Caledonian Sleeper

[alistairlees]

Despite having lived in the UK for quite and while and having planned to do this earlier, I'll finally be taking the sleeper for the first time this week (London-Fort William).

Quite keen to not miss the scenic parts of the West Highland Line but also want to get enough sleep to not be a wreck simply for getting up at 5am and looking at suburbs of Edinburgh and Glasgow - no offense to them but they're not unfamiliar. Having looked at the timetable, I was thinking of setting the alarm for about 6.30/6.45am when, if all goes well, we ought to be around Helensburgh/Garelochhead. Does that sound sensible - or would you get up earlier (or indeed later) for the good views?

I'll be going back from Oban to Glasgow on a daytime train a week later, so at least as far as the Crianlarich-Glasgow portion is concerned I'll get two chances of seeing it.

Thanks!

Helensburgh is where it gets interesting, so yes. Not many other people up and in the lounge car at that point though last time I was on the Fort William (in June).

 

[trebor79]

Despite having lived in the UK for quite and while and having planned to do this earlier, I'll finally be taking the sleeper for the first time this week (London-Fort William).

Quite keen to not miss the scenic parts of the West Highland Line but also want to get enough sleep to not be a wreck simply for getting up at 5am and looking at suburbs of Edinburgh and Glasgow - no offense to them but they're not unfamiliar. Having looked at the timetable, I was thinking of setting the alarm for about 6.30/6.45am when, if all goes well, we ought to be around Helensburgh/Garelochhead. Does that sound sensible - or would you get up earlier (or indeed later) for the good views?

I'll be going back from Oban to Glasgow on a daytime train a week later, so at least as far as the Crianlarich-Glasgow portion is concerned I'll get two chances of seeing it.

Thanks!

Sounds like a plan though I'll be amazed if you need an alarm!

 

[Royston Vasey]

Despite having lived in the UK for quite and while and having planned to do this earlier, I'll finally be taking the sleeper for the first time this week (London-Fort William).

Quite keen to not miss the scenic parts of the West Highland Line but also want to get enough sleep to not be a wreck simply for getting up at 5am and looking at suburbs of Edinburgh and Glasgow - no offense to them but they're not unfamiliar. Having looked at the timetable, I was thinking of setting the alarm for about 6.30/6.45am when, if all goes well, we ought to be around Helensburgh/Garelochhead. Does that sound sensible - or would you get up earlier (or indeed later) for the good views?

I'll be going back from Oban to Glasgow on a daytime train a week later, so at least as far as the Crianlarich-Glasgow portion is concerned I'll get two chances of seeing it.

Thanks!

I woke up around Helensburgh and it's scenic enough but not unmissable. Arrochar & Tarbet at 0708 is where Loch Lomond swings into view which I'd say is the start of the best scenery, albeit somewhat obscured by trees to begin with.

I'd certainly want to be in the Club car for breakfast and views before Crianlarich (0745) or Tyndrum (0759) to enjoy Rannoch Moor. We were able to stay in the Club Car (free refills of coffee) almost all the way to Fort Bill.

I think your plan is about right, breakfast at 7.15 maybe. Hope you get enough sleep that the alarm isn't too unwelcome at 0645!

 

[Bald Rick]

Despite having lived in the UK for quite and while and having planned to do this earlier, I'll finally be taking the sleeper for the first time this week (London-Fort William).

Quite keen to not miss the scenic parts of the West Highland Line but also want to get enough sleep to not be a wreck simply for getting up at 5am and looking at suburbs of Edinburgh and Glasgow - no offense to them but they're not unfamiliar. Having looked at the timetable, I was thinking of setting the alarm for about 6.30/6.45am when, if all goes well, we ought to be around Helensburgh/Garelochhead. Does that sound sensible - or would you get up earlier (or indeed later) for the good views?

I'll be going back from Oban to Glasgow on a daytime train a week later, so at least as far as the Crianlarich-Glasgow portion is concerned I'll get two chances of seeing it.

Thanks!

you might want to be a touch earlier than Helensburgh; the line runs along the Clyde / Firth of Clyde from a couple of miles west of Dalreoch, and the views across the Firth can be nice in the sunrise. 1Y11 is booked through Dalreoch 0618; the Dumbarton Central stop 3 minutes beforehand may well have you awake anyway.

