Chiltern Oxford Link completed

[II]

It's something that will no doubt build up over time. For example, people who get a job in Oxford are now more likely to consider moving to High Wycombe now the commute by train is a very realistic option.

I have been slightly surprised by how few seem to have switched from GWR to Chiltern from Oxford's main station since the launch. The flagship 07:20 from Oxford to Marylebone only loads to about 50 people leaving Oxford in the morning, a few of which are probably only going as far as Bicester. It no doubt picks up a hefty load at Parkway, but I can't say I've noticed anything other than a very slight reduction in people boarding GWR Paddington bound trains at Oxford.

As expected the attraction of Bicester Village is proving popular for passengers travelling from Oxford and the south.

It's a bit early to tell what impact on performance figures the new service is having, though figures are below what they were this time last year - over 3.5% worse punctuality was recorded in the most recent month than the same one last year - and I'm sure the constrained infrastructure at Oxford is having some impact on that.

Overall, a promising start, though those predicting people would leave GWR in their droves have been proven wrong so far.

 

[leomartin125]

It's something that will no doubt build up over time. For example, people who get a job in Oxford are now more likely to consider moving to High Wycombe now the commute by train is a very realistic option.

I have been slightly surprised by how few seem to have switched from GWR to Chiltern from Oxford's main station since the launch. The flagship 07:20 from Oxford to Marylebone only loads to about 50 people leaving Oxford in the morning, a few of which are probably only going as far as Bicester. It no doubt picks up a hefty load at Parkway, but I can't say I've noticed anything other than a very slight reduction in people boarding GWR Paddington bound trains at Oxford.

As expected the attraction of Bicester Village is proving popular for passengers travelling from Oxford and the south.

It's a bit early to tell what impact on performance figures the new service is having, though figures are below what they were this time last year - over 3.5% worse punctuality was recorded in the most recent month than the same one last year - and I'm sure the constrained infrastructure at Oxford is having some impact on that.

Overall, a promising start, though those predicting people would leave GWR in their droves have been proven wrong so far.

Working at Oxford Station I can say the same, I've been working the late shift a lot and have frequently seen the 1925 arrival from Marylebone be almost empty at Oxford station, the 1943 departure to Reading is generally busier and that's CrossCountry! When there is disruption on GWR services, people tend to use Chiltern as a good alternative, but I honestly cannot see it becoming a replacement for the GWR Paddington link anytime soon.

 

[67018]

Working at Oxford Station I can say the same, I've been working the late shift a lot and have frequently seen the 1925 arrival from Marylebone be almost empty at Oxford station, the 1943 departure to Reading is generally busier and that's CrossCountry! When there is disruption on GWR services, people tend to use Chiltern as a good alternative, but I honestly cannot see it becoming a replacement for the GWR Paddington link anytime soon.

I wonder if Oxford commuters are being put off by the prospect of having to stand for part of the journey home. When I've used it that 1925 Oxford arival (1818 from Marylebone) it's been packed, but more than half the people get off at the first stop, Haddenham & Thame Parkway and most of the rest at Bicester Village.

The service seems to be very well used at weekends, not just with Bicester Village shoppers but also for locals going into Oxford.

 

[STEVIEBOY1]

I wonder if Oxford commuters are being put off by the prospect of having to stand for part of the journey home. When I've used it that 1925 Oxford arival (1818 from Marylebone) it's been packed, but more than half the people get off at the first stop, Haddenham & Thame Parkway and most of the rest at Bicester Village.

The service seems to be very well used at weekends, not just with Bicester Village shoppers but also for locals going into Oxford.

How many carriages are on that train you mention above on weekdays?

 

[t_star2001uk]

18.18 MYB - OXF is a loco hauled set. So 6 coaches..

 

[II]

That's not helped by none of the trains from Marylebone having peak time restrictions, so whilst from Paddington you have a pretty restricted list of semi-fast trains you can use returning from a day in London on a Travelcard, from Marylebone you can use anything.

 

[70014IronDuke]

Very interesting comments on the current usage. Thanks to all who have contributed. One imagines that over time, Oxford commuters needing to go to the Marylebone area will build up.

 

[HowardGWR]

In connection with the above discussion, is not the Old Oak Common connection still of use? I suppose this has been suggested before, but could not at least a peak hour service leave from Paddington, after Crossrail starts, that would take the northern line at OOC to join the GC at South Ruislip. I presume Chiltern have 'running rights' over it, as with the Parliamentary service?

