Class 379 updates (all are OFF LEASE)

[43096]

Who, if you dig down far enough, appear to be majority-owned by SNCF.

Not majority owned, it’s split 50:50.

From the Akiem website:

Akiem is owned in equal parts by Transport et Logistique Partenaires SA (TLP, an SNCF Participations subsidiary holding company) and Eurotraction, an investment fund managed by DWS, an international asset manager that focuses on infrastructure.

 

[43102EMR]

Maybe I shouldn’t trust sources then. I’m absolutely certain I heard that the /0s didn’t have them but either where I heard it from was wrong or I am being stupid and once again I question why I am interested in railways when I know nothing.

The /0s do… but the /1s that also frequent the London to Norwich route don’t.

 

[ashkeba]

Who, if you dig down far enough, appear to be majority-owned by SNCF.

Oh good. I'm sure the French state railway will be friendly to an operator part-owned by the Dutch state railway.

 

[dk1]

Maybe I shouldn’t trust sources then. I’m absolutely certain I heard that the /0s didn’t have them but either where I heard it from was wrong or I am being stupid and once again I question why I am interested in railways when I know nothing.

Trust me I drive them & they do. Where would us Intercity boys and girls be without onboard refreshments?

 

[hwl]

was it a screwup - or do i recall reading somewhere that Stadler just didn't have the capacity to build the complete fleet?

The 745 were added to help bring the price of the 755 order down but still increase capacity on certain routes (e.g. an extra 1.5 mk3 carriages worth of seats per train to Norwich). 2+2 format 720 would have higher capacity still than a 745 and be circa 10 m longer.
There was no way Stadler could build the entire EMU fleet but that was never the plan. The Stadler option which would have been lower capacity per train than currently so would have lost to Bombardier or Siemens offerings on capacity, price and energy efficiency.

 

[43096]

Oh good. I'm sure the French state railway will be friendly to an operator part-owned by the Dutch state railway.

Except, as I posted above, Akiem’s not majority SNCF owned.

And they’ll happily deal with NS, it is after all a commercial business. Akiem bought NS’ 45 TRAXX as a sale-and-lease-back a while back. They also lease traction to SNCF’s direct competitors in France.

So not sure where your conspiracy theory comes from?

 

[ashkeba]

Except, as I posted above, Akiem’s not majority SNCF owned.

And they’ll happily deal with NS, it is after all a commercial business. Akiem bought NS’ 45 TRAXX as a sale-and-lease-back a while back. They also lease traction to SNCF’s direct competitors in France.

So not sure where your conspiracy theory comes from?

I am not sure where you think I posted a conspiracy theory. SNCF and NS work together in Railteam and probably many other past projects.

 

[306024]

Parkeston update at 16.30 today.
10 x 379s in a long line on the down through siding between Parkeston and Dovercourt, the maximum that can be stabled there.
6 x 379s in Parkeston Yard, together with 4 x 317s.

 

[Class15]

So over half stored now?

 

[CDM]

was it a screwup - or do i recall reading somewhere that Stadler just didn't have the capacity to build the complete fleet? The issue with the 720's is purely the 3+2 seat layout and narrow aisles. Unfortunately GE and WA commuters have had to put up with 3+2 over the years, and the 720's are a huge upgrade in that sense.

Generally, people would rather have a narrow seat than no seat.
3+2 in itself doesn't need to mean awfully narrow seats/aisles. Class 720 is particularly not good in that regard though, because they're a longer coach than the 317/321/360/379 they replace. Longer coach within same loading gauge means narrower coaches, which means less space width-ways for seats and aisles.
The only reason Class 379s weren't 3+2 is because they were introduced for the Stansted service and you need wide aisles to cope with everyone having luggage.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Generally, people would rather have a narrow seat than no seat.
3+2 in itself doesn't need to mean awfully narrow seats/aisles. Class 720 is particularly not good in that regard though, because they're a longer coach than the 317/321/360/379 they replace. Longer coach within same loading gauge means narrower coaches, which means less space width-ways for seats and aisles.

As this post is about the 720, my response has been posted in the Class 720 Introduction thread.

 

[Railperf]

All WA & GE drivers should sign them now.

