Cheaper fares on HS1 coming from April: could this lead to more services?

[Doctor Pepper]

Apparently, the regulator has told HS1 to lower its charges for passenger and freight train operating companies from April 2025.

‘Savings for Kent passengers’ as high-speed line charges for operators to drop

Passengers in Kent will benefit from train companies being charged lower fees to operate between London St Pancras and the Channel Tunnel.

www.kentonline.co.uk

Passengers in Kent will benefit from train companies being charged lower fees to operate between London St Pancras and the Channel Tunnel, a regulator has said.

The Office of Rail and Road (ORR) announced the amount paid by operators to use the High Speed 1 (HS1) line for the next five years should be cut by 10.4% from April.

“We will examine how the decision to reduce the cost to operate on High Speed 1 could benefit customers, including the potential for additional services.”

SE seem to think it will enable them to run more services. Not sure how, as don't they have a very limited number of compatible units?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Apparently the regulator has told HS1 to lower its charges for passenger and freight train operating companies from April 2025.

SE seem to think it will enable them to run more services. Not sure how, as don't they have a very limited number of compatible units?

A lot of them are run as double sets, presumably they could run a more frequent service of single sets instead?

 

[Blindtraveler]

Whilst I'd be glad to see a few more services, I am primarily more interested in seeing the premium that is paid for high speed on our ticket. Prices reduced by a couple of quid.

 

[Wymondham]

Unfortunately this seems to be a case of the ORR mis-selling what has actually occured. Page 61 of the final determination states that the decrease in fixed charges is because of HS1's new policy which has 'reduced renewals expenditure over the 40 year period'. So it seems that the ORR is selling a cut back by HS1 in maintenance expenditure (which has been passed on to the operators in the form of reduced fixed charges), while increasing the prices train operators pay per kilometre as a good thing, which is quite debatable. While pages 62 and 63 of the final determination show that the changes per train kilometer are still increasing compared to CP3.

 

[Stephen42]

Unfortunately this seems to be a case of the ORR mis-selling what has actually occured. Page 61 of the final determination states that the decrease in fixed charges is because of HS1's new policy which has 'reduced renewals expenditure over the 40 year period'. So it seems that the ORR is selling a cut back by HS1 in maintenance expenditure (which has been passed on to the operators in the form of reduced fixed charges), while increasing the prices train operators pay per kilometre as a good thing, which is quite debatable. While pages 62 and 63 of the final determination show that the changes per train kilometer are still increasing compared to CP3.

The charges per train kilometer are increasing, the charges per train minute are decreasing. The chargeable time/km per service is such that it's an overall decrease.

Apparently, the regulator has told HS1 to lower its charges for passenger and freight train operating companies from April 2025.

‘Savings for Kent passengers’ as high-speed line charges for operators to drop

Passengers in Kent will benefit from train companies being charged lower fees to operate between London St Pancras and the Channel Tunnel.

www.kentonline.co.uk

SE seem to think it will enable them to run more services. Not sure how, as don't they have a very limited number of compatible units?

In terms of additional services, there's plenty of scope to run additional services that have been removed from the timetable. Medium to longer term they might procure additional units if there was sufficient demand. The biggest barrier is the charges, even with the reduction it's still multiples of the classic network and that makes the business case for additional services poorer. Going above the underpin number of paths gives additional cost on the investment recovery charge to the government so can't see them going much above that level.

 

[Bald Rick]

Thread title is incorrect - it is cheaper Track Access Charges (fees); unlikely to mean chepaer fares, certainly not for Southeastern.

 

[yorksrob]

If they were going to introduce new services, I'd rather they started with a Kent Coast express to Charing Cross.

 

[Belfastmarty]

The charges per train kilometer are increasing, the charges per train minute are decreasing. The chargeable time/km per service is such that it's an overall decrease.

Can you explain further, please ? Are trains charged both by kilometer and time ? If so what's the balance ?

 

[Stephen42]

Can you explain further, please ? Are trains charged both by kilometer and time ? If so what's the balance ?

Yes. Directly incurred costs are per kilometre and others look to be by time. From the final determination (all in Feb 2023 prices domestic services) for CP3 it was £2.07 per km and £56.32 per minute, where as the determination for CP4 is £2.36 per km and £54.24 per minute.

For an Ashford service in CP3 is £1,935 per train, CP4 £1,897 based on the distance/chargeable journey time figures in the framework agreement for Southeastern. That's around £33 per train mile, Network Rail variable charges by my back of an envelope calculations for a 12-car 395 is under £2 per train mile.

 

[Sad Sprinter]

If they were going to introduce new services, I'd rather they started with a Kent Coast express to Charing Cross.

Same here. I do enjoy the classic lines more so than HS1. Once you’ve done it once, you’ve done it.

 

[yorksrob]

Same here. I do enjoy the classic lines more so than HS1. Once you’ve done it once, you’ve done it.

Nothing beats a spirited non-stop run between Ashford and Tonbridge !

 

[Sad Sprinter]

Nothing beats a spirited non-stop run between Ashford and Tonbridge !

Sadly only got to do one in a Eurostar. But I was 5 years old and have no memory of it. (Apart from arriving at Ashford and thinking it must be a massive city if the Eurostar called there)

 

[yorksrob]

Sadly only got to do one in a Eurostar. But I was 5 years old and have no memory of it. (Apart from arriving at Ashford and thinking it must be a massive city if the Eurostar called there)

They did it a few years ago when HS1 was closed for engineering works. 23 mins !