Alternate Interventions at Manchester Oxford Road and Piccadilly

[Dspatula]

My thoughts on possible alterations to improve relatability on the Castlefield corridor;

Oxford Road Option A 3 Platforms arrangement aiming for platform Length and unrestricted access to both ends of the central platform,


Option B Shorter platforms and middle platform only accessible directly from the Down line at the east end, but with platform 5 retained for disruption,

Piccadilly Option A, Slow tracks realigned to allow central loop with current Mayfield loop turn into a longer siding;

Piccadilly Option B more extensive track alterations to the slow lines, central siding instead of loop with the Mayfield loop moved south and extended slightly,

 

[30907]

Very interesting and clear: is the idea of the revised Mayfield loop to allow P5 at Oxford Rd to be taken out? I am not sure if could be dispensed with otherwise.

I like the Oxford Rd suggestion but could it operate with 3 through platforms only? I know 1 is little used but....

What is the optimum length for Oxford Rd platforms? 8x20m, 8x23m?

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Very interesting and clear: is the idea of the revised Mayfield loop to allow P5 at Oxford Rd to be taken out? I am not sure if could be dispensed with otherwise.

I like the Oxford Rd suggestion but could it operate with 3 through platforms only? I know 1 is little used but....

What is the optimum length for Oxford Rd platforms? 8x20m, 8x23m?

The main reason P1 doesn't get much use is lack of accessibility. Surely whilst that's a problem with the current setup, it isn't a particularly good reason to assume that situation will remain long-term. Unless there's something structural which would make installing a lift particularly difficult or expensive, not doing so seems short-sighted. Especially now that Piccadilly P15&16 are definitely not happening.

 

[30907]

The main reason P1 doesn't get much use is lack of accessibility. Surely whilst that's a problem with the current setup, it isn't a particularly good reason to assume that situation will remain long-term. Unless there's something structural which would make installing a lift particularly difficult or expensive, not doing so seems short-sighted.

A look at satellite photos suggests it would be very difficult at best.

 

[The Planner]

What do the Man Picc alterations achieve? Without seeing a side by side its difficult to work out.

 

[Dspatula]

Very interesting and clear: is the idea of the revised Mayfield loop to allow P5 at Oxford Rd to be taken out? I am not sure if could be dispensed with otherwise.

It would be nice if you could run everything through but my main thought with the Piccadilly part is about improving resilience for delays and disruption.

I like the Oxford Rd suggestion but could it operate with 3 through platforms only? I know 1 is little used but....

The current official thinking is two through platforms and a central bay, three at least gives some flexibility when terminating services aren't there keeping 5 gives resilience but limits anything terminating to 4x24m

What is the optimum length for Oxford Rd platforms? 8x20m, 8x23m?

The plan just cancelled would have been optimal giving 4x200m platforms I'm assuming we're constrained to the space already owned by the railway having two platforms for 7x26m would be nice but 8x20m or 7x24m would be more than enough given the constraints of most other stations in the area and the stock available.

The main reason P1 doesn't get much use is lack of accessibility. Surely whilst that's a problem with the current setup, it isn't a particularly good reason to assume that situation will remain long-term. Unless there's something structural which would make installing a lift particularly difficult or expensive, not doing so seems short-sighted. Especially now that Piccadilly P15&16 are definitely not happening.

Even discounting the lift issue platform one isn't particularly useful anyway as any train longer than 4 carriages blocks access to platform 1 from the Piccadilly end any way.

What do the Man Picc alterations achieve? Without seeing a side by side its difficult to work out.

Hopefully this helps.

 

[The Planner]

B stops parallel moves on the high side platforms off the slows. Don't these add more S&C as well? Its constrained as it is and B is adding another two sets of fixed diamonds which the maintainer will frown at. Not sure what this solves for a very expensive and intrusive piece of work.

 

[Dspatula]

B stops parallel moves on the high side platforms off the slows.

I'll admit I missed that one, however as far as I can tell everything using platform 8 is on the fast line and anything using 9 through 12 is using the single line through 9 anyway.

Don't these add more S&C as well? Its constrained as it is and B is adding another two sets of fixed diamonds which the maintainer will frown at. Not sure what this solves for a very expensive and intrusive piece of work.

Yes the diamonds are a product of the constrained space;
The idea B is to allow capacity to extend the two trains that currently currently terminate at Oxford road while maintaining as much of the flexibility of the current layout as possible.
For A it's to achieve a central turn back facility to improve service recovery and to allow one existing service arriving from the west to be terminated at Piccadilly. The two that I think that might be a good idea for are the all stations Liverpool to Manchester via Chat Moss separating it from the all stations Manchester Airport section and, the Scotland to Manchester Airport service.

To be honest if stripe my aim down to the basics of what I think would improve reliability which is a turn back which allows at least 6x24m as close to Piccadilly as possible, then the solution is to remove the southern access to the Mayfield loop and create a longer siding.

Anyway here's a comparison of routings I made before I realised just how impractical do any of this would be was.

 

[30907]

To be honest if strip my aim down to the basics of what I think would improve reliability which is a turn back which allows at least 6x24m as close to Piccadilly as possible, then the solution is to remove the southern access to the Mayfield loop and create a longer siding.

Yes - that should give you 200m without having to move any OHLE masts.
I assume the loop is rarely used as anything other than a turnback?