block aggregate train

[L&Y Robert]

I see this morning that the block stone train delivery to the Lefarge stone-coating plant north of Banbury has reversed too far down the siding, gone into the buffers and pushed them off. Looks as if the last wagon (the one with the conveyor-belt pulley or drum or device for tensioning and returning the belt) has de-railed. Its sitting at an awkward angle anyhow, and of course, being a block train, they can't uncouple it and unload the rest of the train. Whoops!

Update at 13-00 today - train hasn't moved, loco still attached, hi-viz persons inspecting, photographing, moving about, but nothing else happening. Noted two other stone trains thereabouts, one in the adjacent (shorter) siding, the other on the Down Relief.

 

[Freightmaster]

Freightliner Heavy Haul were operating the train today on behalf of DB,
so presumably the traincrew were not familiar with the correct berthing/
unloading procedure?

MARK

 

[L&Y Robert]

Five o'clock up-date: Engine has gone away but the crippled loaded train left in place. The other two stone trains I saw at the north end this morning gone also. All quiet on the scene. I had binoculars this time, and got a closer look from the bridge: the further axle of the last wagon has climbed up onto the rail-built buffers, bending them somewhat, and lifting the further wheel-set clear of the rails. The quality of the track down the end of this siding leaves a lot to be desired, old and coroded bull-head rail, very decayed oak keys, spongy sleepers nearly submerged in the wet ground. It's a wonder it hasn't gone out of guage, especially with the axle-loads of these big wagons rolling along it.

 

[Rugd1022]

I took it down to Banbury this morning (6G32) so it would have been my relief who had the derailment. The two roads there are not exactly in the best condition to start with it has to be said. I doubt it's a case of not being familiar with the operaton though... the method for unloading and positioning of the wagons depends on what grade of stone is in each set of ten, we just follow the unloader's instruction as to where they are placed.

L&Y Robert... it wouldn't have been three seperate trains you saw but three parts of the same train... it went down with forty hoppers plus the unloader

 

[L&Y Robert]

L&Y Robert... it wouldn't have been three seperate trains you saw but three parts of the same train... it went down with forty hoppers plus the unloader

Corks! 40 of those hoppers all at once? Quite a problem getting it all organised for discharge - I can quite see that. Of course, operations are confined to the available length between canal bridge to the north and the "New" road bridge abutment - the site of the mangled buffer stop - to the south. Another hundred yards beyond the bridge would help,
Looking north from the other bridge, the track for both sidings looks exceedingly ropy. And I've never understood why both sidings emerge seperately from the down relief, each requiring (I assume) remote control from Banbury North.
And while I'm writing, is that very bright but stubby signal on the relief a ground signal? If not, what?

 

[Rugd1022]

Corks! 40 of those hoppers all at once? Quite a problem getting it all organised for discharge - I can quite see that. Of course, operations are confined to the available length between canal bridge to the north and the "New" road bridge abutment - the site of the mangled buffer stop - to the south. Another hundred yards beyond the bridge would help,
Looking north from the other bridge, the track for both sidings looks exceedingly ropy. And I've never understood why both sidings emerge seperately from the down relief, each requiring (I assume) remote control from Banbury North.
And while I'm writing, is that very bright but stubby signal on the relief a ground signal? If not, what?

The two sets of points for the sidings are operated from Banbury North Ground Frame, which is released from Banbury North Signalbox to be worked by the Shunter. The layout is probably a leftover from semaphore days I'd imagine. The track certainly is ropey... before I left the site this morning (an hour ortwo before the derailment happened) I too kseveral photos of the yard and the train being unloaded, showing only too well the state of the P/Way - I'll be loading one or two onto my flickr page and will link them here.

The 'bright but stubby signal' is Banbury North's main aspect 'BN34' which has a position light associated with it for shunting moves. Once the ground frame has been given to the Shunter we can pass this signal at danger for shunting purposes. In rear of this signal is another, 'BN36' which we can also pass at danger when the frame is open.

