G4 for the initial ‘learning on the job’ element out of school, but once you’re a proper signaller learning the rest of the panels/workstations it’s full pay.

It’s not perfect and trainees will lose pay in the short term, but it does make some sense. There were many situations in ROCs where a G7 signaller would find themselves on a workstation training someone fresh off the street with no knowledge already earning G8.

 

[GaryS]

Sorry for me as a 7 it was nearly 15 on a 6 yeah you are right. It's still a lot of money either way

Hopefully they will honour your contract if it's already signed as yes it is a big drop.

 

[Quintus]

It’s definitely a lot of money but that’s why they’re changing it. In fact that’s part of what’s paying for the payrise for us all (including the trainees)!

There are people joining externally at for example somewhere like Liverpool St G9 who take almost 2 years from starting signalling school to passing out all their workstations (normally it’s about 6 months in the box until their first workstation) earning a G8 throughout, some with no real incentive to get upto full G9 and milking the training roster for all its worth.

Now the idea is everyone goes through school on the same pay, and then G4 for the initial ‘learning on the job’ element out of school, but once you’re a proper signaller learning the rest of the panels/workstations it’s full pay.

It’s not perfect and trainees will lose pay in the short term, but it does make some sense. There were many situations in ROCs where a G7 signaller would find themselves on a workstation training someone fresh off the street with no knowledge already earning G8.

Yes, it'll be a big drop for some but I think it's completely fair. Grade 2 pay for going to school for 12 weeks - all expenses paid - is NOT a bad deal, all things considered.

 

[crosskeeper]

I'd keep applying, there could be a magnitude of reasons that stopped the last one!
HR shouls happily tell you how you did on your tests though if you email them!

Apparently not… they told me they’re only able to provide interview feedback, nothing about the tests. Even worse, scores kept on file for 6 months so won’t be able to apply for anything else for a while

 

[moorw003]

I applied for signalling roles 3 times over the last 2 years, and have been unsuccessful each time. In December I applied for the role of Grade 5 Train Delay Attributor, and today found out I was successful. Pay grade is exactly the same as a signaller. It was my ambition to go into signalling, but it seems like I found the perfect role for my skillset so I'm perfectly OK to have found a different path
I wish everyone well in their endeavours to become signallers, but if it doesn't happen, there are other great opportunities to look out for

 

[CarryOnThrough]

I managed to pass through the process and got offered a Grade 2 job in December. The tests were the most difficult part for me, what made it worse was the material I was sent to prepare for it with had no relevance to the actual exercises on the day. Somehow passed them and got to the interviews which I found very relaxed and informative compared to others I've had. I need a change from my current job, and I'm really looking forward to it. Pay is comparable, but benefits in that I will not have to take work home with me all the time doing crazy unpaid overtime.

Originally due to start January, but there was some difficulty with my notice period in the Civil Service so starting date was pushed to July. One slight hiccup is my wife is pregnant, and due in August when I'll be at signalling school. I've checked and I won't be entitled for paternity leave, leaving me in a slightly tricky situation. Wife is supportive I take the job and that we'll make it work, but I do want to be there to support her with it, which will be hard if I'm away all week and might potentially even miss the birth.

Currently mulling over contacting recruitment about it, seeing if it possible If I could be deferred again, but I really don't want to lose the opportunity.

Anyone been through something similar or have any advice?

 

[nom de guerre]

I applied for signalling roles 3 times over the last 2 years, and have been unsuccessful each time. In December I applied for the role of Grade 5 Train Delay Attributor, and today found out I was successful. Pay grade is exactly the same as a signaller. It was my ambition to go into signalling, but it seems like I found the perfect role for my skillset so I'm perfectly OK to have found a different path
I wish everyone well in their endeavours to become signallers, but if it doesn't happen, there are other great opportunities to look out for

Congratulations!

Now you get to annoy signallers on the phone (Joking. Well, half-joking )

It certainly isn't unknown for TDA clerks to move into signalling, so if the ambition does resurface there's nothing to stop you reapplying from a position of strength (i.e. having gained further operational experience, already earning G5 pay and with access to the internal job list).

I wouldn't judge yourself too harshly for accruing three unsuccessful applications in a two-year period, either. Many on here will have endured worse. I think it took me around 12 applications before I was offered my first signaller interview (which, happily, proved successful).

 

[Kraken]

I managed to pass through the process and got offered a Grade 2 job in December. The tests were the most difficult part for me, what made it worse was the material I was sent to prepare for it with had no relevance to the actual exercises on the day. Somehow passed them and got to the interviews which I found very relaxed and informative compared to others I've had. I need a change from my current job, and I'm really looking forward to it. Pay is comparable, but benefits in that I will not have to take work home with me all the time doing crazy unpaid overtime.

Originally due to start January, but there was some difficulty with my notice period in the Civil Service so starting date was pushed to July. One slight hiccup is my wife is pregnant, and due in August when I'll be at signalling school. I've checked and I won't be entitled for paternity leave, leaving me in a slightly tricky situation. Wife is supportive I take the job and that we'll make it work, but I do want to be there to support her with it, which will be hard if I'm away all week and might potentially even miss the birth.

Currently mulling over contacting recruitment about it, seeing if it possible If I could be deferred again, but I really don't want to lose the opportunity.

Anyone been through something similar or have any advice?

Ooh that is a tricky one and no mistake. Have you got your LOM’s details yet and if not can you get them off HR? He or she might be happy to put you off for a few more months and it’s definitely worth letting them know as it might be an easy swap. My kid was 6 months when I went off to signalling school and that was fine, but the birth and the first few weeks are a different kettle of fish altogether.

 

[SuperS16v]

Just competed the scenario assessment. I thought it was straight forward but the order of the sub questions asked threw me off a bit and had me going backwards and forwards. I felt I got all the content in though just not in a particular order. I used the 4 mins on every task.