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Been about 2 months since I recieved 2 fines for my train and I haven't heard back from Chiltern since

hattontrains

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Good evening, I stupidly decided to fare evade in November of 2024, where one time I got on the train and an inspector asked for tickets and I obviously failed to show a valid one. The ticket inspector asked for my name and address and date of birth, and I haven't heard anything since.

A week or two later, a bit more of a bizarre incident happened. I boarded a train at Warwick, a station behind my regular stop Hatton. A ticket inspector then asked me to show my ticket, and I didn't have a printed ticket, however I had an email reciept showing my ticket, which was only valid from Hatton to my destination, not valid from Warwick which was a station one stop behind Hatton. Now, the ticket inspector took a photo of this email reciept on his phone, and told me to go and print out my ticket once we arrived at my stop (the train terminates at my destination so he could definitely wait). Thinking about it, I probably should have just left the station, but I decided to print out the ticket and show him, and it was of course not valid for the stops. He then asked me which stop I got on, when I panicked and said Hatton, which wasn't true and he called me out on it. I did later own up and say I had got on a station behind the one my ticket was valid for. The inspector then yelled at me for lying while we were at the station, before taking away my ticket and making me pay for a new one at the ticket kiosk at my destination. Thankfully, the ticket kiosk worker was a lot more understanding and warned me not to do this again and gave me back my ticket. However, I had written down my name, address, date of birth, and he even made me sign my signature to verify the details I had provided were true, as he thought I was lying about those as well.

For context, I am 16 years old, and own a railcard which I showed on both occassions. I take this route for school every day, but on this occassion, I had to get on at Warwick due to personal reasons.

Do you guys have any advice on what I could do, and if its likely I will get anything more than a penalty fare? Thank you.
 
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30907

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Have you paid a £50 penalty fare each time?
Edit: I think you haven't. You are asking WHAT IF.

The basic answer is, you or a parent may (will) receive a letter from Chiltern threatening you with prosecution. In practice they will agree to settle out of court - you will have to pay for any fares you have avoided plus a sum for admin - provided you engage with them.

If/when the letter arrives please come back here for advice.
 
Last edited:

hattontrains

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Thanks for the response. Quick question(s), slightly naïve perhaps, but could the penalty fare be potentially waived in the first instance if I say that I tried to pay on the train (which I did), but was not allowed to by the inspector? I asked as I did not have any money on my debit card at the time, and the station ticket machine accepted card only, which I couldn't use as I had cash only.

Also, on the second instance, while I suppose I'll have to pay the penalty fare regardless, would there be any way to complain about the inspector's behaviour? He came across as very intimidating in the manner he was yelling at me in front of other people, which I didn't appreciate as you can maybe guess...

Thanks for the help!
 

30907

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Thanks for the response. Quick question(s), slightly naïve perhaps, but could the penalty fare be potentially waived in the first instance if I say that I tried to pay on the train (which I did), but was not allowed to by the inspector? I asked as I did not have any money on my debit card at the time, and the station ticket machine accepted card only, which I couldn't use as I had cash only.
If that is the case, you should have been issued a ticket on board, or been sent a letter asking for the fare.
Also, on the second instance, while I suppose I'll have to pay the penalty fare regardless, would there be any way to complain about the inspector's behaviour? He came across as very intimidating in the manner he was yelling at me in front of other people, which I didn't appreciate as you can maybe guess..
Inspectors often cone across as aggressive to fare evaders. If it is a serious issue with you, wait until your offencecis dealt with then complain to customer services.
 

WesternLancer

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Thanks for the response. Quick question(s), slightly naïve perhaps, but could the penalty fare be potentially waived in the first instance if I say that I tried to pay on the train (which I did), but was not allowed to by the inspector? I asked as I did not have any money on my debit card at the time, and the station ticket machine accepted card only, which I couldn't use as I had cash only.

Also, on the second instance, while I suppose I'll have to pay the penalty fare regardless, would there be any way to complain about the inspector's behaviour? He came across as very intimidating in the manner he was yelling at me in front of other people, which I didn't appreciate as you can maybe guess...

