Class 745 Stadler FLIRTs

[rdlover777]

Sorry for duplicate post. Site said I should wait 20 seconds before posting thewn it posted twice. Also can't find a way of deleting posts. Is it just another 'dodgy' rumour that the 745's are being delivered by sea (Southampton) rather than the tunnel? I thought they were loco hauled all the way through Europe?
Also that the Stadler guy that 'organised' the delivery of the units without seats has been 'let go'?

It's just a rumor, all 745s (and the 755s) are being dragged through the Channel Tunnel by a Class 92

Also, Rail Magazine released an article today about the 745s and the future of the MK3s

Stadler Class 745s could enter traffic on the Norwich-London Liverpool Street route next month, says Greater Anglia.

GA Managing Director Jamie Burles explained that subject to final certification and approvals, the plan is for ten sets to be in traffic by the end of the year, which would enable the Class 90s and Mk 3s to be withdrawn.

He added that should that not be possible, then GA would seek a derogation to operate the non-compliant stock for a short period next year. They are missing Passenger Information Systems.

GA Joint Project Manager Steve Mitchell told RAIL that it would be possible for the Class 745/1s that are destined for Stansted Express to be used on the Great Eastern expresses initially, running alongside Class 745/0s. This is because the ‘379s’ currently used on the Stansted route already meet disability requirements.

Currently there are six Class 745/0s and four Class 745/1s in the UK (745001-745006, 745101-745104).

 

[MrPIC]

Those stanex flirts will never work a Stanex I guarantee it

 

[Aureol Colin]

Those stanex flirts will never work a Stanex I guarantee it

Can you expand on this statement and explain why please?

 

[MrPIC]

Already saying they'll nick them for Norwiches, and as soon as they figure out that 10 isn't enough they'll nick the stanex flirts alltogether and leave the 379's on there. I can see it coming.

 

[samuelmorris]

You are right that 10 isn't enough, which is why one will be working Norwich diagrams, rotating as per maintenance at Norwich dictates. 720s will be working the third 'stopping' Norwich service. To say that StanEx 745 fleet will not be used on StanEx services, however, is extremely unlikely, Norwich does not need 20 units and the 745/1s were specified (however well is another matter) for specifically the Stansted route.

 

[trebor79]

Actually 20 units would be about right for 3tph on the GEML. The 720's could do Stansted, which might avoid some of the door/dwell time issues that people are worrying about on that route.

 

[RailWonderer]

Actually 20 units would be about right for 3tph on the GEML. The 720's could do Stansted, which might avoid some of the door/dwell time issues that people are worrying about on that route.

The 3rd tph will be a stopper which couldn't be a 745 with one set of double doors per coach, since loadings on a GEML stopper will always be too heavy.

 

[47421]

You are right that 10 isn't enough, which is why one will be working Norwich diagrams, rotating as per maintenance at Norwich dictates. 720s will be working the third 'stopping' Norwich service. To say that StanEx 745 fleet will not be used on StanEx services, however, is extremely unlikely, Norwich does not need 20 units and the 745/1s were specified (however well is another matter) for specifically the Stansted route.

Assumes of course that the third Norwich materialises. Was required May 19 per TSR2 but never happened, and seems recast of GEML will not happen til Dec 20 earliest.

Separately does anyone know why a 12 car Stadler has not visited West Anglia yet? GA just been too busy testing them around Norwich and training GE drivers so they can get them in use on Norwiches? Or are there issues specific to West Anglia, gageing or something?

 

[trebor79]

The 3rd tph will be a stopper which couldn't be a 745 with one set of double doors per coach, since loadings on a GEML stopper will always be too heavy.

Oh right. More an extension of the Ipswich stoppers to Norwich then?

 

[Nick Ashwell]

Was required May 19 per TSR2 but never happened?

Forgive me but being an aircraft geek first and foremost TSR2 means something totally different to me, what does it mean in this case?

 

[samuelmorris]

Forgive me but being an aircraft geek first and foremost TSR2 means something totally different to me, what does it mean in this case?

Train Service Requirement 2 - I believe it's a franchise specification milestone, in terms of service amendments / increases etc.

 

[47421]

Correct - Train Service Requirement - under GA Franchise Agreement from May 19 they were supposed to deliver:

- extra train off peak LivSt to Southend and Hertford East
- Norwich Camb extended to Stansted hourly
- Norwich Ipswich extended to Norwich hourly
- 2up 2down Norwich in 90

Of these only Norwich in 90 delivered. From Dec 19 most Norwich Camb will run through to Stansted. Others, no news.

