Class 180: Is it possible to convert them into bi mode?

[Prestige15]

The 180 is my one of my all time favorite due to is sleek looks and the sound it makes, shame that is as reliable as a Rover 45 mainly because of the 3 speed hydraulic transmission system for high speed use.

I always had a thought that if theres be a possibility on converting them into bi modes?

Could it be possible if one engine and gearbox compleatly removed from the middle coach and convert it into a transformer with a pantograph while the engines for the other 4 re powered (perhaps using the engines from the redundant 769's) and have it as a single speed manner like the 22X and 8XX does but limited to 100-110mph?

I know the costs will start popping up and say hello and the fact is a modern unit so probably more complex but could it be done?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Because they are a traditional DMU with hydraulic transmission, this would be incredibly costly because you'd basically need to replace all the traction kit. This would of course have the advantage that they might catch fire a bit less often then, but in reality new build would be easier and probably cheaper, particularly as I seem to recall they are quite bad for corrosion so the bodyshells aren't worth much either (unlike say the ally bodyshells of the D stock).

 

[AndrewE]

There is also the point that, if you are interested in energy efficiency, adapting something built for another purpose is a poor choice.
Cars designed as Battery Electric Vehicles perform far better than those which have had a battery spliced in to an older ICE design.

 

[TheWalrus]

Very unlikely to happen to be honest in my opinion. They are my favourite DMU but unfortunately I feel they are most likely to be stored then scrapped following withdrawal from GC if no ine else snaps them up, which I think is unlikely due to unreliability, corrosion and lack of demand for 125mph DMUs. As much as I would love to see them live on! I hope one gets preserved somehow.

 

[skyhigh]

It would cost absolute mega-bucks to cut a hole for a pantograph well and maintain structural integrity of the body shell. Add in that they're in poor shape anyway (a vehicle recently spent months out of use due to corrosion repairs) and that you'd have to rip out and replace all the mechanicals it's a complete and utter nonstarter.

You'd also have the issue of either trying to adapt the TMS to manage the new systems or provide a new TMS that interfaces with the stuff you wouldn't want to replace (such as doors and toilets).

Given the small fleet size any design work costs would only be spread across the number that exist - i.e. if it cost £2 million to design and test the modifications before production you'd be looking at a per unit cost of £145k before you'd even started work on one. If it was a new design you were hoping to sell 100 of, say, the design cost per unit would be much lower.

Basically by the time you sorted out the corrosion and replaced pretty much everything below the floor you'd end up with a small fleet of units that are completely non standard with anything else, retain hardly anything that was originally 180 but at the same time cost twice as much as a new build.

 

[Prestige15]

Right, so it seemed that the class 180 is pretty much dead at its tracks (scrap very much likely) which is a shame really.

What if it can gave is 3 speed transmission and replace with a single drive or is that also not possible?

 

[Nick Ashwell]

Right, so it seemed that the class 180 is pretty much dead at its tracks (scrap very much likely) which is a shame really.

What if it can gave is 3 speed transmission and replace with a single drive or is that also not possible?

It's possible but not viable. Converting such a small fleet to anything other than Gillette and cans is financially unviable

 

[RobShipway]

Right, so it seemed that the class 180 is pretty much dead at its tracks (scrap very much likely) which is a shame really.

What if it can gave is 3 speed transmission and replace with a single drive or is that also not possible?

It's possible but not viable. Converting such a small fleet to anything other than Gillette and cans is financially unviable

You also have the issue if after only 20 years plus service the frame chassis and bodywork have rusting issues, then how long is the frame chassis plus bodywork going to survive if used in another 20 - 30 years?

 

[Snow1964]

As others have said, modifications are technically possible, but make no economic sense. They were built about 22 years ago, parts are corroded so remaining lifespan of remaining parts of them are high risk. No point in spending big money on train that might not survive more than few years.

Of course prior to scrapping, there might be value in removing parts like Cummins engines, to provide spares for other fleets. The seats are better than fitted to some other fleets so in perfect world someone would take those and reuse them.

From memory some parts might be common with class 175 (both were based on Coradia 1000 design), so not sure if parts can be used to keep 175s going, not that they currently have much future either.

 

[gingertom]

could they be dragged/propelled by a class 91?

 

[D365]

could they be dragged/propelled by a class 91?

Uh oh…

 

[NSE]

As lovely as it would be, they like to set themselves on fire already. Can you imagine if they had diesel fuel, access to the overhead wires and a brand new TMS with teething issues. They’d melt the entire ECML.