No..still some WA drivers in training

 

[dk1]

No..still some WA drivers in training

Gosh. Whatever’s taking so long I wonder?

 

[Railperf]

Gosh. Whatever’s taking so long I wonder?

Maybe the availability of 720's to train on - WA side?

 

[dk1]

Maybe the availability of 720's to train on - WA side?

Could be mate. I don’t have any involvement in trains with 3+2 seating

 

[Railperf]

Could be mate. I don’t have any involvement in trains with 3+2 seating

Lucky you..wasn't there a plan to train you on 321s some time back?

 

[dk1]

Lucky you..wasn't there a plan to train you on 321s some time back?

Oh yes but only one Norwich link. Several started training before it all got scrapped thank God. Then some got trained on 720s before all that got scrapped too.

 

[317 forever]

I’m not confident either as we seem to be allergic to freight-only electrification in this country (an example is the tiny Willesden-Acton Main Line curve).

In terms of the 379s, could they do GWR Oxford services of and when that line is electrified?

If the class 379s do move to the Oxford services after serving Cambridge, they will have reached cities famous for their Universities.

 

[swt_passenger]

If the class 379s do move to the Oxford services after serving Cambridge, they will have reached cities famous for their Universities.

They’ll still need Hull though, as Blackadder might have said…

 

[43096]

They’ll still need Hull though, as Blackadder might have said…

Quite right, Oxford's a complete dump.

 

[dk1]

If the class 379s do move to the Oxford services after serving Cambridge, they will have reached cities famous for their Universities.

The Varsity class.

 

[D365]

If the class 379s do move to the Oxford services after serving Cambridge, they will have reached cities famous for their Universities.

There's an interesting trivia question; have any of the "red" Class 387/2s operated to both Cambridge and Oxford?

 

[JonathanH]

There's an interesting trivia question; have any of the "red" Class 387/2s operated to both Cambridge and Oxford?

No 387s have operated to Oxford. There will be some that have operated to both Cambridgeshire and Oxfordshire.

 

[DanNCL]

There's an interesting trivia question; have any of the "red" Class 387/2s operated to both Cambridge and Oxford?

No wires to Oxford yet!

 

[dk1]

There's an interesting trivia question; have any of the "red" Class 387/2s operated to both Cambridge and Oxford?

Need some juice in Oxford first lol

 

[D365]

Easy answer then!

 

[DannyMich2018]

It's really sad seeing the 379s stored after just over 10 years in service and where much older 317s and 321s and 322s (all PRM ones) still in use. The reason stated is high lease costs but could a cheaper lease have been negotiated to avoid this?

 

[JonathanH]

It's really sad seeing the 379s stored after just over 10 years in service and where much older 317s and 321s and 322s (all PRM ones) still in use. The reason stated is high lease costs but could a cheaper lease have been negotiated to avoid this?

Why is it sad? They are just transportation vehicles. If the price is right, they will be used again. The other fleets are most likely going for scrap once Greater Anglia have finished with them, so it makes sense to get the most use out of them at the moment, while not unnecessarily using the 379s (and bringing forward maintenance requirements). The 379s can't be used on services the 321s and 322s are used on in any case and there aren't that many 317s now left in operation either.

(If you think about it, 387130-387141 were out of service for some time between finishing on normal GWR services and entering service with Heathrow Express. No one was sad about that because it wasn't visible but they were no less 'out of service' than the 379s.)

 

[DannyMich2018]

Why is it sad? They are just transportation vehicles. If the price is right, they will be used again. The other fleets are most likely going for scrap once Greater Anglia have finished with them, so it makes sense to get the most use out of them at the moment, while not unnecessarily using the 379s. The 379s can't be used on services the 321s and 322s are used on in any case and there aren't that many 317s now left in operation either.

It is sad because of their age! There are older 313, 315, 317, 318, 320, 322, 323 etc still around. It just seems a waste these young trains been stored- Let's hope they can be used again somewhere.

 

[physics34]

It is sad because of their age! There are older 313, 315, 317, 318, 320, 322, 323 etc still around. It just seems a waste these young trains been stored- Let's hope they can be used again somewhere.

There is no doubt they will be used again.