Britail M-Pass

[classicmds]

I posted a few years ago about some problems using a Britail pass.

I'm visiting UK again and this time decided to use the Britrail M-Pass. This basically gives you a PDF with a QR code to scan at the ticket gate.

However, the main problem is that the QR code does not work. It scans at the barrier but displays "Seek Assistance". I then have to get into a small conversation each time with the ticket official who either tells me to scan it again, or tells me that I need to print it out. On the train, some guards have remarked "I've never seen this before" or "couldn't you print this out?" One took a photo of it to show his boss.

The QR code not working is the main problem. Wondered if anyone had heard any other issues in relation to this. It's obviously scanning something but not enough info to open the barrier. It obviously counts against the whole point of having the M-Pass to start with if it doesn't actually scan properly.

 

[Watershed]

The Aztec code on these passes is supposed to open barriers, but that depends on gateline operators having programmed in the Britrail locations as valid.

As the M-Pass is a relatively new development, it might still take time for all TOCs to get round to this.

You might want to raise it with the customer services of the relevant TOC(s).

 

[classicmds]

The Aztec code on these passes is supposed to open barriers, but that depends on gateline operators having programmed in the Britrail locations as valid.

As the M-Pass is a relatively new development, it might still take time for all TOCs to get round to this.

You might want to raise it with the customer services of the relevant TOC(s).

I've tried on Greater Anglia, Thameslink, London Overground, Southeastern, Heathrow Express and Great Western...so I'm guessing from this sample that the chances of a ToC having it working are probably slim!

One other thing is that when scanned by a guard on the train with a handheld device it seems to scan ok

 

[30907]

Some QR/Aztec readers have problems with phone screens (or so I was told at an Historic Scotland location last year) - if the hassle is becoming too much, is it worth trying to get a printout and testing that?

 

[rg177]

This is probably similar to when I was issued an All Line Rover on paper stock which came with an Aztec code to scan a few weeks ago.

No bother at all on the trains but an absolute nightmare on gates. The majority of staff would just tap you through but at certain stations (Waterloo, Liverpool Street and Southend Victoria in particular) you'd end up in a protracted conversation arguing why your ticket was in fact valid.

 

[PeterC]

Some QR/Aztec readers have problems with phone screens (or so I was told at an Historic Scotland location last year) - if the hassle is becoming too much, is it worth trying to get a printout and testing that?

I have worked with QR codes on event tickets and it was pot luck trying to use the readers on phone screens. I always take a printed copy of any ticket or authority that has a bar or QR code these days.

 

[MikeWh]

A trick I've learned in Iceland is to put your screen brightness up to the max while scanning.

 

[Wolfie]

I have worked with QR codes on event tickets and it was pot luck trying to use the readers on phone screens. I always take a printed copy of any ticket or authority that has a bar or QR code these days.

... and people say that magnetic strips are unreliable...

 

[XAM2175]

I have worked with QR codes on event tickets and it was pot luck trying to use the readers on phone screens. I always take a printed copy of any ticket or authority that has a bar or QR code these days.

A trick I've learned in Iceland is to put your screen brightness up to the max while scanning.

This is the key - 2D barcodes are read with a camera rather than a laser like older 1D symbologies. When the barcode is on paper the scanner can use an illuminator (usually an array of red LEDs) to bring the brightness up to sufficient levels, but the illuminator can't make a phone's screen brighter - so phone's backlight needs to be increased instead.

A lot of ticketing apps nowadays increase the brightness automatically when presenting a barcode, but if you're showing a PDF then you'll need to do it manually.

... and people say that magnetic strips are unreliable...

Yes, they are. Much more so than barcoded tickets, and with a much larger ongoing maintenance cost too.

 

[TEW]

I scanned a Britrail Flexi Pass M-Ticket recently. It told me it wasn't valid on my service, as the origin and destination were both apparently Britrail and it also said it was expired, as the valid date was set only as the date the validity started. Basically scanning the Aztec Code provided me with no useful information whatsoever. I'm not surprised they don't work gatelines.

 

[cona321]

I found that the BritRail M-ticket only worked on gates that were operated by a long distance train service. It definitely works on the LNER and GWR barriers.
I tried to board the Great Northern service at Moorgate and had to argue with the TfL worker to let me through the gates there, he kept telling me to go to Liverpool Street to get a paper ticket, and had a similar issue with C2C.