Thanks for the help!
So you’ve been stealing from them, but then want to complain that the person who caught you wasn’t polite.

Stand back and think what most people who don’t steal would think. I would suggest that they might think you should be punished and made to learn a lesson. Being yelled at might be the least of your problems.

I know this might be harsh but there are consequences to what you chose to do.
 

hattontrains

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Hi all, thought it might be polite to update, I got 2 fines, one last week and one yesterday; I paid them off with money I had been saving and its safe to say I've learnt my lesson and I can move on now. Thanks to the @30907 for all their help :D
 

30907

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Hi all, thought it might be polite to update, I got 2 fines, one last week and one yesterday; I paid them off with money I had been saving and its safe to say I've learnt my lesson and I can move on now. Thanks to the @30907 for all their help :D
No problem, and thanks forvthe update.

Do you mean two court fines or (as I guess) two out-of-court settlements?
And did that include a substantial admin cost such as £175?
 

fandroid

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Those are unlikely to have been actual Penalty Fares, as they can't be applied retrospectively. However it's apparent that several train companies are requesting out of court settlements that reflect the same level of payments that they would have got through proper Penalty Fares. I suspect that happens more where the passenger is a minor, as in this case.

The OP is now on Chiltern's records. So they definitely shouldn't do this again, even by accident. Once over 18 they might find themselves in deeper water.
 

hattontrains

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Those are unlikely to have been actual Penalty Fares, as they can't be applied retrospectively. However it's apparent that several train companies are requesting out of court settlements that reflect the same level of payments that they would have got through proper Penalty Fares. I suspect that happens more where the passenger is a minor, as in this case.

The OP is now on Chiltern's records. So they definitely shouldn't do this again, even by accident. Once over 18 they might find themselves in deeper water.
Hello mate, do you mean to say I did in fact get 2 out of court settlements, and that I didn't actually get penalty fares? Please correct me if I am mistaken (and I am most definitely not taking any chances ever again), but I assumed I would just get 2 separate penalty fares as I am under 18?
 

AlterEgo

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Hello mate, do you mean to say I did in fact get 2 out of court settlements, and that I didn't actually get penalty fares? Please correct me if I am mistaken (and I am most definitely not taking any chances ever again), but I assumed I would just get 2 separate penalty fares as I am under 18?
That’s correct. You cannot be penalty fared retrospectively. It seems like you settled out of court for the same amount a penalty fare would cost.
 

jumble

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Hello mate, do you mean to say I did in fact get 2 out of court settlements, and that I didn't actually get penalty fares? Please correct me if I am mistaken (and I am most definitely not taking any chances ever again), but I assumed I would just get 2 separate penalty fares as I am under 18?
You are lucky but I might be minded to complain to Chiltern that they have triple dipped if I have understood correctly which is fairly disgraceful in my view
They should only be doing 2 or 3 in my view but not both and I wonder if the prosecutions are aware of what happened

1) Original invalid fare
2) Fare the Inspector made you buy
3) Out of court settlement of fare avoided £7.00
 

Haywain

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You are lucky but I might be minded to complain to Chiltern that they have triple dipped if I have understood correctly which is fairly disgraceful in my view
They should only be doing 2 or 3 in my view but not both and I wonder if the prosecutions are aware of what happened

1) Original invalid fare
2) Fare the Inspector made you buy
3) Out of court settlement of fare avoided £7.00
Read the first post again and note that the OP didn't actually buy the ticket that the inspector insisted on.
 

hattontrains

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That’s correct. You cannot be penalty fared retrospectively. It seems like you settled out of court for the same amount a penalty fare would cost.
Oh right. Is that common practice now, or Chiltern just deciding to be nice. And no, I most definitely am not trying my luck again:s

Also, separate question, but what's the likelihood of Chiltern going through my online train purchase history? Truth be told I haven't always bought the correct tickets.
 

