"...and our fathers that begat us..."

[krus_aragon]

There's a poignant and delightful film -- length about 10 mins. -- made to mark the end of London's trams in early July 1952. If I had more computer competence, I'd do a link to it; as things are, will just say that Googling the film's title, The elephant will never forget 1952, should immediately fetch it up, YouTube-wise. Wonderfully showing the trams doing their characteristic stuff in their last few days; plus the "last rites". Includes a splendid music-hall song about the advantages for courtship purposes, of the top deck of trams (all pretty decorous).

Let me oblige you.

 

[Busaholic]

There's a poignant and delightful film -- length about 10 mins. -- made to mark the end of London's trams in early July 1952. If I had more computer competence, I'd do a link to it; as things are, will just say that Googling the film's title, The elephant will never forget 1952, should immediately fetch it up, YouTube-wise. Wonderfully showing the trams doing their characteristic stuff in their last few days; plus the "last rites". Includes a splendid music-hall song about the advantages for courtship purposes, of the top deck of trams (all pretty decorous).

Seen it many times, always brings a tear to my eyes. My, how times have changed! Seriously, I'd insist on Sadiq Khan, Mike Brown, et al, be required to sit down and view it every now and again just to remind them of who they are meant to be working for, but I fear the message would be lost on them.

 

[Calthrop]

Let me oblige you.

Thanks !

 

[Arglwydd Golau]

Calthrop...your idea for a thread and my original response in which I made mention of my father's journey between his home station (Dinas) and Oxford has prompted me to look a little more closely at the dozen journeys that he made between the two in 1936 and 1937. Quite fascinating, in that he never made the same journey twice, either changing his route or changing trains at different stations en route. I suppose that he must have purchased a timetable and worked out how he was to do this, but unfortunately those timetables haven't survived.
All his journeys involved passing through Chester, having changed at Bangor and Llandudno Junction - interesting in itself, as I would have thought that he could have caught a through train from Bangor to Chester or Crewe, or perhaps the times were convenient to do it this way. Only once did he catch a through train from Oxford to Chester (would that have been a South Coast (Poole) -Birkenhead working?). His notes also show a very interesting variety of motive power, sadly lacking if any student considered a similar venture today! If you are interested, I can provide some more detail, there are one or two questions that I would like to have answers to if anyone has access to a timetable of the period.

 

[Branch line]

There's an equally poignant film about Glasgows Last Tram.It has an excellent commentary.

 

[30907]

Calthrop...your idea for a thread and my original response in which I made mention of my father's journey between his home station (Dinas) and Oxford has prompted me to look a little more closely at the dozen journeys that he made between the two in 1936 and 1937. Quite fascinating, in that he never made the same journey twice, either changing his route or changing trains at different stations en route. I suppose that he must have purchased a timetable and worked out how he was to do this, but unfortunately those timetables haven't survived.
All his journeys involved passing through Chester, having changed at Bangor and Llandudno Junction - interesting in itself, as I would have thought that he could have caught a through train from Bangor to Chester or Crewe, or perhaps the times were convenient to do it this way. Only once did he catch a through train from Oxford to Chester (would that have been a South Coast (Poole) -Birkenhead working?). His notes also show a very interesting variety of motive power, sadly lacking if any student considered a similar venture today! If you are interested, I can provide some more detail, there are one or two questions that I would like to have answers to if anyone has access to a timetable of the period.

Would the 1938 Bradshaw reprint be good enough?

As a student in the same city (the link with your username has just dawned BTW), but a generation later, I had fewer routes to choose from and a shorter journey home to South London, but I rarely just went the direct route, probably for the same reason as your father.

 

[Arglwydd Golau]

Would the 1938 Bradshaw reprint be good enough?

As a student in the same city (the link with your username has just dawned BTW), but a generation later, I had fewer routes to choose from and a shorter journey home to South London, but I rarely just went the direct route, probably for the same reason as your father.