The full set of forty wagons aren't all unloaded at once, they have to be split depending on what their contents are and placed according to the unloader's instructions. (Pics will be posted on flickr showing this in action).
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
First pic here, taken at around 07.30 this morning looking north... the wagons on the right are standing on the Down Goods Loop (ie: not the relief... ), the ground frame is in the distance beneath the yard lamp to the left...

http://www.flickr.com/photos/21403537@N00/8071524552/in/photostream
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Second photo... the first set of ten hoppers on the left have already been discharghed and 66 614 draws forward with the next set before setting back into the siding...

http://www.flickr.com/photos/21403537@N00/8071719021/in/photostream

 

[L&Y Robert]

the wagons on the right are standing on the Down Goods Loop (ie: not the relief... ), the ground frame is in the distance beneath the yard lamp to the left...

Sorry, yes "Down Goods Loop" then.
Where does this stone come from? If from the Birmingham direction the engine has to 'run round' somewhere - in Banbury? And then heave the whole thing over two (maybe three?) crossovers onto the Down Goods Loop []. Or onto the Down Main, perhaps - there doesn't seem to be (looking from the 'other' bridge) enough of the loop for a train to clear the siding points and set back into the sidings, OR do you leave a piece of the train on the Loop, as I saw today? Maybe two pieces? It's cumbersome, the whole thing needs a jolly good tidy up, I think. Extension of the Loop over the canal would make sense (it used to! - in the days when my train to Newcastle took the Woodford line at Banbury North Junction. Ah, yes, to dream awhile). HOWEVER - if from the Oxford direction things are a bit easier I'd guess, onto the Down G.L. by Banb. N Box, and you're there! But the return trip with the empties will require a run round somewhere. Yes, hours of fun with my Hornby-Dublo.

 

[bnsf734]

The self unloading train runs from Lafarge in Mountsorrel Leicestershire, between Leicester & Loughborough on the Midland Mainline. It is routed via Birmingham and so will approach Banbury from the north.

I was reading the RAIB report on this train when a wagon derailed last year at Bordesley Junction. The report was released in the last week or two.

Link here:

http://www.raib.gov.uk/cms_resources.cfm?file=/120919_R192012_Bordesley_Junction.pdf

 

[Rugd1022]

the wagons on the right are standing on the Down Goods Loop (ie: not the relief... ), the ground frame is in the distance beneath the yard lamp to the left...

Sorry, yes "Down Goods Loop" then.
Where does this stone come from? If from the Birmingham direction the engine has to 'run round' somewhere - in Banbury? And then heave the whole thing over two (maybe three?) crossovers onto the Down Goods Loop []. Or onto the Down Main, perhaps - there doesn't seem to be (looking from the 'other' bridge) enough of the loop for a train to clear the siding points and set back into the sidings, OR do you leave a piece of the train on the Loop, as I saw today? Maybe two pieces? It's cumbersome, the whole thing needs a jolly good tidy up, I think. Extension of the Loop over the canal would make sense (it used to! - in the days when my train to Newcastle took the Woodford line at Banbury North Junction. Ah, yes, to dream awhile). HOWEVER - if from the Oxford direction things are a bit easier I'd guess, onto the Down G.L. by Banb. N Box, and you're there! But the return trip with the empties will require a run round somewhere. Yes, hours of fun with my Hornby-Dublo.

The train originates from Mountsorrel Quarries in Leicestershire, arrives on the Up Goods at Banbury Station and we run round it there, once we've done that and are ready to move we ring the North 'Box Bobbie and he pulls off the two dummies for us to proceed across to the Down Goods Loop. We then draw past BN43 signal a short distance, chop off the the first set (leaving thirty hoppers behind on the Goods), then draw forward clear of the points, the Shunter operates the Ground Frame and we set back with the first ten and the unloader.... we shunt backwards and forwards like this until all four sets of ten are unloaded, reform the train then (with a bit of luck) the train is right away back to Mountsorrel. It's not really that cumbersome, it 's a pretty straight forward way of doing things and hasn't changed in decades - no need to really. The only bugbear is it involves a lot of walking for the Shunter which in bad weather isn't much fun. Aside from that it's a doddle (derailments notwithstanding..!).

 

[L&Y Robert]

Thanks Rugd1022. I have wondered - never seen this evolution either here (on the bridge) or at Banbury.