 

[classicmds]

Some QR/Aztec readers have problems with phone screens (or so I was told at an Historic Scotland location last year) - if the hassle is becoming too much, is it worth trying to get a printout and testing that?

That's a good idea; I'll try it next time and see what happens.

This is the key - 2D barcodes are read with a camera rather than a laser like older 1D symbologies. When the barcode is on paper the scanner can use an illuminator (usually an array of red LEDs) to bring the brightness up to sufficient levels, but the illuminator can't make a phone's screen brighter - so phone's backlight needs to be increased instead.

A lot of ticketing apps nowadays increase the brightness automatically when presenting a barcode, but if you're showing a PDF then you'll need to do it manually.



Yes, they are. Much more so than barcoded tickets, and with a much larger ongoing maintenance cost too.

I did crank the phone brightness to max but did not make a difference.

I scanned a Britrail Flexi Pass M-Ticket recently. It told me it wasn't valid on my service, as the origin and destination were both apparently Britrail and it also said it was expired, as the valid date was set only as the date the validity started. Basically scanning the Aztec Code provided me with no useful information whatsoever. I'm not surprised they don't work gatelines.

One train guard told me something like this... although it scanned something, he said the info provided on the screen was useless to him, and that he had to read the info on the PDF ticket to learn anything

 

[Haywain]

... and people say that magnetic strips are unreliable...

Well, you can’t adjust a magnetic stripe to improve the chances of it working!

 

[XAM2175]

I did crank the phone brightness to max but did not make a difference.

Did it scan the barcode?

 

[classicmds]

Did it scan the barcode?

Whatever the brightness, it always scans, in the sense that the ticket barrier recognizes that some kind of data has been sent. It always triggers the message "Seek Assistance" on the barrier LCD screen. I therefore think that the brightness or zoom or whatever isn't the issue: I suspect it is reading the QR code adequately, but that the data in that QR code is not sufficient to allow the barrier to open. I think it is probably as TEW noted something like it saying that the destination/origin is Britrail, and that this is not programmed into the barrier's code to recognize as legitimate.

 

[XAM2175]

Whatever the brightness, it always scans, in the sense that the ticket barrier recognizes that some kind of data has been sent. It always triggers the message "Seek Assistance" on the barrier LCD screen. I therefore think that the brightness or zoom or whatever isn't the issue: I suspect it is reading the QR code adequately, but that the data in that QR code is not sufficient to allow the barrier to open.

Yes, it's a data problem in your case. My comment was directed at the suggestion that they were hard to scan.

 

[classicmds]

On Monday I had a bumper day experience with the M-Pass.

Greater Anglia on-train guard: "What the...?! I've never seen this. This tells me nothing. Well I guess if you say it's valid. Can I take a photo of this to show someone?"

Gate line at Stratford Mainline: "What's this? Hey Sam, come look at this?! Have you ever seen anything like this? Britrail? Why can't you print it out? Can I take a photo of this to show people? Hey John -- is this valid? OK, go on through"

Gate line at Stratford International: "Not sure this is valid on this service. Hang on. Hey Jim, take a look at this.... [Jim walks over, and says,] Well, I've never...what is this? Britail? Never heard of it. You say it's valid on all routes? Well that's useful. Look it has a QR code, can you..., well I suppose we don't have the scanners here, well go on then I'll let you through

Ticket office at Hampstead Heath (LO): "What is this? No this is not valid. I mean it doesn't tell me what routes it's valid on?... Yes, I've heard of Britrail -- they used to run the railways - British Rail. But this is not... I mean, why isn't this on an Oyster Card or a printed ticket? I can't let you through...it doesn't say.... where does it say the boundary stations? But this is not... ok I'll let you through this once, but you'll need to get this sorted out for future travel"

Ticket office at West Hampstead (LO): Long, deep silence, lasting at least ten seconds. "Where you travelling?". Me" "Camden Road." Another long deep silence. "Go on then."

 

[alistairlees]

On Monday I had a bumper day experience with the M-Pass.

Greater Anglia on-train guard: "What the...?! I've never seen this. This tells me nothing. Well I guess if you say it's valid. Can I take a photo of this to show someone?"