jumble

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Read the first post again and note that the OP didn't actually buy the ticket that the inspector insisted on.
Read the first post again and note that the OP didn't actually buy the ticket that the inspector insisted on.
I read
"before taking away my ticket and making me pay for a new one at the ticket kiosk at my destination"
If the Ticket inspector did not take away the ticket and did not make the OP pay at the destination then of course you are correct.
I am surprised that apparently the inspector took away the ticket and then gave it to the ticket clerk and did not actually enforce payment of a new ticket but what do I know
 

Hadders

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Also, separate question, but what's the likelihood of Chiltern going through my online train purchase history? Truth be told I haven't always bought the correct tickets.
They will almost certainly do this and factor the cost of other journeys made using invalid tickets into the settlement fee. One of the reasons it takes time for Chiltern to reply, other than their own workload, is because they're waiting for details from online ticket retailers.
 

hattontrains

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Am I going to get another settlement fee? So they've already given me two 50 pound out of court settlements, but I should expect another settlement for other tickets I haven't paid with?

Also, around up to what point in time will they be checking my history of tickets? I had bought tickets before the fine, but for some stupid reason, I decided to stop buying tickets properly about a month after I had my details taken. If they only check my purchasing history from before, then I would expect no fine, otherwise if they count all tickets I failed to purchase after, it could be a much greater fine.

Thank you.
 

30907

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Also, around up to what point in time will they be checking my history of tickets? I had bought tickets before the fine, but for some stupid reason, I decided to stop buying tickets properly about a month after I had my details taken. If they only check my purchasing history from before, then I would expect no fine, otherwise if they count all tickets I failed to purchase after, it could be a much greater fine.

Thank you.
They could potentially run the check up to the date when they requested access to the data. That could be some days after the incident :(
 

Knoodlepot

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Hey have you heard back from chiltern. I am in a similar situation waiting for their response. I am very worried, but I do know I was in the wrong!
It is best you make your own thread. Each case is different. The pros will be able to help you.
 

hattontrains

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Hello all, I was stopped for my details on 2 separate occassions by ticket inspectors on chiltern railways in November 2024. Unfortunately. I decided to fare evade for about 3 or so months afterwards, until I recieved 2 separate penalty fares. What is the likelihood I recieve a court order or out of court settlement potentially if they check my trainline history and see these irregularities? And my second question is the main question I asked, up to what point do they check? I.e. will they check up to when I recieved the fines, or will they maybe look a bit deeper? I would really appreciate your guys help, thanks.
 

John R

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You can assume that they will search all your history. However, if you have received penalty fares for the two instances you were stopped, the general consensus is that they would find it very difficult to prosecute you for any other offences they suspect, as they would need to prove that you personally actually travelled and used the tickets.

I'm not sure whether your last question means that you have continued to avoid the correct fare since those two occasions, but if so I would strongly recommend you pay the correct fare from now on, as continued fare evasion after having two penalty fares and Chiltern (or indeed any company) subsequently discovering it at a result of a stop would make it very challenging to avoid prosecution.
 

AlterEgo

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Have you received any correspondence from Chiltern about this so far?
 

John R

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Sorry, having reread the OP, it sounds as though you were stopped twice in November, had your details taken, and then continued to fare evade, including twice getting penalty fares. Is that correct?

Did you get MG11 forms for the two instances in November? If so, can you post them with any identifying details (name, reference no) removed. They have 6 months to prosecute you, and will usually write to you before then to ask for your side of the story, so time is running out for them, but they are not out of time yet.

If they see that you have subsequently continued fare evasion then the best outcome is they build the cost of all those journeys into any settlement they offer you. However, it may well make them less inclined to offer a settlement, as you don’t appear to have learnt your lesson despite being stopped four times.
 

minderbinder

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If they see that you have subsequently continued fare evasion then the best outcome is they build the cost of all those journeys into any settlement they offer you. However, it may well make them less inclined to offer a settlement, as you don’t appear to have learnt your lesson despite being stopped four times.
OP says they are 16 years old so I would expect prosecution is out of the question.
 

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