 

[snowleopard]

Thank you all for the amazingly swift and detailed responses! And @trebor79 you might be quite right that we don't need an alarm and are awake all the way from at least GLQ or Dalmuir anyway...
But for the eventuality that we don't wake up by ourselves, I'll probably set a first alarm for 6.20ish for a first pre-breakfast glimpse of the Clyde from the room, and then a second/backup alarm a bit later to get showered and into the lounge car for Loch Lomond at the latest. There'll be enough opportunities for a sleep in later in these holidays!
Thanks again

 

[paul1609]

I'm with Bald Rick the clydeside run is worth seeing, Garelochhead to Arrochar alongside Loch Long with occasional views of the Cobbler and Arocher Alps is at least on a par with the Loch Lomond section imho.

 

[GordonT]

Helensburgh is the point at which you leave the Central Lowlands of Scotland and enter the Highlands. I'd agree with those who suggest being up around Dumbarton and enjoy the transition from suburban railway onto the West Highland single line from Craigendoran junction. Hopefully timekeeping will be good on your journey.

 

[Cheshire Scot]

Helensburgh is the point at which you leave the Central Lowlands of Scotland and enter the Highlands. I'd agree with those who suggest being up around Dumbarton and enjoy the transition from suburban railway onto the West Highland single line from Craigendoran junction. Hopefully timekeeping will be good on your journey.

Great views across the Clyde on the initial climb from Craigendoran - starting from sea level you very quickly gain height.

 

[GS250]

Question regarding the 66 answered elsewhere.

Have the sleepers been extremely busy in general during the past few months?

 

[lawried123]

Helensburgh is where it gets interesting, so yes. Not many other people up and in the lounge car at that point though last time I was on the Fort William (in June).

Thank you all for the amazingly swift and detailed responses! And @trebor79 you might be quite right that we don't need an alarm and are awake all the way from at least GLQ or Dalmuir anyway...
But for the eventuality that we don't wake up by ourselves, I'll probably set a first alarm for 6.20ish for a first pre-breakfast glimpse of the Clyde from the room, and then a second/backup alarm a bit later to get showered and into the lounge car for Loch Lomond at the latest. There'll be enough opportunities for a sleep in later in these holidays!
Thanks again

Just one word of warning having done the Fort William sleeper a month or so ago. On previous trips I could stroll down to the lounge car have breakfast and sit there comfortably admiring the scenery. In the new lounge cars if you're a solo traveller, they insist in you sitting on the horrible stools and won't let you sit in the normal seating. They were so uncomfortable and were hurting my back so much I had to finish my breakfast quickly and return to my cabin where at least I could sit on the bed but didn't have much of a view out of the window. Such a shame that what was once one of my favourite trips because of being able to admire the scenery is no longer possible just because I happen to be a solo traveller. You have been warned.

Lawrie

 

[Bald Rick]

Just one word of warning having done the Fort William sleeper a month or so ago. On previous trips I could stroll down to the lounge car have breakfast and sit there comfortably admiring the scenery. In the new lounge cars if you're a solo traveller, they insist in you sitting on the horrible stools and won't let you sit in the normal seating. They were so uncomfortable and were hurting my back so much I had to finish my breakfast quickly and return to my cabin where at least I could sit on the bed but didn't have much of a view out of the window. Such a shame that what was once one of my favourite trips because of being able to admire the scenery is no longer possible just because I happen to be a solo traveller. You have been warned.

Lawrie

Sorry to hear that. Other people may not have the back issues of course. I’ve done 2hour+ stints on those stools with no issue sat all.

 

[norbitonflyer]

Of course you'll only get a view of the Clyde from your room if it's on the left hand side of the train (which, because of the reversal at Waverley, is the right hand side at Euston) And vice versa for Loch Lomond. When our family took the sleeper to FW, the majority decided the view of Loch Lomond was NOT worth getting out of bed for, (as we were on the left) despite my attempts to rouse them.