Gate line at Stratford Mainline: "What's this? Hey Sam, come look at this?! Have you ever seen anything like this? Britrail? Why can't you print it out? Can I take a photo of this to show people? Hey John -- is this valid? OK, go on through"

Gate line at Stratford International: "Not sure this is valid on this service. Hang on. Hey Jim, take a look at this.... [Jim walks over, and says,] Well, I've never...what is this? Britail? Never heard of it. You say it's valid on all routes? Well that's useful. Look it has a QR code, can you..., well I suppose we don't have the scanners here, well go on then I'll let you through

Ticket office at Hampstead Heath (LO): "What is this? No this is not valid. I mean it doesn't tell me what routes it's valid on?... Yes, I've heard of Britrail -- they used to run the railways - British Rail. But this is not... I mean, why isn't this on an Oyster Card or a printed ticket? I can't let you through...it doesn't say.... where does it say the boundary stations? But this is not... ok I'll let you through this once, but you'll need to get this sorted out for future travel"

Ticket office at West Hampstead (LO): Long, deep silence, lasting at least ten seconds. "Where you travelling?". Me" "Camden Road." Another long deep silence. "Go on then."

No ticket issues. Five staff training / knowledge issues. Though I appreciate that the complexity of tcketing invented by the TOCs does not make training (for the very same TOCs) easy.

 

[classicmds]

No ticket issues. Five staff training / knowledge issues. Though I appreciate that the complexity of tcketing invented by the TOCs does not make training (for the very same TOCs) easy.

Yes I think training is the issue. But I do wonder whether the pass needs more info on it, though, given that the ideal world where every member of staff knows about Britrail Mobile passes will probably never exist? Should it actually state something like "Valid on all National Rail routes"? (If only because the customer will end up having to do the training of the staff on the spot, and it would be useful to have a bit more backup from the pass itself in trying to explain the issue!)

 

[tspaul26]

Should it actually state something like "Valid on all National Rail routes"?

That should lead to some fun conversations with London Overground gatelines!

And potentially Merseyrail

And Scotrail

 

[bkhtele]

The instructions we have are manually check mobile ticket.
1. Scan - clearly they often don't work
2. it is valid, date/area?
3. Check name matches passport on m-pass/correct passport number
I believe these are standard instructions to all Tocs!
Good luck with your ticket, I think I have seen 1 or 2 mobile version examples

 

[island]

The instructions we have are manually check mobile ticket.
1. Scan - clearly they often don't work
2. it is valid, date/area?
3. Check name matches passport on m-pass/correct passport number
I believe these are standard instructions to all Tocs!
Good luck with your ticket, I think I have seen 1 or 2 mobile version examples

Instructions to this effect are indeed available to all TOC staff via the Internal KnowledgeBase page 168547, along with detailed instructions as to how gatelines and ticket scanners ought to be programmed.

 

[Flying Snail]

No ticket issues. Five staff training / knowledge issues. Though I appreciate that the complexity of tcketing invented by the TOCs does not make training (for the very same TOCs) easy.

It very much is a ticket issue if they are not correctly programmed to open the gates. Removing the need to queue up at the manual barriers (when the staff haven't sodded off leaving them closed and unattended) is the only benefit to the customer in using these m-passes over the paper tickets.

If they don't work the barriers it appears from the OP's experiences there is even more hassle involved in getting past gatelines with a rejected m-pass, these are just an aggro magnet for unsuspecting tourists, an utterly crappy way of treating visitors.

Paper Britrail tickets rarely get questioned in my experience, I would often get confused looks but most staff are at least able to recognise them as a ticket, even if they don't know how to read them properly for validity and it is very unusual to not get waved through.

That should lead to some fun conversations with London Overground gatelines!

And potentially Merseyrail

And Scotrail

Overground gateline staff pretending they are not part of National Rail is definitely an issue. While merseyrail do make buying network tickets difficult I have never had any trouble using britrail on their lines. Scotrail staff seem better trained than most and probably see a higher amount of tourists than most as well, I'd be very surprised if anyone had issues using these tickets in Scotland.

Instructions to this effect are indeed available to all TOC staff via the Internal KnowledgeBase page 168547, along with detailed instructions as to how gatelines and ticket scanners ought to be programmed.

Of course the catch is the sort of staff that cause issue through their ignorance of the rules are also far too arrogant to admit they may need to look anything up. They just throw out an opinion/guess as fact and double down on their stance when told they are wrong.

 

[Horizon22]

No ticket issues. Five staff training / knowledge issues. Though I appreciate that the complexity of tcketing invented by the TOCs does not make training (for the very same TOCs) easy.

Knowledge yes / training perhaps less so? It's obviously something nobody has even thought of training and even if they do at induction it might well be years until they ever come across it. I am presuming it should be encoded to work in all gatelines, although that might then become subject of fraud / scamming.