Cardiff Central - terminating trains

[Jez]

One thing ive noticed after spending time at Cardiff Central a few times in recent months is the amount of terminating trains there are on platforms 0-4. Now Cardiff isnt the best place for terminating trains as they have to cross the main line and then be stabled in sidings until forming their return journey. However its understandable that many trains would need to terminate in Cardiff coming from England due to it being a Capital City and many people travelling there.

From December we have had the Manchester-West Wales service being split every 2 hours at Cardiff. This results in a terminator from Carmarthen, then the opposite hour a terminator from Manchester. Then a train from depot requited for Manchester every 2 hours and the opposite hour a train needed from depot to Milford Haven. Swanline will be hourly from December so that's another terminating train every hour.

Cheltenham Spa will also become hourly and no longer run through to Maesteg. However Ebbw Vale will be running through to Maesteg.

How are they going to cope with so many terminating trains. It can be chaos sometimes. Could we see more trains terminating in platforms and waiting to form the next journey to limit crossing the main line? Trains with shorter turnaround like Nottingham could be fine but the Portsmouth's have a turnaround of the best part of an hour. Not sure what the Swanline and Cheltenham turnaround will be at Cardiff Central.

Ita a pity Cardiff doesnt have a few bay platforms which many large stations like Crewe for example use for terminating trains.

 

[GWVillager]

One thing ive noticed after spending time at Cardiff Central a few times in recent months is the amount of terminating trains there are on platforms 0-4. Now Cardiff isnt the best place for terminating trains as they have to cross the main line and then be stabled in sidings until forming their return journey. However its understandable that many trains would need to terminate in Cardiff coming from England due to it being a Capital City and many people travelling there.

From December we have had the Manchester-West Wales service being split every 2 hours at Cardiff. This results in a terminator from Carmarthen, then the opposite hour a terminator from Manchester. Then a train from depot requited for Manchester every 2 hours and the opposite hour a train needed from depot to Milford Haven. Swanline will be hourly from December so that's another terminating train every hour.

Cheltenham Spa will also become hourly and no longer run through to Maesteg. However Ebbw Vale will be running through to Maesteg.

How are they going to cope with so many terminating trains. It can be chaos sometimes. Could we see more trains terminating in platforms and waiting to form the next journey to limit crossing the main line? Trains with shorter turnaround like Nottingham could be fine but the Portsmouth's have a turnaround of the best part of an hour. Not sure what the Swanline and Cheltenham turnaround will be at Cardiff Central.

Ita a pity Cardiff doesnt have a few bay platforms which many large stations like Crewe for example use for terminating trains.

I believe the Manchester to Cardiff trains will continue on to Swansea before long, which should alleviate the problem somewhat. Still, it’s a lot of terminating trains that I’d never really thought about.

 

[TrainAndBike]

The now no longer existing Platform 5 used to be a bay Platform at the West end of platform 4.

 

[Jez]

I believe the Manchester to Cardiff trains will continue on to Swansea before long, which should alleviate the problem somewhat. Still, it’s a lot of terminating trains that I’d never really thought about.

I thought the plan to continue to Swansea has been abandoned due to not having enough MK4 sets ? Unless they use a MK4 every 3 hours instead of every 2.

Assuming the Nottingham and Cheltenhams continue to be roughly.half an hour apart would it be possible to use platform 0 to terminate both without them having to turnaround.

 

[Envoy]

Why don’t they just combine the Swanline (Swansea to Cardiff all stops) with the Cardiff to Cheltenham all stops? Alternatively, send the Cheltenham's down the Vale Coast Line which would have the advantage of taking people from Cheltenham & Gloucester direct to Barry as well as Rhoose for Cardiff Airport via the short bus link? Having a direct train service might induce people from Cheltenham & Gloucester to use Cardiff Airport and would also be handy for others - such as Newportonians.

The other service on the Vale Coast Line would be that to the Rhymney Valley.

 

[craigybagel]

I believe the Manchester to Cardiff trains will continue on to Swansea before long, which should alleviate the problem somewhat. Still, it’s a lot of terminating trains that I’d never really thought about.

I thought the plan to continue to Swansea has been abandoned due to not having enough MK4 sets ? Unless they use a MK4 every 3 hours instead of every 2.

Original plan was 1 MKIV set to Swansea every 3 hours. Current, much more sensible plan is 1 a day to Swansea, leaving there in the morning and returning at night. Otherwise 3 out of the 4 services coming down the Marches every 2 hours (Holyhead, Liverpool and the MkIV operated Manchester services) will all terminate in Cardiff, with just the 197 operated Manchester services running to West Wales.

That's not to say there won't be some interworking with other routes though, rather than lots of shunts. We won't know till we see the final timetable.

 

[Jez]

Why don’t they just combine the Swanline (Swansea to Cardiff all stops) with the Cardiff to Cheltenham all stops? Alternatively, send the Cheltenham's down the Vale Coast Line which would have the advantage of taking people from Cheltenham & Gloucester direct to Barry as well as Rhoose for Cardiff Airport via the short bus link? Having a direct train service might induce people from Cheltenham & Gloucester to use Cardiff Airport and would also be handy for others - such as Newportonians.

The other service on the Vale Coast Line would be that to the Rhymney Valley.

Good idea. Its something I thought before could work with Swanline continuing beyond Cardiff to another destination to avoid terminating.

The only problem is the timetable would have to be robust enough not to have massive delays that would impact the performance of the faster trains on the route. The other thing is that Swanline is going to be 197s and Cheltenham 231s (eventually) but it could work if both are 197s until the 231s can be taken off the Rhymney line.

Original plan was 1 MKIV set to Swansea every 3 hours. Current, much more sensible plan is 1 a day to Swansea, leaving there in the morning and returning at night. Otherwise 3 out of the 4 services coming down the Marches every 2 hours (Holyhead, Liverpool and the MkIV operated Manchester services) will all terminate in Cardiff, with just the 197 operated Manchester services running to West Wales.

That's not to say there won't be some interworking with other routes though, rather than lots of shunts. We won't know till we see the final timetable.

Yes its possible we could see some West Wales services going to Liverpool or Holyhead rather than terminate in Cardiff Central