Bicester/Oxford Adventures

[Gerald Fiennes]

Just spent an entertaining half an hour reviewing fares to the new stations via Chiltern. As ever, got lost in a myriad of routing points, negative easements etc. etc.. To make a circular day journey, MYB, Bicester Town, Oxford Parkway, Bus to Oxford then PAD (or v.v.), is it best to get a CDR from London Terminals to Banbury and then a CDS from Bicester Town to Oxford, ie. assume the London Terminals to Banbury ticket is valid for a break of journey at Bicester Town? I'm not sure why it is all so complicated, presumbly once the new link to Oxford stations opens then the current London Terminals - Oxford CDR fare would be valid each way (and Chiltern's yield will drop a bit).

 

[swt_passenger]

Agree it's a mess, but this was all discussed at length when the route opened, and for quite a long period afterwards, so I wouldn't expect it to be gone through again. You might want to look at one of the earlier threads here:

http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=122724&highlight=bicester

and it has also generated a lot of discussion in the 'routing guide thread', because there are negative easements at present:

http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?p=2330950#post2330950

 

[CyrusWuff]

Given that Bicester Village isn't on the line of route between London and Banbury, you could well find yourself asked to purchase a ticket from the previous stop (generally High Wycombe or Haddenham & Thame Parkway, depending on which train you get) or potentially Penalty Fared for being off route.

And yes, once the line between Oxford Parkway and Oxford opens in December, "Any Permitted" tickets to Oxford will undoubtedly be valid from Marylebone under the "direct train" rule.

 

[Haywain]

And yes, once the line between Oxford Parkway and Oxford opens in December, "Any Permitted" tickets to Oxford will undoubtedly be valid from Marylebone under the "direct train" rule.

Unless, of course, the 'Any Permitted' tickets are suddenly replaced with route 'via Didcot' tickets alongside other tickets with route 'via High Wycombe'.

 

[Gerald Fiennes]

Agree it's a mess, but this was all discussed at length when the route opened, and for quite a long period afterwards, so I wouldn't expect it to be gone through again. You might want to look at one of the earlier threads here:

http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=122724&highlight=bicester

and it has also generated a lot of discussion in the 'routing guide thread', because there are negative easements at present:

http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?p=2330950#post2330950

Thanks for the response. Yes, I looked through both threads previously but I still wasn't too clear what the final position was. None of the journey planners I looked at would give me a fare that was valid each way. I am also a bit surprised to see that there is debate about whether the bus link between Parkway and Oxford is a replacement for a train since there is no closure of the route so is there no requirement on the 'owning' TOC (in this case CH) to arrange alternative transport?

 

[LexyBoy]

Unless, of course, the 'Any Permitted' tickets are suddenly replaced with route 'via Didcot' tickets alongside other tickets with route 'via High Wycombe'.

In which case of course the more expensive will be a de facto Any Permitted. But not a lot of people know that.

 

[Haywain]

In which case of course the more expensive will be a de facto Any Permitted. But not a lot of people know that.

Each priced the same? Adding the inconvenience of zero-fare excesses.

 

[kieron]

Given that Bicester Village isn't on the line of route between London and Banbury,

It's not valid on an "any permitted" London-Banbury ticket owing to an easement, but this easement has no effect on "Chiltern only" advance tickets.

 

[Nicholas43]

I am also a bit surprised to see that there is debate about whether the bus link between Parkway and Oxford is a replacement for a train since there is no closure of the route so is there no requirement on the 'owning' TOC (in this case CH) to arrange alternative transport?

Indeed. Chiltern has for several years been franchised to run trains between Oxford and Bicester London Road / Town / "Village", and still offers reasonably priced rail tickets for this journey which, of course, include travel on the replacement bus. In my opinion, the purported "negative easement" making Oxford-London terminals "any permitted" tickets invalid via High Wycombe is void, because there are direct trains Oxford-High Wycombe-MYB which, alas, are part-replaced by buses during the scandalously over-running engineering work to re-instate double track on the section between Oxford and Water Eaton. However, if you wish to avoid a possible annoying discussion with gateline staff at Oxford Parkway, a work-around for the round trip is to choose a MYB to Islip service (including the ones which double-back from Oxford Parkway) and use a London Terminals-Islip "any permitted" return ticket (which even Chiltern admit is valid via High Wycombe), and is certainly valid via Oxford for the return journey. Islip is a pretty village with at least one good pub, but you may prefer not, in practice, to alight.

 

[Tetchytyke]

In my opinion, the purported "negative easement" making Oxford-London terminals "any permitted" tickets invalid via High Wycombe is void, because there are direct trains Oxford-High Wycombe-MYB

Which "direct" trains are these then? Chiltern Railways have never operated direct trains from Oxford to London Marylebone; they used to require a change at Bicester and now they require a change at Oxford Parkway.

I expect that the current Oxford-London any permitted fare will change to a "via Didcot" fare, with a new higher-priced any permitted fare being created.

 

[Nicholas43]

Which "direct" trains are these then?

Every half hour. During the scandalously protracted engineering work, part of the journey of these direct trains is replaced by buses. Chiltern's Oxford>Marylebone service, which they advertise as "the first new link for 100 years between a major city and London", is an extension, via the new Bicester chord, of their established service from Oxford to Bicester Town / "Village". For this, through rail tickets continue to be on sale (of course).