Castle Cary: usage down, interchange up (dramatically)

[70014IronDuke]

Just looking at the usage data for Castle Cary station here

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castle_Cary_railway_station

And in 2015-16, passenger usage was slightly down ( - 4,000) to 0.241m.

Perhaps a slight surprise, since there has been a somewhat improved service due to the daily SWT trains running to and from Yeovil Jcn and Waterloo. But perhaps the Glastonbury Festival was away at a new site or some other cause?

Anyway, in contrast, the interchange figure has gone up 2.4 times, from 28,000 to 68,000.

That's about 190 folks per day changing trains at what is a Somerset village junction.

It begs the questions: if accurate, why the sudden jump? And who are these interchangers - from where to where?

In theory, it could be the likes of Newbury/Reading passengers going to Weymouth or Yeovil, or, possibly, Exeter pax heading to Bruton or Frome (surely can't be many of those?)

Not sure if Weymouth to Exeter/Plymouth is valid this way (as opposed to the cumbersome trek from Pen Mill to Yeovil Jcn) - but whatever, in practice, for large parts of the day, the Paddington-West of England service is very sparse, ditto the Bristol - Castle Cary - Yeovil - Weymouth service. Most of the time, the trains do not connect.

So who are these 68,000 interchangers - a number that is 28% of the regular rail usage figures? (And is that some kind of record?)

 

[All Line Rover]

who are these 68,000 interchangers - a number that is 28% of the regular rail usage figures? (And is that some kind of record?)

No. Crewe has 2.8m entries/exits and 1.4m interchangers - 33% of passengers. I'm sure there are stations with an even greater proportion of interchangers.

 

[AlterEgo]

Dovey Junction must be worth a shout!

 

[Busaholic]

St Erth might be a contender too.

 

[father_jack]

Just looking at the usage data for Castle Cary station here

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castle_Cary_railway_station

And in 2015-16, passenger usage was slightly down ( - 4,000) to 0.241m.

Perhaps a slight surprise, since there has been a somewhat improved service due to the daily SWT trains running to and from Yeovil Jcn and Waterloo. But perhaps the Glastonbury Festival was away at a new site or some other cause?

Anyway, in contrast, the interchange figure has gone up 2.4 times, from 28,000 to 68,000.

That's about 190 folks per day changing trains at what is a Somerset village junction.

It begs the questions: if accurate, why the sudden jump? And who are these interchangers - from where to where?

In theory, it could be the likes of Newbury/Reading passengers going to Weymouth or Yeovil, or, possibly, Exeter pax heading to Bruton or Frome (surely can't be many of those?)

Not sure if Weymouth to Exeter/Plymouth is valid this way (as opposed to the cumbersome trek from Pen Mill to Yeovil Jcn) - but whatever, in practice, for large parts of the day, the Paddington-West of England service is very sparse, ditto the Bristol - Castle Cary - Yeovil - Weymouth service. Most of the time, the trains do not connect.

So who are these 68,000 interchangers - a number that is 28% of the regular rail usage figures? (And is that some kind of record?)

Better connections from Paddington to Weymouth trains and vice versa that might have changed at Westbury before ??? Aside, how could they quantify that figure............

 

[All Line Rover]

Dovey Junction must be worth a shout!

Yes, Dovey Junction has the most: more than twice as many interchangers as entries/exits.

Thorpe-le-Soken is a close second (almost twice as many interchangers) and is a considerably busier station than Dovey Junction.

The following 15 stations, with interchangers forming a decreasing proportion of entries/exits, are:

Ford (0.98)
Clapham Junction (0.94)
Barnham (0.87)
Smethwick Galton Bridge (0.80)
Ryde Pier Head (0.79)
Hackney Downs (0.76)
Gospel Oak (0.69)
Marks Tey (0.69)
Upwey (0.69)
St Erth (0.68)
Warrington Bank Quay (0.57)
Herne Hill (0.57)
Oxenholme Lake District (0.53)
Deepdene (0.51)
Crewe (0.48)

Castle Cary is around 50th position.

 

[HowardGWR]

Just looking at the usage data for Castle Cary station here

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castle_Cary_railway_station

And in 2015-16, passenger usage was slightly down ( - 4,000) to 0.241m.