Paddington change to Crossrail would be a site better connection for City and Wharf workers. wouldn't it? Chiltern could thus compete with GWR and the coaches.

 

[glbotu]

In connection with the above discussion, is not the Old Oak Common connection still of use? I suppose this has been suggested before, but could not at least a peak hour service leave from Paddington, after Crossrail starts, that would take the northern line at OOC to join the GC at South Ruislip. I presume Chiltern have 'running rights' over it, as with the Parliamentary service?

Paddington change to Crossrail would be a site better connection for City and Wharf workers. wouldn't it? Chiltern could thus compete with GWR and the coaches.

Yes, but the NNML will be effectively an HS2 access route until 2026, so there's no point in Chiltern building up traffic down there until then, because it'll just have to get closed again. I believe there's a "Marylebone relief plan" after 2026 to send some trains to terminate at OOC for Crossrail, but which trains and how many, who knows.

 

[Andyjs247]

Bicester Village station and Oxford Parkway are certainly well used - the car park at Bicester is full up in the mornings now though I don't know what proportion are headed to Oxford rather than London.

It's something that will no doubt build up over time. For example, people who get a job in Oxford are now more likely to consider moving to High Wycombe now the commute by train is a very realistic option.

However, I do think that Chiltern are potentially missing a trick with regards to commuting between High Wycombe and Oxford. IMO there is an imbalance in the service between Bicester Village and Marylebone. 13 services are non stop going Up but only 2 down. So coming from High Wycombe it means there's a better service to Oxford than there is returning. In the morning 4 trains will get you into Oxford before 0900.

Whereas all trains stop at Oxford Parkway and Bicester Village in both directions, heading to London, High Wycombe is only served hourly. Even in the evening peak. So there are trains at 1723, 1823 and 1920 from Oxford to High Wycombe but nothing in between. There is also a 1737 and 1803 which are fast to Marylebone. I was surprised that neither manage to stop at Haddenham, Prince Risborough or High Wycombe yet both stop at Islip.

Off peak the down Oxford services generally alternate between first stop High Wycombe or first stop Haddenham. From Wycombe you also have an easy change at Haddenham into the Oxford services. But still only the hourly direct service up (which also calls Haddenham). Perhaps the service will get some tweaking, especially in the peaks.

 

[Andyjs247]

The North Oxford NIMBYs suffered a setback in March as Oxford City Council had agreed to withdraw planning conditions, including the installation of Silent Track despite previously pledging to fight Network Rail, according to the Oxford Mail.

The residents, who are still not happy, must now fund any further action themselves. They had apparently raised £10,000 towards the estimated £30,000 cost of a judicial review in the space of 48hrs. Campaign organiser Patricia Grylls, accused the Council of caving in, in a rather hopeless manner.

"We have been dismayed over the past few years at how the conditions - to protect us from noise and vibration - have been chipped down and whittled away to be meaningless.

She added: "I know the council had its hands tied but it did have some powers to stop Network Rail and it hasn't done enough.

"We will be taking this to Whitehall and central Government – we need to show them that sleepless nights and loss of open space are not of no consequence."

The campaign will also petition the Secretary for State to review its noise and vibration mitigation policy, which, it says, is based on 'out-of-date' predicted levels of future train traffic through Oxford.

It comes after the city council's planning review committee accepted advice from its own lawyers and Queen's Counsel that there was 'no legal basis' to impose conditions on train numbers and the installation of Silent Track.

Planning officers also warned it would be a costly appeal process. The move overturned a decision made by the west area planning committee, which required the firm to use rail damping. Wolvercote resident and former city councillor Mike Gotch said residents felt 'let down' by the council's actions. He said: "The city council have managed to take away all the conditions, approved by government ministers, including train numbers and Silent Track.
"Residents are up in arms about this and feel very much let down by the council, whose job it is to look after the interests of residents - they have let Network Rail ride roughshod through the area.

"The residents are now having to take on the fight and we feel strongly that further action should be taken - a positive outcome could protect communities nationwide in the future, especially with HS2 looming large'.

The £10,000 will pay for legal advice from a experienced barrister specialising in railway and planning matters.

If the legal advice finds the residents have a strong case then a further £20,000 will be needed by the end of April.