I was particularly interested in a connection he made from Polesworth to Leamington Spa...4.32pm off the former and arriving at the latter at 5.59pm (obviously the notes do not use the 24 hour clock!) Motive power was an ex-LNWR 2-4-2. I was wondering where this train originated....surprised that Polesworth had a direct service to Leamington. If you do have a '38 Bradshaw I'd be grateful to learn more about this train, if there is anything more to learn!

 

[Taunton]

The 1938 Bradshaw was reprinted some years ago, and one is quite commonly found in railway secondhand bookshops (as well, I suspect, as on the bookshelves of a number of contributors here).

Changing at Polesworth for Leamington on this journey is reminiscent of an account of a onetime major public school headmaster in the 1930s, who, as a minor punishment to save him getting his stick out, would give the miscreants the current Bradsahw and tell them to devise the quickest journey from (say) Swansea to Hartlepool. Apparently when the work was presented he would push his spectacles to the end of his nose and say "Nonsense, there's much better than that". The story is in one or other of the old classic railway books.

 

[30907]

I was particularly interested in a connection he made from Polesworth to Leamington Spa...4.32pm off the former and arriving at the latter at 5.59pm (obviously the notes do not use the 24 hour clock!) Motive power was an ex-LNWR 2-4-2. I was wondering where this train originated....surprised that Polesworth had a direct service to Leamington. If you do have a '38 Bradshaw I'd be grateful to learn more about this train, if there is anything more to learn!

It appears (SX) in 1938 and is formed off a 4.5pm from Nuneaton (school traffic?), though it is not shown as a through train (typical Bradshaw). Nuneaton-Coventry-Leamington is a single table with mostly through workings, so I would guess this was just a convenient use of a set that was spare at Nuneaton.

A handful of Trent Valley stoppers only worked North of Nuneaton, so there may have been other interworkings of stock, but it is impossible to tell from Bradshaw.

What puzzles me a little is how your father got to Polesworth, because it seems he must have waited an hour or so there.

PS 50-odd years later, when the handful of Trent Valley stoppers was handed over to a Bubble Car (?) instead of an emu, there was at least one Coventry-Nuneaton-Stafford each way.

 

[Arglwydd Golau]

It appears (SX) in 1938 and is formed off a 4.5pm from Nuneaton (school traffic?), though it is not shown as a through train (typical Bradshaw). Nuneaton-Coventry-Leamington is a single table with mostly through workings, so I would guess this was just a convenient use of a set that was spare at Nuneaton.

A handful of Trent Valley stoppers only worked North of Nuneaton, so there may have been other interworkings of stock, but it is impossible to tell from Bradshaw.

What puzzles me a little is how your father got to Polesworth, because it seems he must have waited an hour or so there.

PS 50-odd years later, when the handful of Trent Valley stoppers was handed over to a Bubble Car (?) instead of an emu, there was at least one Coventry-Nuneaton-Stafford each way.

Many thanks 30907, he did indeed have a wait at Polesworth, he caught the 1.4 pm from Crewe to Lichfield, ( Black Five) and then the 2.55 pm from Lichfield to Polesworth, (Fowler 2-6-4) arriving at 3.14pm, not sure what he could do at Polesworth for an hour and a quarter except to watch the trains....

 

[Ianigsy]

Changing at Polesworth for Leamington on this journey is reminiscent of an account of a onetime major public school headmaster in the 1930s, who, as a minor punishment to save him getting his stick out, would give the miscreants the current Bradsahw and tell them to devise the quickest journey from (say) Swansea to Hartlepool. Apparently when the work was presented he would push his spectacles to the end of his nose and say "Nonsense, there's much better than that". The story is in one or other of the old classic railway books.

About 30 years ago, one of the railway magazines printed a similar challenge as a Christmas puzzle - it was called the Bishop's Dilemma or something similar, and concerned a bishop who was commissioned by the Archbishop of Canterbury to preach at every Anglican cathedral in Britain, travelling by rail to the nearest station. The likes of Ripon and St David's would cause a few problems, as would knowing which stations were closer in places like Exeter and Liverpool.

