Avanti West Coast cancellations

[Clarence Yard]

No, they are two quite different characters, with equally different approaches to staff management. The TPE approach is more akin to what GWR do.

The DfT are not dictating the day to day staff relationships within the TOCs. The exec teams in each TOC do that independently, even, in this case, within the same OG.

 

[Carlisle]

The MD is seeing conspiracies everywhere and he seems unable to distinguish between industrial action, individuals wanting some time off and normal messroom style conversations between staff.

Quite possibly, or he might’ve seen evidence for himself of organised campaigns to avoid RDW on social media platforms.

 

[43066]

Quite possibly, or he might’ve seen evidence for himself of organised campaigns to avoid RDW on social media platforms.

If that’s the case, then why hasn’t that evidence been made available?

 

[Clarence Yard]

Presumably because it is being legally checked.

There is a fine line between what I would call “messroom conversations” between individual staff and a properly organised campaign.

Social media will blur that distinction.

 

[43066]

Presumably because it is being legally checked.

There is a fine line between what I would call “messroom conversations” between individual staff and a properly organised campaign.

Social media will blur that distinction.

Legally checked by whom, I wonder? If (and it’s a big if) they have evidence they’re uncertain about they should wait until they are sure before lobbing accusations around. They’ve also had several days now to “legally check” said evidence. The continuing silence rather suggests it’s non existent…

It’s highly unprofessional and ridiculously antagonistic of this company to make such a statement without evidence to back it up, seemingly on the basis of what amounts to nothing more than a hunch on the part of the MD.

I’m not sure how anyone, whichever side of the argument they’re on, can reasonably disagree with that.

 

[ScottGallagher]

The chances are Shapps wont be in post on the 6th of September, may be a change of wind then.

 

[Carlisle]

K

If that’s the case, then why hasn’t that evidence been made available?

Agreed , he needs to substantiate it pretty soon alongside apologising to those that genuinely didn’t intend to work any rest days or he probably hasn’t got long left in the job.

 

[D1537]

The chances are Shapps wont be in post on the 6th of September, may be a change of wind then.

Be careful what you wish for.

Meanwhile, Avanti has few cancellations today, although the line between BHI and BHM is closed due to a fatality. 9S70 EUS-GLC has apparently gone down the Trent to Stafford (where it was 46 early), back to Wolverhampton, and then back to Crewe.

 

[Bantamzen]

Legally checked by whom, I wonder? If (and it’s a big if) they have evidence they’re uncertain about they should wait until they are sure before lobbing accusations around. They’ve also had several days now to “legally check” said evidence. The continuing silence rather suggests it’s non existent…

I would imagine that the TOC's legal teams, and Whitehall will be pouring over the fine print. And if the latter is involved it could take a while, the wheels sometimes turn very slowly there, allegedly...

It’s highly unprofessional and ridiculously antagonistic of this company to make such a statement without evidence to back it up, seemingly on the basis of what amounts to nothing more than a hunch on the part of the MD.

I actually agree, if they suspected organised action by a group of staff or the unions, they should have gathered evidence and checked legality first.

I’m not sure how anyone, whichever side of the argument they’re on, can reasonably disagree with that.

Indeed, it certainly has made the whole situation worse.

 

[Statto]

A few trains are being diverted via Stoke, just spotted Euston to Liverpool past Alsager, & a Euston to Glasgow going through Longport

 

[185]

Have any TOCs actually done that so overtime/rest day working wasn't needed? If they haven't is there anything else stopping them?

Shareholders, moaning about spending cash to train new drivers.

 

[whoosh]

Whilst we speak about their obvious staff shortage (unable to run significant numbers of trains without the goodwill of people working on their days off), I'll just mention a qualified driver I worked with who had a successful interview with Virgin West Coast, and was waiting for a date to start.
And waited.
And waited.
And two years went by.
And then it became Avanti.
And then another year went by.
And now he works there.

So did they have more drivers, less, or the same number, after that period of time?
I think there would've been retirements during that period of time, so I'll take a stab in the dark of not more!

Have any TOCs actually done that so overtime/rest day working wasn't needed? If they haven't is there anything else stopping them?

London Underground don't have Rest Day Working for their Train Operators.

Eurostar has run for most of it's existence without Rest Day Working of Drivers, but has recently negotiated a Rest day working agreement with them.

 

[Bald Rick]

Have any TOCs actually done that so overtime/rest day working wasn't needed?

Yes they have, or nearly so, with RDW and overtime used minimally. And there’s lots of it on the way.

Meanwhile I’ve used 4 Avanti services today, 3 bang on time, one a few minutes late. Everything is Ok!

(I have my fingers crossed behind my back).

 

[Peter0124]

They've put some of the STP services in for 15th August, though if you know your Avanti headcodes you should see from this that they all seem to be ONE number less than they usually are. Glitch or what?

 

[43066]

Yes they have, or nearly so, with RDW and overtime used minimally. And there’s lots of it on the way.

Really? Our RDW agreement has just been renewed for another year. On exactly the same terms.

(I have my fingers crossed behind my back).

That’s because you’re focussing too hard on the cricket.

 

[Bald Rick]

Really? Our RDW agreement has just been renewed for another year. On exactly the same terms.

More likely than not, I’d say. Several TOCs already in the no RDW boat.

That’s because you’re focussing too hard on the cricket.

Nope. There no proper cricket on until Wednesday.

 

[43066]

More likely than not, I’d say. Several TOCs already in the no RDW boat.

We shall see!

Nope. There no proper cricket on until Wednesday.

