Avanti WC down the pan again

[Jamesrob637]

So I've used Avanti today Rugby to Carlisle and back again. Didn't think I'd have to use this thread as the train turned up and is still moving. However, I'm sat in Coach C by the shop and the train manager and the shop manager have had a convoluted conversation with and about the driver and a request from control to terminate the train at Watford Junction and go empty stock to Wembley.

Most of this discussion was about how they would get home, no concern for passengers whatsoever.

They had confirmation this was definitely 100% happening by Warrington but only made an announcement 10 minutes after leaving Stafford. They only 'prioritised' this announcement because several passengers had asked them what was going on as they'd had an email saying that the train was terminating at Watford.

Now they are gossiping about a short chubby guy from Preston and something happening with his wife!

(All other Avanti staff I've come across today have been lovely and totally professional).

Was that to see Oxford away? At least they won, if that was the case!

My next Avanti journeys will take place Wednesday and Friday respectively.

 

[JD2168]

For what its worth, the 17:43 departure from Lime Street honestly isnt that bad

People seem to forget on here that LNWR also operate on the WCML....

I used an LNWR to Birmingham New Street today, 3by2 seating causing a narrow gangway & no space for large luggage made for a poor journey.

 

[Joey Beauchamp]

Was that to see Oxford away? At least they won, if that was the case!

My next Avanti journeys will take place Wednesday and Friday respectively.

It was! I guess calling myself Joey Beauchamp gives it away somewhat. Yes it's not been a bad day but I just hate unprofessionalism in a customer facing role. Save it for your break / wife / WhatsApp group FFS.

 

[trainophile]

For what its worth, the 17:43 departure from Lime Street honestly isnt that bad

People seem to forget on here that LNWR also operate on the WCML....

Was there ticket acceptance for non-open ticket holders?

 

[Train Maniac]

Was there ticket acceptance for non-open ticket holders?

Didnt see a guard, and the staff at the end of Platform 1 at Euston didnt seem too phased either.

 

[trainophile]

Didnt see a guard, and the staff at the end of Platform 1 at Euston didnt seem too phased either.

Not sure I'd have dared risk it with an Avanti Advance then.

 

[voyagerdude220]

They had confirmation this was definitely 100% happening by Warrington but only made an announcement 10 minutes after leaving Stafford. They only 'prioritised' this announcement because several passengers had asked them what was going on as they'd had an email saying that the train was terminating at Watford.

Sadly this reminds me of a journey from Chester to London around 10 years ago. We got stuck just north of Norton Bridge due to a points failure for nearly an hour, with everything else bypassing us on the slow lines.

I was sat in First Class in the front set of a double 221 and noticed the National Rail website said we were understandably terminating at Milton Keynes because of the late running. I went to the Galley area and asked the First Class catering lady if she'd heard anything. She didn't know anything had changed, but called the TM who was in the rear set. He confirmed we were terminating at Milton Keynes, but he only bothered to announce this shortly before we got there.

 

[Train Maniac]

Not sure I'd have dared risk it with an Avanti Advance then.

I was booked on it from Crewe south so no problem for me in any case. Not sure about others

 

[frodshamfella]

When is avanti never “down the pan”?


And the 19.37 cancelled too.

That's not providing a service. Would have a complete nightmare getting back to London from Liverpool yesterday afternoon / evening

 

[Boodiggy]

Not sure I'd have dared risk it with an Avanti Advance then.

They will be unadvertised acceptance for certain trains that will be announced at the station before departure. Or at least should be.

That's not providing a service. Would have a complete nightmare getting back to London from Liverpool yesterday afternoon / evening

Liverpool services seem badly affected Sat PM

 

[SCDR_WMR]

They will be unadvertised acceptance for certain trains that will be announced at the station before departure. Or at least should be.


Liverpool services seem badly affected Sat PM

Usually, even if there is no 'official' acceptance in place, LNWR staff will convey passengers to Crewe or Stafford, especially when several Avanti services in a row are cancelled. I've certainly done so regularly over the past 18 months or more.

That way they can still get to their destinations. Shame it never works the other way around, though that is very rarely required.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It is for those in first class, and those customers have paid a considerable amount more, to now be wedged in with the messroom culture and a neighbour next to you!

You pay for one seat, not lots.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

You pay for one seat, not lots.

If we go down that route, really you don’t pay for a seat at all, but to get from A to B. But I’m sure you understood my point.

The point I was rather obviously trying to make was - a move made that considerably limits the space of those who’ve paid the premium for a more pleasant journey, to create more space for those who haven’t, does frustrate me slightly. Last Saturday when almost every seat in first class was taken, there were multiple passengers in standard class with tables to themselves.

Now something like 9 car Pendolinos used to be once upon a time many years ago - 5 Standard and 4 First - is rather excessive, yes. But similarly, the reverse is too. 1 First class carriage on a weekend - and not a proper one but the silly half size Coach K too - on an 11 carriage Pendolino is ridiculous.

 

[Signal Head]

But one of the ‘extra’ sets was to replace the one written off after Grayrigg

I recall at the time it was reported that the improved facilities at Edge Hill, funded by Network Rail, were in lieu of (and cheaper than) a replacement set, on the basis that it improved availability by reducing the need to diagram sets to get to Longsight, which made up for the loss of 033.

 

[Krokodil]

If we go down that route, really you don’t pay for a seat at all, but to get from A to B.

With a 1st class ticket you would be compensated if there were no 1st class seats available on a service with advertised 1st class accommodation so the usual principle doesn't apply.

But I’m sure you understood my point.

That you want to sit in an empty carriage? Even if that means the plebs have to play sardines?

If people aren't being forced to stand and pairs/groups of four aren't being split up then no one has the right to complain about capacity.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

That you want to sit in an empty carriage? Even if that means the plebs have to play sardines?