Perhaps a slight surprise, since there has been a somewhat improved service due to the daily SWT trains running to and from Yeovil Jcn and Waterloo. But perhaps the Glastonbury Festival was away at a new site or some other cause?

Anyway, in contrast, the interchange figure has gone up 2.4 times, from 28,000 to 68,000.

That's about 190 folks per day changing trains at what is a Somerset village junction.

It begs the questions: if accurate, why the sudden jump? And who are these interchangers - from where to where?

In theory, it could be the likes of Newbury/Reading passengers going to Weymouth or Yeovil, or, possibly, Exeter pax heading to Bruton or Frome (surely can't be many of those?)

Not sure if Weymouth to Exeter/Plymouth is valid this way (as opposed to the cumbersome trek from Pen Mill to Yeovil Jcn) - but whatever, in practice, for large parts of the day, the Paddington-West of England service is very sparse, ditto the Bristol - Castle Cary - Yeovil - Weymouth service. Most of the time, the trains do not connect.

So who are these 68,000 interchangers - a number that is 28% of the regular rail usage figures? (And is that some kind of record?)

I've reported this before, but, when carrying out pax surveys on the Dorchester to Weymouth line, we discovered many pax being booked from Bournemouth through to, say, Plymouth, via Upwey (!!!!). The reason was evidently that to change at Dorchester would mean a long walk to West from South, whereas at Upwey, just a crossing by footbridge was needed.

This was some time ago, but self-evidently, the ticket via Castle Cary was a valid routing.

There is no direct rail route between the South West's second largest city (Bournemouth) and its third (Plymouth).

 

[Busaholic]

There is no direct rail route between the South West's second largest city (Bournemouth) and its third (Plymouth).

The most direct road route I find very unpleasant too - I'm an experienced driver and (mostly) enjoy it but I've never had a good journey between those two places.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Yes, Dovey Junction has the most: more than twice as many interchangers as entries/exits.

Thorpe-le-Soken is a close second (almost twice as many interchangers) and is a considerably busier station than Dovey Junction.

Smallbrook Junction reports 6,067 entries and exits but as there is no access other than by train and it is used only as an interchange between Island Line and the Isle of Wight Stream Railway, surely this is in fact a figure of 100% interchange?

 

[HowardGWR]

The most direct road route I find very unpleasant too - I'm an experienced driver and (mostly) enjoy it but I've never had a good journey between those two places.

You won't, if I have anything to do with it (sorry )*. Environmental groups have successfully resisted some bypasses in Dorset and East Devon, following the 90s splurge, east of Dorchester. The roads west lead mainly through two AsONB, shortly to become a National Park, we hope, along with the Blackdowns AONB.

This is why completing the chord from the Weymouth line to the LSWR line at Yeovil Junction could be a very significant factor in keeping those areas as relatively peaceful countryside.

*Actually, for those not in a hurry, the result of directing heavy goods traffic north could make for a very pleasant trip for the tourist.

 

[All Line Rover]

Smallbrook Junction reports 6,067 entries and exits but as there is no access other than by train and it is used only as an interchange between Island Line and the Isle of Wight Stream Railway, surely this is in fact a figure of 100% interchange?

I think that's a niche example.

Heathrow T123 might have more interchangers than entries/exits, but as usage figures for Heathrow aren't reported by the ORR, it's not possible to say.

 

[randyrippley]

Just looking at the usage data for Castle Cary station here

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castle_Cary_railway_station


Anyway, in contrast, the interchange figure has gone up 2.4 times, from 28,000 to 68,000.

That's about 190 folks per day changing trains at what is a Somerset village junction.

It begs the questions: if accurate, why the sudden jump? And who are these interchangers - from where to where?

I would guess at Yeovil - London passengers who prefer not to drive to the Junction. I don't know how good the connections are now, but it used to be possible to get to Paddington quicker via Castle Cary or Westbury than direct to Waterloo. How do the relative timings now compare? Or of Dorchester West to Paddington vs Dorchester East to Waterloo? I'd guess that the Paddington route is actually shorter and has fewer overall stops - and of course has 125mph HSTs for part of the route

 

[Wilts Wanderer]

Mention of an arduous trek between the Yeovil stations makes me want to point something useful out. There is a shuttle bus service, the 68 operated by South West Coaches, providing a half-hourly inter-station link via the Bus Station for most of the day.