Up-date at mid-day on Wednesday (10th):
Well, they've re-railed the end wagon this lunch-time after disentangling it from the buffer stop. They brought in an engine (from Coventry they said) and hauled the whole 10 vehicles forward. (Could it have been 34666? Forgive me, but I've lost track of classes of engines since the demise of the Black 5s). Unfortunately they then had to TAKE OFF the derailed vehicle's buffers to free it from the buffer-stop, which the buffers had become 'hooked' onto. It wasn't an orthodox re-railing job either because the rails had spread under the wagon, one wheel very definitely 'on the floor'. So they jacked it up, and with some kind of turnbuckle tie bar things, pulled the rails back (nearly) to gauge, then gingerly lowered the wheel set onto them. The loco then hauled the rake forwards and away from the mangled buffer stop and off the out-of-gauge bit of track. My correspondent said the train would now have to return to Mount Sorrel (whence it came) because they hadn't got the unloader vehicle here, and in any case the load was wanted elsewhere. Well, that's what he said. Once it was all OK I left (late for work again, and shivering cold).
Post-script: a man was busy digging out the fishplated rail joint just ahead of the train (yes, you have to dig to find them, that's how messy the site is) and I wondered if the track of the siding was to be replaced, or maybe the siding truncated at that point. I'll keep my eye on it and report anything interesting.

 

[Rugd1022]

Thanks Rugd1022. I have wondered - never seen this evolution either here (on the bridge) or at Banbury.

Up-date at mid-day on Wednesday (10th):
Well, they've re-railed the end wagon this lunch-time after disentangling it from the buffer stop. They brought in an engine (from Coventry they said) and hauled the whole 10 vehicles forward. (Could it have been 34666? Forgive me, but I've lost track of classes of engines since the demise of the Black 5s). Unfortunately they then had to TAKE OFF the derailed vehicle's buffers to free it from the buffer-stop, which the buffers had become 'hooked' onto. It wasn't an orthodox re-railing job either because the rails had spread under the wagon, one wheel very definitely 'on the floor'. So they jacked it up, and with some kind of turnbuckle tie bar things, pulled the rails back (nearly) to gauge, then gingerly lowered the wheel set onto them. The loco then hauled the rake forwards and away from the mangled buffer stop and off the out-of-gauge bit of track. My correspondent said the train would now have to return to Mount Sorrel (whence it came) because they hadn't got the unloader vehicle here, and in any case the load was wanted elsewhere. Well, that's what he said. Once it was all OK I left (late for work again, and shivering cold).
Post-script: a man was busy digging out the fishplated rail joint just ahead of the train (yes, you have to dig to find them, that's how messy the site is) and I wondered if the track of the siding was to be replaced, or maybe the siding truncated at that point. I'll keep my eye on it and report anything interesting.

The loco was 66 614 from Bardon Hill, the same loco I had on the train yesterday. If they do truncate the siding slightly instead of repairing it, it may affect future unloading... there's a reason we have to push the wagons right onto the blocks!!

 

[L&Y Robert]

BNSF 734 mentions:
I was reading the RAIB report on this train when a wagon derailed last year at Bordesley Junction. The report was released in the last week or two.

I've (now) read this report as well, and to summarise in one line, the Bordesley Junction derailment was the un-fortunate co-incidence of two things - wagon suspension defect and track defect.

Well now! We've certainly got track defects on the Stone Siding (have a look at RUGD1022's pictures), and one of these wagons could, maybe, develop the same suspension defect whilst creaking and groaning its way down it. Even if a wheel flange rises to rail-head level for a yard or two, all might yet be well because the siding is straight EXCEPT FOR a rather nasty sharp bend at mid point. That's where it'll be! Check rail needed. (More realistically complete renewal needed. Concrete sleepers and Pandrol clips this time on a fresh sub-base).

But it might be the engine that drops between the rails. They’ll need more than a couple of jacks and a few bits of timber then!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Well now! We've certainly got track defects on the Stone Siding.

This is to be read in Andy Parson's voice!

 

[L&Y Robert]

Brief update this morning (Friday 09th Nov.) Nice new rail-built buffer stop (on second-hand and rather scruffy timbers) on site, and 3 hi-viz operatives busy at the end of the siding, cutting rail, drilling it for fish-plate bolts etc. Looks as if it'll be positined exactly where the old one was, so no extra track.