You know very well that’s not what I’m saying, so why imply so?

And groups of four ARE often split up… there is one table for four offered on Pendolinos in First Class on weekends…

 

[Krokodil]

You know very well that’s not what I’m saying, so why imply so?

You were complaining that you had to sit next to someone. I have more concern for those standing in the aisles in cattle class. First class is generally 2+1 seating so you're still less likely to have a neighbour.

And groups of four ARE often split up… there is one table for four offered on Pendolinos in First Class on weekends…

People sitting in pairs on consecutive rows is different from mummy sitting in one seat with the youngest child on her lap, two kids sharing another seat four rows away, and daddy standing in the vestibule with the cases.

 

[Jamesrob637]

I think getting an unrefurbished Pendolino might count for some as having a journey down the pan. My 18:35 Manchester to London this Wednesday is booked 11-car, so can't be anything but renovated as long as 11 cars turn up. However, my 19:13 London to Manchester this Friday could more easily be 9-car and therefore unrefurbished.

 

[Geezertronic]

Must have been lucky last week (Tuesday) - I went from Birmingham International to Euston and return with no issues whatsoever. Both 11 car, no issues finding a seat (in Coach A)

 

[Jamesrob637]

Realtime Trains | 1H16 1113 London Euston to Manchester Piccadilly | 15/01/2024

Real-time train running information for 1H16 1113 departure from London Euston to Manchester Piccadilly on 15/01/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

How? No Avanti train is slower than 125.

 

[800Travel]

Realtime Trains | 1H16 1113 London Euston to Manchester Piccadilly | 15/01/2024

Real-time train running information for 1H16 1113 departure from London Euston to Manchester Piccadilly on 15/01/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

How? No Avanti train is slower than 125.

Could it mean a service that stops at more stations on the route?

 

[RunRepeat]

15.43 Lime St to Euston, cancelled., lots of people looking for information.

I was booked on this from Crewe having changed off an EDB service south. Fortunately the following Manchester service south was lightly loaded.

 

[Bungle965]

Realtime Trains | 1H16 1113 London Euston to Manchester Piccadilly | 15/01/2024

Real-time train running information for 1H16 1113 departure from London Euston to Manchester Piccadilly on 15/01/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

How? No Avanti train is slower than 125.

Could it mean a service that stops at more stations on the route?

Short on Pendos again , 3 out of traffic. With two more leaving late with problems at Edge Hill and Oxley.

 

[gazzaa2]

For what its worth, the 17:43 departure from Lime Street honestly isnt that bad

People seem to forget on here that LNWR also operate on the WCML....

It's a quiet time of the year once the schools go back in Jan, and if there's no big event on, but it would have been hellish in December or during school holidays, or if there was a big match on.

 

[AndrewE]

For what its worth, the 17:43 departure from Lime Street honestly isnt that bad

People seem to forget on here that LNWR also operate on the WCML....

but a) this is an Avanti thread and
b) LNR have increased their frequency a bit but most of the trains are only 4-cars now, when all used to be well-filled 8s. The 8-car hourly locals around the evening peak used to be packed. My latest trip was on the 1608 semi-fast off Liverpool last monday and it was pretty well full.

 

[Bletchleyite]

but a) this is an Avanti thread and
b) LNR have increased their frequency a bit but most of the trains are only 4-cars now, when all used to be well-filled 8s. The 8-car hourly locals around the evening peak used to be packed. My latest trip was on the 1608 semi-fast off Liverpool last monday and it was pretty well full.

In my understanding these are to be 5.730 (equivalent of 6.350) when these enter service, which should probably be about right.

 

[AndrewE]

In my understanding these are to be 5.730 (equivalent of 6.350) when these enter service, which should probably be about right.

Maybe, but when? I think it would have been better to keep running the reliable hourly 8-car service until they could start feeding in the extra units. What's the betting that there will be a quick swap-over, leaving the service worse than before due to new units not arriving on time - compounded by teething troubles?

You only have to see what is going on on the Wirral to see the current railway's form on introducing new fleets. But back to Avanti: can anyone remind us when the additional new units should have been in service - and while we are at it, what proportion of the current Pendolino fleet are available for use?

 

[Robcuk]

Just read the following article via the RMT Twitter feed - see link below.

https://novaramedia.com/2024/01/15/...-about-making-money-at-the-taxpayers-expense/

A little taster

A slide entitled, “Roll-up, roll-up get your free money here!” sets out how the Treasury, via the Department for Transport, expects Avanti to “provide resources to deliver high-quality levels of customer service.”

In return, the Treasury will support the company to deliver new assets, customer service improvement projects and initiatives, as well as to find maintenance and third-party supplier contracts.

The slide then reads: “then they pay for it! …nearly all of it!… But that’s not the end of the matter …

 

[frodshamfella]

I dont hold out a lot of hope of Avanti managing to operate a second Liverpool service per hour, when getting one per hour is very unreliable.

 

[SCDR_WMR]

Maybe, but when? I think it would have been better to keep running the reliable hourly 8-car service until they could start feeding in the extra units. What's the betting that there will be a quick swap-over, leaving the service worse than before due to new units not arriving on time - compounded by teething troubles?

You only have to see what is going on on the Wirral to see the current railway's form on introducing new fleets. But back to Avanti: can anyone remind us when the additional new units should have been in service - and while we are at it, what proportion of the current Pendolino fleet are available for use?

Hopefully by end of the year. Pathing was implemented in readiness for 730s at TT change, to go back to the 2tph that it was prior to covid.

Hopefully, the semi fasts will get more used as people cotton on to them. I'm certainly fed up of defending 'short forms' or capacity reduction as some see it when most hours still have 8 cars, just split back to the higher frequency