 

[70014IronDuke]

Mention of an arduous trek between the Yeovil stations makes me want to point something useful out. There is a shuttle bus service, the 68 operated by South West Coaches, providing a half-hourly inter-station link via the Bus Station for most of the day.

Point it out by all means. I accept that it's fine for many people on this forum who are 'up for it' - I've caught the bus myself - but for many 'normals', that's a couple of extra changes of transport and uncertainties too far. Especially if they have come from east of Weymouth, and have already had to fathom the intricacies of changing at Upwey. And, imagine if you are not a native Brit - where is the bus stop? Will the driver understand me? How far do I haul my luggage?

Yet another set of reasons for not travelling by train, or not travelling at all.

But even for regular, hardened rail travellers, the poor service on the Weymouth-Westbury line, coupled with concerns over reliability, make planning a trip from Bournemouth to Exeter something of a lottery at the best of times. (I know it's put me off doing it a year or two back.)

 

[70014IronDuke]

Yes, Dovey Junction has the most: more than twice as many interchangers as entries/exits.... .
...
Castle Cary is around 50th position.

I stand (thoroughly and utterly) corrected.

And due to my throw away comment at the end, I realise I've almost made this into a [trivia] thread, when my main point of interest was who are these passengers changing at Castle Cary, where have they come from and whither go they?

 

[70014IronDuke]

Better connections from Paddington to Weymouth trains and vice versa that might have changed at Westbury before ???

I don't think much has changed, TBH. The first morning train ex-Weymouth does connect with an up West of England - Paddington express quite well
.
IIRC, one can change into the 09.06 ex PDN at from Westbury at Castle Cary - there are odd connections like this. But that's the problem, they are odd - and not very robust, given the incidence of unreliablity, late running and lack of frequent trains on the Heart of Wessex.

... Aside, how could they quantify that figure............

Well, how can they do that at any 'interchange' station? I guess they add up eg all the Bournemouth/Poole etc tickets to Taunton, Plymouth etc, and assume a certain percentage go via Castle Cary, another lot via the Yeovils and maybe another lot via Basingstoke-Reading (if that's a valid route?)

 

[Western Lord]

There is no direct rail route between the South West's second largest city (Bournemouth) and its third (Plymouth).

Bournemouth is not a city!

 

[greatkingrat]

Smallbrook Junction reports 6,067 entries and exits but as there is no access other than by train and it is used only as an interchange between Island Line and the Isle of Wight Stream Railway, surely this is in fact a figure of 100% interchange?

I think it only counts as an interchange if you are changing from one NR service to another. For example Walthamstow Central has no interchanges shown, even though a large percentage of passengers will be changing onto the Victoria Line.

 

[All Line Rover]

I think we've adequately debunked the idea that Castle Cary has an unusually high proportion of interchangers. It would be best to try and focus on answering the OP's question of what interchanges those interchangers are nonetheless making.

 

[dgl]

The interchange I make at CLC is Weymouth - Taunton, not that frequently but the wait time is usually less than 30min

 

[edwin_m]

Are there split ticketing possibilities at Castle Cary, and would people splitting their tickets count as interchangers in these figures?

 

[HowardGWR]

Bournemouth is not a city!

Beg pardon. Will Unitary Authority do?

 

[greatkingrat]

Are there split ticketing possibilities at Castle Cary, and would people splitting their tickets count as interchangers in these figures?

I don't think so. If I buy a ticket from A to B and a ticket from B to C, the system has no way of knowing those tickets will be used for one journey, so it would be counted as two journeys.

This may artificially inflate the entry/exit figures for B, but wouldn't increase the interchange totals.

 

[Wilts Wanderer]

Point it out by all means. I accept that it's fine for many people on this forum who are 'up for it' - I've caught the bus myself - but for many 'normals', that's a couple of extra changes of transport and uncertainties too far. Especially if they have come from east of Weymouth, and have already had to fathom the intricacies of changing at Upwey. And, imagine if you are not a native Brit - where is the bus stop? Will the driver understand me? How far do I haul my luggage?

Yet another set of reasons for not travelling by train, or not travelling at all.

But even for regular, hardened rail travellers, the poor service on the Weymouth-Westbury line, coupled with concerns over reliability, make planning a trip from Bournemouth to Exeter something of a lottery at the best of times. (I know it's put me off doing it a year or two back.)

