Advice on split season ticket

[Raymond87]

My normal journey is Eastbourne > London Terminals at an annual cost of £4.7k.

I've recently learnt that fellow passengers buy two tickets;

Eastbourne > Ashtead
Selhurst > London Terminals

on the basis that travelling via East Croydon is an acceptable route for both, and at a much reduced cost of £3.6k.

Looking at the routeing guide, I can see that travelling via East Croydon for the first leg appears to be covered under permitted route XE.

However, I can't see that Selhurst to London Terminals is, but, when I use the journey planner and select via East Croydon I'm given a fare. This fare is the same as if I don't select 'via East Croydon'. Would I also be able to travel to Victoria, not sure if this would be permitted due to rules around doubling back (although my Victoria trains don't actually stop at Selhurst).

Is anyone able to advise, as the concept of routeing guides and permitted routes is rather confusing! Apologies if any aspects are unclear.

Thank you.

 

[CyrusWuff]

I stand for correction on this, but my interpretation of the Routeing Guide is that such a combination is not valid because Epsom fails the fares check for use as a Routeing Point for an Eastbourne - Ashtead ticket routed either "Not via Clapham Junction" or "Not via London", meaning you can only approach Ashtead via Leatherhead.

Essentially this restricts you to travelling from Eastbourne to Redhill (via Brighton or Tonbridge) to Dorking (Deepdene) then walking to Dorking (Main) and thence to Ashtead.

That it may not have been picked up by any ticket checking staff doesn't alter this validity....

 

[PolegateJn]

Having a look on TrainTimes - for the Not via Clapham Junction fares it's allowing a route via East Croydon, Norwood Junction & Epsom.

 

[Raymond87]

Thank you both, it's all so confusing!

 

[John @ home]

I think that some booking engines permit Eastbourne - Ashtead via Norwood Jn (or via Selhurst) due to their interpretation of the shortest route rule. The Eastbourne - Ashtead shortest route wholly by rail is via Three Bridges and Horsham. This is measured by the Rail Journey Information System (RJIS) at 64.32 miles.

I think all booking engines allow a small margin of 3 miles above the shortest route. At least some allow routes not more than 5 miles longer than the shortest route. Eastbourne - Selhurst - Ashtead is just under 4 miles longer, at 68.23 miles.

 

[kieron]

Leaving what booking engines do aside, an Eastbourne-Ashtead "not via Clapham Junction" has associated routeing points at Epsom or Leatherhead.

In the NFM64 list, Eastbourne-Ashtead has "ANY PERMITTED" and "NOT VIA LONDON" fares. There are no "not via Clapham Junction" ones, so I'll choose to compare the "ANY PERMITTED" fares.

The Eastbourne-Ashtead "ANY PERMITTED" SDS costs £20.90, with Epsom-Eastbourne and Leatherhead-Eastbourne ones at £18.90 and £20.90 respectively. As these are no higher than the Ashtead fare, either routeing point can be used as the associated routeing point for Ashtead.

Eastbourne-Leatherhead is valid on the VB+HR map combination. VB allows Eastbourne-Lewes-Wivelsfield-East Croydon-Selhurst (Selhurst being part of Streatham group). HR allows Selhurst-Streatham-Mitcham Junction-Sutton-Leatherhead. If you're using a season ticket, you don't have to go all the way to Ashtead to make use of this validity.

A Selhurst-London ticket may be valid via East Croydon (I haven't checked), but it's certainly valid via Clapham Junction on map FC.

I would guess that people advised switching at East Croydon because there used to be a rule along the lines that someone with two season tickets could only switch from one to the other at a station where the train stops. That's gone, so you can use Selhurst as the point where you switch from one ticket to the other instead.

 

[CyrusWuff]

Having just checked on our TIS at work, it's quite happy to sell the "Not via Clapham Junction" ticket for travel via East Croydon, Norwood Junction and Epsom as well, so make of that what you will!

Saying that, just putting in "Avoid Clapham Junction" causes it to suggest getting Tramlink between East and West Croydon or East Croydon and Wimbledon...which it can't sell a through ticket for!

 

[Raymond87]

Thank you so much, I really appreciate you taking the time to look at this as it's a bit of a minefield to an amateur like me! Thank you