 

[snowleopard]

So having set the alarm for 6.15am, I ended up not needing it as I woke up at ca. Dalmuir just before 6 anyway, which was perfect to get up in time for the Firth of Clyde. Our room was “facing the wrong way” but I got out into the (deserted, at that time) corridor and had a good view from there of the. We made it into the lounge car around 6.40, between Helensburgh and Garelochhead, and were almost the first people there. (After missing the ‘first dinner service’ the night before, having taken a bit long to settle in on arrival, we wanted to be sure to have a table. We had had dinner on the ‘stools’ around 10.15pm though and they were fine).

We were then able to stay at the table for two as long as we wanted and also got coffee refills (we kept checking with the hosts whether they needed the table for other people but they told us not to worry). So we kept sitting there with beautiful views until after Roy Bridge when we went to pack up. Absolutely worth the (slight) lack of sleep and wouldn’t have wanted to miss the morning scenery with blue skies and lots of sunshine. Thanks to all those who endorsed an early start!

 

[Bletchleyite]

Sorry to hear that. Other people may not have the back issues of course. I’ve done 2hour+ stints on those stools with no issue sat all.

Depending on the severity of the back issues, that could well be a request for reasonable adjustments for a disability.

 

[route101]

High stools and seats do look uncomfortable especially if you have short legs. The stools in the GWR lounge car look awful.

 

[trebor79]

The stools didn't give me a back problem, but I found them incredibly uncomfortable. The foot rest is in just the wrong position for me and a found my legs in what felt like a very unnatural and not at all restful position.
Really don't know why they don't allow people who are happy to share a table with strangers to share the table. It's a bit silly really when exactly that sort of set up is becoming more normal (eg Wagamama, loads of independent brasseries etc).

 

[alistairlees]

I’ve been able to share tables with strangers on the Caledonian Sleeper on numerous occasions this year, without any issue from either staff or the strangers (some passengers want to meet other people; some don’t - you just have to respect that). I’ve also had a table to myself for breakfast on the fort William portion this June even though it was reasonably busy (I expect lots of people were breakfasting in their rooms, though I don’t like that personally).

 

[Essexman]

Does anyone know why railcards (senior) are valid for one person in a cabin but not two, even if both have railcards?

 

[Caleb2010]

Provided you select 2 adults then 2 railcards it works, well it just has for me!!

 

[Essexman]

Provided you select 2 adults then 2 railcards it works, well it just has for me!!

I’ve found that this only works if you are booking separate cabins. If you book one cabin and two people it won’t allow use of railcard.

A friend contacted CS live chat this morning and was told that railcards only for solo which is what it appears to say on the CS website.

 

[trek]

Just one word of warning having done the Fort William sleeper a month or so ago. On previous trips I could stroll down to the lounge car have breakfast and sit there comfortably admiring the scenery. In the new lounge cars if you're a solo traveller, they insist in you sitting on the horrible stools and won't let you sit in the normal seating. They were so uncomfortable and were hurting my back so much I had to finish my breakfast quickly and return to my cabin where at least I could sit on the bed but didn't have much of a view out of the window. Such a shame that what was once one of my favourite trips because of being able to admire the scenery is no longer possible just because I happen to be a solo traveller. You have been warned.

Lawrie

Sorry to here that, when I did the Inverness one for dinner (well, a dessert and a drink) I was able to share one of the bench type seats at a table with a couple. It was full - even the stools were being used by couples. I did ask the attendant to check with the couple they were happy with me there, they were and we had a nice conversation so it's a shame they are being draconian, but I also understand if they think they need the larger tables for bigger groups of people why they'd want to save them.

I’ve found that this only works if you are booking separate cabins. If you book one cabin and two people it won’t allow use of railcard.

A friend contacted CS live chat this morning and was told that railcards only for solo which is what it appears to say on the CS website.

You can only use a railcard on solo or seated products, this has been the case ever since the new room system came in. The twins are considered already discounted and the only further discounts are disabled railcards and rail staff PRIV.

 

[JamieL]

A pleasure to use the sleeper service last night as a replacement for getting an Avanti train today. What a difference! Train ran on time and was actually early at both embarkation station and Euston. Comfortable, no risk of declassification and got a decent night's sleep as well.