Just to clarify, the Yeovil shuttle bus appears in National Rail Enquiries journey planner. It runs from the station forecourt and may also be shown on the CIS summary screens, not sure.

 

[Hartington]

2015 was one of the years when there was no Glastonbury hence the loss of 4k passengers.

When I moved to Castle Cary about 10 years I expected the railway to be a bit boring. Just a parade of FGW trains on two routes and that was it. In many ways my expectations were met.

However, as time has passed I've come to realise that Castle Cary station is a bit of a hub. That's partly because of where it is - the next station west is Taunton and north is Bath so it draws in passengers from a wide range. In fact, for a while, it was sponsored by Kings School Bruton (but Bruton station wasn't) because that's how their boarding pupils arrive. We also seem to get pupils for Downside school (up near Radstock).

When you watch the passengers from an arriving train the majority head for the car park. There are 2 short term parking slots and they are never enough. Add to that a line of 4 maybe 5 taxis, a (small) bus trying to turn round and various people waiting in their cars to collect friends and family and you might get an idea of the chaos.

Once that's settled down there are almost always a couple of passengers, sometimes as many as a dozen(!), trying to work out which platform (out of 3?) their next train departs from. It doesn't seem to matter which train they arrive on they disperse in various directions; there's no obvious pattern. I've even seen people arrive off a train headed to Weymouth get on a train to London (in other words effectively going back where they came from).

When you think Castle Cary and Ansford (one a parish council and the other a town council but it's difficult to see where one ends and the other begins) have a population of about 4000 between them the use Castle Cary station see is impressive in my view.

 

[irish_rail]

I've reported this before, but, when carrying out pax surveys on the Dorchester to Weymouth line, we discovered many pax being booked from Bournemouth through to, say, Plymouth, via Upwey (!!!!). The reason was evidently that to change at Dorchester would mean a long walk to West from South, whereas at Upwey, just a crossing by footbridge was needed.

This was some time ago, but self-evidently, the ticket via Castle Cary was a valid routing.

There is no direct rail route between the South West's second largest city (Bournemouth) and its third (Plymouth).

Bournemouth larger than Plymouth???? Are you sure about that? Pretty sure Plymouth is in UKs top 20 largest cities, cant believe Bournemouth would be bigger.....

 

[70014IronDuke]

2015 was one of the years when there was no Glastonbury hence the loss of 4k passengers.

But was there a Glastonbury in 2014? Was 2015 the first year it was moved away?

... Once that's settled down there are almost always a couple of passengers, sometimes as many as a dozen(!), trying to work out which platform (out of 3?) their next train departs from. It doesn't seem to matter which train they arrive on they disperse in various directions; there's no obvious pattern. I've even seen people arrive off a train headed to Weymouth get on a train to London (in other words effectively going back where they came from).

I suppose there must be the odd passenger who arrives from the London direction on Inter-City trains and wants to return to Bruton or even Frome if such double backs are sanctioned? BUT, of course, trains to Weymouth will have already stopped at these stations - so that is indeed a mystery! Why not ask any such folk next time?

When you think Castle Cary and Ansford (one a parish council and the other a town council but it's difficult to see where one ends and the other begins) have a population of about 4000 between them the use Castle Cary station see is impressive in my view.

I do wonder if a not-insignificant percentage of the user figures are from, eg savvy folk travelling from Exeter who split tickets at Castle Cary to reduce the fares?

Thank you for this set of on-the-spot observations - most interesting.

 

[greatkingrat]

Glastonbury was held in 2014, 2015 and 2016 so that should not have any impact on passenger numbers. The last year off was 2012 and the next will be 2018.

 

[The Ham]

When you think Castle Cary and Ansford (one a parish council and the other a town council but it's difficult to see where one ends and the other begins) have a population of about 4000 between them the use Castle Cary station see is impressive in my view.

Hook (Hampshire) has a population of about double (circa 8,400) yet as its train station has over three times the number of passengers at circa 823,500.

As such more impressive, although both are above the national average for the size of their population (although both do serve areas beyond just their own populations).

 

[Cletus]

On a Castle Cary/Glastonbury theme

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-somerset-38369127

The 2019 Glastonbury Festival could be held at a site 100 miles away from Worthy Farm, "towards the Midlands" to help protect the main site.