I’ve been invited into the Pavilion at Lords a week on Saturday. England v. SA… not to make you jealous at all

I’ve been instructed to bring a bottle of champagne (strictly not Prosecco) for consumption in the stands before we enter the hallowed ground…

I know next to nothing about cricket, I need to study up. Thankfully I know how to smash back champagne like there’s no tomorrow.

 

[Bald Rick]

I’ve been invited into the Pavilion at Lords a week on Saturday. England v. SA… not to make you jealous at all

I would have seen you there, but life has intervened.

I’ve been instructed to bring a bottle of champagne (not Prosecco) for consumption in the stands before we enter…

One does not drink Prosecco at HQ. Pimms before lunch, Champagne afterwards. But make sure you take enough. It is ferociously expensive to buy there.

 

[43066]

I would have seen you there, but life has intervened.

Genuinely sorry to hear. One day I’m sure.

One does not drink Prosecco at HQ. Pimms before lunch, Champagne afterwards. But make sure you take enough. It is ferociously expensive to buy there.

So I’ve heard. Proper shoes, proper shorts, a proper shirt with a collar…

Really looking forward to it actually .

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

So I’ve heard. Proper shoes, proper shorts, a proper shirt with a collar…
Really looking forward to it actually .

You can buy a tie at the Lord's shop if you forget yours as I did (no pavilion entry otherwise).
I once spent a day in the pavilion at a Middx game with Lancs (away members allowed in, but must be dressed properly ).
Got there and back on ICWC too (then VT) - not sure how easy that will be next week.

 

[43066]

You can buy a tie at the Lord's shop if you forget yours as I did (no pavilion entry otherwise).
I once spent a day in the pavilion at a Middx game with Lancs (away members allowed in, but must be dressed properly ).
Got there and back on ICWC too (then VT) - not sure how easy that will be next week.

The tie hasn’t been mentioned as yet. Perhaps that rule has been relaxed? My mate has that air of confidence that you need in order to demand champagne at entrance? We must be going into the stands first.

He seems to have some hereditary ability to belong to it?

 

[Bald Rick]

The tie hasn’t been mentioned as yet. Perhaps that rule has been relaxed? My mate has that air of confidence that you need in order to demand champagne at entrance? We must be going into the stands first.

He seems to have some hereditary ability to belong to it?

if you are in the pavilion, you need a tie.

if you are in the Members’ Friends’ Enclosures, you don’t.

Anyone (over 18) can walk into the ground on a test match day with a bottle of Champagne, but it takes a certain type of character to walk in with more then one. My record is 4.

 

[Bantamzen]

I’ve been invited into the Pavilion at Lords a week on Saturday. England v. SA… not to make you jealous at all

I’ve been instructed to bring a bottle of champagne (strictly not Prosecco) for consumption in the stands before we enter the hallowed ground…

I know next to nothing about cricket, I need to study up. Thankfully I know how to smash back champagne like there’s no tomorrow.

Train driver: "We want more cash, we're not paid enough"
<slugs back another bottle of Champagne>



(Just to be clear in case anybody didn't pick up on my sarcasm, this of course is a bit of light-hearted banter)

 

[Jimini]

if you are in the pavilion, you need a tie.

if you are in the Members’ Friends’ Enclosures, you don’t.

Anyone (over 18) can walk into the ground on a test match day with a bottle of Champagne, but it takes a certain type of character to walk in with more then one. My record is 4.

On a slightly lower level than that, we normally take a big old picnic in (normally sit in the upper Edrich), complete with home-made sausage rolls etc. Some of those tin foil packages may contain cheeky 330ml cans of IPA cunningly disguised

 

[Bald Rick]

On a slightly lower level than that, we normally take a big old picnic in (normally sit in the upper Edrich), complete with home-made sausage rolls etc. Some of those tin foil packages may contain cheeky 330ml cans of IPA cunningly disguised

Been there, got the badge. Also cans in the Pringle tube, spirits in the fake sunscreen bottle, and Pimms in the Coke bottles. Etc. But that was in my younger, carefree days

 

[Delenn]

Been there, got the badge. Also cans in the Pringle tube, spirits in the fake sunscreen bottle, and Pimms in the Coke bottles. Etc. But that was in my younger, carefree days

Sounds like me in my earlier days trying to smuggle snacks into the cinema!

 

[Bletchleyite]

Sounds like me in my earlier days trying to smuggle snacks into the cinema!

Notably, cinemas now generally allow you to take your own in, other than hot food (because it stinks) and alcohol (because of their licensing conditions). Cineworld certainly do, it says so on their website.

Nonetheless this (by the Lancashire Hotpots) is funny:

(Relevance to Avanti, er, you can take your own food/drink and you can theoretically use their trains to get to Lancashire? )

 

[ainsworth74]

Whilst this cricket chat is enjoyable I'm not sure it's entirely related to the cancellation of Avanti West Coast services so might I ask we leave it there or at least take it to the main Cricket thread?

 

[realaledrinker]

They've put some of the STP services in for 15th August, though if you know your Avanti headcodes you should see from this that they all seem to be ONE number less than they usually are. Glitch or what?

Which website is this info from please?

 

[Huntergreed]

So the 4tph are:

XX:07 to Liverpool
XX:10 to Central (using the old Chester path to include a Crewe call)
XX:20 to Piccadilly
XX:23 to Edinburgh/Blackpool via New Street (calling at all 3 of the intermediates between Euston and Coventry)

With extras at peak times.

Seems sensible, but as the north WCML hasn’t seen any reductions, I fear this will lead to more cancellations.