Oxford City Council's board member for planning Alex Hollingsworth said its decision was taken following legal advice from a Queen's Counsel barrister.

He said: "As the local planning authority the Council’s task is to make balanced judgements based on the law and evidence.

"Our powers and duties in this case are limited to those set out in the deemed planning permission given by the Secretary of State for Transport in October 2012.

He added: "Legal advice was obtained from the Council’s own lawyers and Queen’s Counsel.

"It showed that the planning permission for East West Rail Phase 1, granted by the Secretary of State for Transport, could not be used to force Network Rail to use ”Silent Track” or other rail damping measures, nor to limit the number of trains using the new railway." Spokesman for Network Rail, Jon Crampton, said: "Having established rail dampening would not represent value for taxpayers’ money, we believe this is the right decision."

Full report here.

I am glad that the city council has at last seen sense. The NIMBYs appear to be increasingly clutching at straws - what on earth is "loss of open space" all about?

 

[jimm]

However, I do think that Chiltern are potentially missing a trick with regards to commuting between High Wycombe and Oxford. IMO there is an imbalance in the service between Bicester Village and Marylebone. 13 services are non stop going Up but only 2 down. So coming from High Wycombe it means there's a better service to Oxford than there is returning. In the morning 4 trains will get you into Oxford before 0900.

Whereas all trains stop at Oxford Parkway and Bicester Village in both directions, heading to London, High Wycombe is only served hourly. Even in the evening peak. So there are trains at 1723, 1823 and 1920 from Oxford to High Wycombe but nothing in between. There is also a 1737 and 1803 which are fast to Marylebone. I was surprised that neither manage to stop at Haddenham, Prince Risborough or High Wycombe yet both stop at Islip.

Off peak the down Oxford services generally alternate between first stop High Wycombe or first stop Haddenham. From Wycombe you also have an easy change at Haddenham into the Oxford services. But still only the hourly direct service up (which also calls Haddenham). Perhaps the service will get some tweaking, especially in the peaks.

I think you're a bit unfair to Chiltern here. The initial Oxford route timetable was always going to be built around the easier-to-predict demand between Oxford, Bicester and London, with busy GW trains and M40 coaches galore already operating providing plenty of evidence about demand around Oxford.

High Wycombe station is a bit like Oxford station, in that it isn't brilliantly located for a lot of the community it is meant to serve - from the south you have to cross the town centre to reach the station, whereas the M40 is close to/easily accessible from the southern part of the town. And in Oxford, if you don't work in the city centre, which a lot don't, then using a car all the way is going to remain a logical proposition to many people - you can probably say the same about people from the Thame/Haddenham area who travel into Oxford.

If Chiltern spot signs of a worthwhile flow developing, then I'm sure they will make timetable adjustment to encourage that, but it won't be at the expense of those Islip stops you mention - there Chiltern had plenty of evidence of demand from the previous branch service. The late afternoon/early evening services were always well used by people on their way home to Islip from Oxford before the Bicester Town service ended for the rebuilding of the line to Bicester.

 

[NickBucks]

I think you're a bit unfair to Chiltern here. The initial Oxford route timetable was always going to be built around the easier-to-predict demand between Oxford, Bicester and London, with busy GW trains and M40 coaches galore already operating providing plenty of evidence about demand around Oxford.

High Wycombe station is a bit like Oxford station, in that it isn't brilliantly located for a lot of the community it is meant to serve - from the south you have to cross the town centre to reach the station, whereas the M40 is close to/easily accessible from the southern part of the town. And in Oxford, if you don't work in the city centre, which a lot don't, then using a car all the way is going to remain a logical proposition to many people - you can probably say the same about people from the Thame/Haddenham area who travel into Oxford.

If Chiltern spot signs of a worthwhile flow developing, then I'm sure they will make timetable adjustment to encourage that, but it won't be at the expense of those Islip stops you mention - there Chiltern had plenty of evidence of demand from the previous branch service. The late afternoon/early evening services were always well used by people on their way home to Islip from Oxford before the Bicester Town service ended for the rebuilding of the line to Bicester.

Quite agree Jimm. In addition to your comments HW station car park is frequently full. I would like to see Oxford services stopping at Princes Risborough and Haddenham & Thame alternately. PR has an under used car park and would also serve Aylesbury passengers driving there as the rail service from Aylesbury to PR is slow and at present does not connect with most Oxford services. ( Pending EW far in the future of course)