Class 376 refurbishment in 2023 - no air con or toilets to be added

[Milo T.K]

Any updates yet?

 

[WarrenTManager]

Installing a/c on trains that have been running for almost 20 years might not be as simple as fitting from new, even if other members of the family of trains (Electrostar) have been supplied with it from new. It would probably involve wholesale replacement of seals and changes to the wiring - in some cases stripping back to bare body shells. Given the heavy use of the stock, there is probably a maximum of 10- 15 years service life left in them so insisting on what could be a potentially complicated refit might delay or even remove the prospects for a refurbishment.

I agree. I'm often bemused by posts that think something is easy to do but it isn't, but then see posters lose their minds when something is actually tried and there are difficulties.

 

[ScotGG]

True though they'll be around for much longer than 10 years I'd wager. 20 is more likely.

Maybe even 25 given they're about 16-17 years old and 40 isn't unusual for EMUs.

 

[Milo T.K]

when was the planned start date for the refurbishment?

 

[Class37Colas]

when was the planned start date for the refurbishment?

There is no planned start but there are some refurbishment drags listed on Realtimetrains. 1 refurbishment drag on the 1st and 2 on the 8th.

 

[SuperLuke2334]

There is no planned start but there are some refurbishment drags listed on Realtimetrains. 1 refurbishment drag on the 1st and 2 on the 8th.

Do 376s actually go to Ramsgate at all? If not then I see no reason why these would be 376s.

 

[Class37Colas]

Do 376s actually go to Ramsgate at all? If not then I see no reason why these would be 376s.

A friend of mine who works at SE said that they were 376s. Also if the service from Slade Green depot to Ramsgate depot(service formed of 376s)is cancelled the chances are that the drag won’t happen.

 

[43066]

Do 376s actually go to Ramsgate at all? If not then I see no reason why these would be 376s.

For maintenance they do, because there’s no room at Sludge Green.

Gillingham drivers do the movements via the North Kent and the Chatham mainline.

 

[SuperLuke2334]

A friend of mine who works at SE said that they were 376s. Also if the service from Slade Green depot to Ramsgate depot(service formed of 376s)is cancelled the chances are that the drag won’t happen.

For maintenance they do, because there’s no room at Sludge Green.

Gillingham drivers do the movements via the North Kent and the Chatham mainline.

Thanks both .

 

[NSEWonderer]

I seem to remember an article referencing that the 376s had reservations made for incase they would end up being fitted with Pantographs. Considering they made reservations for this then wouldn't it be just to say they at some point also made reservations for a potential A/C upgrade.

 

[jackot]

I seem to remember an article referencing that the 376s had reservations made for incase they would end up being fitted with Pantographs. Considering they made reservations for this then wouldn't it be just to say they at some point also made reservations for a potential A/C upgrade.

As they are standard Electrostar body shells it should be relatively simple to swap out their current air ventilation units for air conditioning just like any other Electrostar, as they both occupy the same space and use the same ducts. I put a photo (see post #5 for it) which shows this, but it was suggested sorting seals and wiring may cause the bigger issues.

 

[NSEWonderer]

As they are standard Electrostar body shells it should be relatively simple to swap out their current air ventilation units for air conditioning just like any other Electrostar, as they both occupy the same space and use the same ducts. I put a photo (see post #5 for it) which shows this, but it was suggested sorting seals and wiring may cause the bigger issues.

Maybe I'm giving too much into it but I'd assume if they made allowance for AC conversion if needed then the wiring would have been in a pseudo modular way to allow that or at least cost wise possible without major rewiring. But then again these are indeed 20 years old.

Considering how old the 357s are and with Aircon I'd not be surprised the only thing holding the 376s back from such treatment is the same thing with most on the railway... Cost.

 

[PGAT]

Why would pantographs be necessary on the 376? To run on HS1 in an emergency maybe?

 

[NSEWonderer]

Why would pantographs be necessary on the 376? To run on HS1 in an emergency maybe?

I assume incase it ever became at the time feasible to move the trains to another toc that required the AC conversion. Ofc none now I doubt would want such a unit

 

[Lewlew]

After a certain date (that escapes me), all new build third rail trains were required to have a pantograph well and passive provision for conversion to AC. All the 444s and 450s have a well too.

 

[jackot]

Maybe I'm giving too much into it but I'd assume if they made allowance for AC conversion if needed then the wiring would have been in a pseudo modular way to allow that or at least cost wise possible without major rewiring. But then again these are indeed 20 years old.

Yes, as I said they currently have a pressure ventilation system wired in; nothing to say that isn't using the same wiring system as the other Electrostars, and thus it would be capable of running aircon without many changes in that aspect. It was just something someone suggested earlier than may add complexity, but true or not I don't know. There is no doubt it could be done, whether they choose to incur the cost to do it is another thing.

 

[43066]

I seem to remember an article referencing that the 376s had reservations made for incase they would end up being fitted with Pantographs. Considering they made reservations for this then wouldn't it be just to say they at some point also made reservations for a potential A/C upgrade.

Electrostar body shells have pantograph wells as standard. IIRC of the the SE Electrostar fleet only the 375/6s and ex GTR 377s have pantographs actually fitted.

 

[Milo T.K]

Am I correct in saying that the first one is about to move to Ilford?

 

[Class37Colas]

There is a stock move from Slade Green to Ramsgate depot that is running today and it may be the 376s for todays drag to Ilford.(both are runs as required)

 

[Trainguy34]

There is a stock move from Slade Green to Ramsgate depot that is running today and it may be the 376s for todays drag to Ilford.(both are runs as required.

Looks like this isn't running unfortunately, hopefully next week

 

[Class37Colas]

Looks like this isn't running unfortunately, hopefully next week

The drag to ilford isn’t running next week.

 

[Trainguy34]

The drag to ilford isn’t running next week.

Do you know when it is running?

 

[Class37Colas]

Do you know when it is running?

I do not know when it will run but I know what Saturdays RTT says it might run, 22nd, 29th and every Saturday after until December.

 

[Milo T.K]

So since the first refurbished 395 re-entered service is the 376 about to or has started refurbishment I'm guessing?

 

[Doomotron]

So since the first refurbished 395 re-entered service is the 376 about to or has started refurbishment I'm guessing?

Not confirmed at all.

 

[Chiltern006]

bringing this back to life, from Steve whites twitter

 

[Doomotron]

From those renders it isn't a proper refurbishment at all. It has the same tatty floor, and granted they've recoloured the handrails, but to orange, which hasn't been SE's official colour for handrails for at least ten years. I guess they're trying to make them similar inside to the 707s, but it wasn't a conscious decision in those as they still have the SWT interior except for the seat moquette.

 

[NSEWonderer]

Well he does confirm no Air Con fully now

I know its irrelevant but the units would blend so much nicer with an orange matching front to the orange top strip they have on the side that mimics the 707s

 

[Recessio]

I'd rather they put aircon in and leave the interiors as-is!

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

I think they'll look very smart in the new livery. I know not everyone disagrees on this - actually seems a pretty even 50/50 split across the forum on this stance - but even unrefurbished, I'd rather a 376 over a Networker any day of the week.