 

[Calthrop]

Calthrop...your idea for a thread and my original response in which I made mention of my father's journey between his home station (Dinas) and Oxford has prompted me to look a little more closely at the dozen journeys that he made between the two in 1936 and 1937. Quite fascinating, in that he never made the same journey twice, either changing his route or changing trains at different stations en route. I suppose that he must have purchased a timetable and worked out how he was to do this, but unfortunately those timetables haven't survived.
All his journeys involved passing through Chester, having changed at Bangor and Llandudno Junction -- interesting in itself, as I would have thought that he could have caught a through train from Bangor to Chester or Crewe, or perhaps the times were convenient to do it this way. Only once did he catch a through train from Oxford to Chester (would that have been a South Coast (Poole) -Birkenhead working?). His notes also show a very interesting variety of motive power, sadly lacking if any student considered a similar venture today! If you are interested, I can provide some more detail, there are one or two questions that I would like to have answers to if anyone has access to a timetable of the period.

My bolding: I find it interesting that from your account here, your father seems to have been -- concerning North Wales anyway -- a completely dedicated LNWR / LMS, as opposed to Cambrian-plus-GW / GWR, man. Travelling between Dinas and Oxford eighty-plus years ago, and enjoying "ringing the changes" railway-enthusiast-wise -- would it have been a totally ludicrously long and impractical way round, to vary things by going south from Dinas and changing on to the GWR, ex-Cambrian part, at Afonwen -- then via Machynlleth to Shrewsbury, thence GWR to Birmingham and Oxford? It would have to be admitted that other GWR or "GWR-ish" routes would probably have verged on the crazy -- outside of the "Closed Stations Journey" game in these Forums' quiz section (Afonwen -- Machynlleth -- Moat Lane Junction -- Three Cocks Junction -- Hereford -- Worcester -- Oxford??)

 

[Calthrop]

Many thanks 30907, he did indeed have a wait at Polesworth, he caught the 1.4 pm from Crewe to Lichfield, ( Black Five) and then the 2.55 pm from Lichfield to Polesworth, (Fowler 2-6-4) arriving at 3.14pm, not sure what he could do at Polesworth for an hour and a quarter except to watch the trains....

Make up limericks?

There was a young schoolboy named Molesworth,
Wasted long hours train-changing at Polesworth:
Cash depths he did plumb
As he sat in that slum
Re -- how little this miserable hole's worth.

 

[Taunton]

Make up limericks?

We'll be Remembering Adlestrop next ...

 

[Busaholic]

We'll be Remembering Adlestrop next ...

I was always hoping Glen Campbell could be persuaded to write a song about Adlestrop - too late now.

 

[30907]

About 30 years ago, one of the railway magazines printed a similar challenge as a Christmas puzzle - it was called the Bishop's Dilemma or something similar, and concerned a bishop who was commissioned by the Archbishop of Canterbury to preach at every Anglican cathedral in Britain, travelling by rail to the nearest station. The likes of Ripon and St David's would cause a few problems, as would knowing which stations were closer in places like Exeter and Liverpool.

It was Modern Railways, English cathedrals only, and the solution involved knowing that Southwell Minister was in Newark local authority - can't remember about Ripon!

 

[Welshman]

It was Modern Railways, English cathedrals only, and the solution involved knowing that Southwell Minister was in Newark local authority - can't remember about Ripon!

And Wells, too?
Taxi from Castle Cary?

 

[Taunton]

There was a comparable "challenge", I think in the Railway Magazine, back in the 1970s when the first of the reprinted Bradshaws, for 1910, came out. It ranged all over the country. There was a most interesting follow-up when the challenge winner wrote about the itinerary, and paralleling it as closely as possible in the contemporary timetable, which was fairly readily achieveable until it was necessary to get from Market Harborough to Rugby, or thereabouts, when right in the middle of England things broke down.

Someone will have the relevant arrticles to hand ...