 

[6Z09]

A pleasure to use the sleeper service last night as a replacement for getting an Avanti train today. What a difference! Train ran on time and was actually early at both embarkation station and Euston. Comfortable, no risk of declassification and got a decent night's sleep as well.

Good that you had a satisfactory experience. Which service was that on?

 

[JamieL]

Good that you had a satisfactory experience. Which service was that on?

Highlander - boarded at Helensburgh Upper.

The Lowlander was fully booked - I expect because of Avanti's poor performance of late!

 

[Wuffle]

We were on the Fort William service somewhere near Helensburgh (from RTT times - 6:36) and the smoke alarms went off in our carriage, hosts explained that it happened before on that carriage and it was due to dust from the ballast getting into the alarms
Anybody else had that ?
For breakfast we were seated with another couple who were asked if it was OK and spent some time chatting, we did see them a bit in Fort William and they were going up to Inverness by way of the Caledonian Canal and returning to London by sleeper again

 

[6Z09]

We were on the Fort William service somewhere near Helensburgh (from RTT times - 6:36) and the smoke alarms went off in our carriage, hosts explained that it happened before on that carriage and it was due to dust from the ballast getting into the alarms
Anybody else had that ?
For breakfast we were seated with another couple who were asked if it was OK and spent some time chatting, we did see them a bit in Fort William and they were going up to Inverness by way of the Caledonian Canal and returning to London by sleeper again

The Fire alarm issue is nothing new, has been activated by sawdust from limeside trees being cut down in the past, ( between Carluke and Motherwell if my memory serves me correctly ) freshly dropped ballast would have the same effect.

 

[Wuffle]

The Fire alarm issue is nothing new, has been activated by sawdust from limeside trees being cut down in the past, ( between Carluke and Motherwell if my memory serves me correctly ) freshly dropped ballast would have the same effect.

Thanks for the reply - the staff said that it had only affected the one coach which tallied with what other passengers said so I wonder if that carriage is more susceptible ?

 

[Caleb2010]

With the old stock the fire alarm in the carriage behind the loco leaving Inverness used to go off when the smoke from the engine exhaust used to enter via any hole it found once power was appliEd after it had been idling for an hour or so before departure! So no, nothing new!

 

[Iskra]

Had a really nice trip on the sleeper from Fort William to London Euston last night. We were in a club twin room and it was comfortable enough- just a modernised version of the MK3 berths with a mini-bathroom attached. We were in the middle of the carriage so the ride was comfortable enough. Lounge car and food was excellent in both the evening and morning. Staff were all great, but I get the impression they are fed up of apologising for service issues. Some customers who had booked Double rooms were downgraded and they really weren’t happy about it, and were being a bit entitled and rude about it. We were also told that there would be no cooked breakfast in the morning due to an issue with the Aberdeen lounge car, I was fine with this as the positive was it meant more time in bed and a bacon roll would be delivered to the room, but the already annoyed Double customers probably weren’t too impressed. This ended up not happening in the end and a normal service was provided and the Full Scottish was nice.

Ms Iskra (who has no interest in trains) was happy with it and says she’d do it again, so that’s good although we won’t be rushing back at the current prices. 3 winning loco’s was a good result too. As has been said here before the divergence between the glossy marketing and the reality seems to cause a lot of issues with the higher end customers. The train was busy and a driver I got talking to was saying that the service is the busiest it has ever been so that’s great to hear.

We got lucky this morning as just as we arrived into Euston all trains were cancelled due to emergency services dealing with an incident.

 

[Blindtraveler]

I have my first sleeper journey in almost 12 months at the end of next week. Despite the fact that I am seated and the ticket I've got requires me to bail out at Watford junction at some ungodly time on a Saturday morning, I'm really quite looking forward to it. With the exception of during covid, I have never gone this long between uses of the sleeper since I started using it back in about 2005. I'm glad from the point of view of the amount of subsidy hopefully won't need for much longer DA8 is the busiest it's ever been but still saddened that the the entire package is being marketed at tourists and that regular locals like myself are simply no longer de-as able as we wants were to use this very useful service. I'm I'm riding on and off-peak return from Edinburgh to Hampshire which will be broken multiple times in the northbound direction and the sleeper may be used northbound from Watford the following week if I can get a seat