From May 20 they are due to deliver various other enhancements per TSR 3, including quicker journey times to many key destinations. But that has been put back to Dec 20 earliest. Also some promised enhancements been confirmed as undeliverable, in particular Ipswich Peterborough going hourly cant be done cus too many level crossings, and extension of Sudbury through to Colchester also too difficult, maninline link at Marks Tey not suitable for frequent use cus of a foot crossing or something

 

[Bald Rick]

Those stanex flirts will never work a Stanex I guarantee it

Guarantee? How much do you want to bet!?

 

[Bald Rick]

Forgive me but being an aircraft geek first and foremost TSR2 means something totally different to me, what does it mean in this case?

Train Service Requirement 2 - I believe it's a franchise specification milestone, in terms of service amendments / increases etc.

To be fair, they will both bomb quickly, if they ever happen at all.

 

[Scottychoo]

Those stanex flirts will never work a Stanex I guarantee it

I agree, especially as they don't fit through Hackney Downs platform, it's going to be 379s for a long while yet.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Guarantee? How much do you want to bet!?

I bet they will, but I think it would make more sense to use other EMUs on that (continue with 379s, say) and convert those FLIRTs to two-class with buffet so there are enough to work all the Norwich fasts with them.

 

[RailWonderer]

Oh right. More an extension of the Ipswich stoppers to Norwich then?

Deleted

 

[dk1]

Now no one knows. The StanEx 745s likely won’t ever see the West Anglia and will be used on the GEML instead, and the extra 720s originally for the GEML could move to Stansted when they’ve arrived.
As someone who uses the GEML expresses regularly it will be nice to have all 745s on my line, convert two more to IC spec, and the rest can serve expresses.

That ain't going to happen

 

[RailWonderer]

That ain't going to happen

What won’t happen, conversion of one or two 745s to IC spec or the StanEx 745s not going on the WA entirely?
If they do serve Stansted there’s extensive work they have to do and they would have started some testing already.

 

[dk1]

What won’t happen, conversion of one or two 745s to IC spec or the StanEx 745s not going on the WA entirely?
If they do serve Stansted there’s extensive work they have to do and they would have started some testing already.

Both & testing is all planned but GEML comes first.

 

[Scottychoo]

The 745s will not see use on the WAML due to numerous issues, not least they won't fit through Hackney Downs platform. That's why they haven't even been test run on the WAML. They will all go to the GEML and when the 720s are eventually delivered will replace the 379s on the Stansteds.

 

[dk1]

755s have already worked Cambridge to Liverpool St testing AWS over WA routes.

 

[Bald Rick]

The 745s will not see use on the WAML due to numerous issues, not least they won't fit through Hackney Downs platform. That's why they haven't even been test run on the WAML. They will all go to the GEML and when the 720s are eventually delivered will replace the 379s on the Stansteds.

I’m not sure where you’re getting your info from, but I’d ask whoever it is to have a lie down.

 

[dk1]

I’m not sure where you’re getting your info from, but I’d ask whoever it is to have a lie down.

I've shown some of these comments to one of the test team & says it has made his weekend

 

[Bald Rick]

I've shown some of these comments to one of the test team & says it has made his weekend

Completely bizarre isn’t it! Perhaps we should have a competition for the most outlandish GA fleet rumour.

‘Apparently’, because the engines of the generator car of the 755s are so quiet, it is causing problems at some footpath level crossings where pedestrians can’t hear the approaching train. Until a technical solution is found, likely to involve active exhausts and a loudspeaker, GA are going to remove all the generator cars, and insert 2 x Class 37s.

 

[Scottychoo]

755s have already worked Cambridge to Liverpool St testing AWS over WA routes.

Yes but via Seven sisters, not Tottenham Hale, and hence not through the fast platforms at Hackney Downs.
Presumably if you are both so confident they will work on the WAML you can tell us all the date they will be in service, or will they remain at the mid Norfolk to rust away.

 

[dk1]

Completely bizarre isn’t it! Perhaps we should have a competition for the most outlandish GA fleet rumour.

‘Apparently’, because the engines of the generator car of the 755s are so quiet, it is causing problems at some footpath level crossings where pedestrians can’t hear the approaching train. Until a technical solution is found, likely to involve active exhausts and a loudspeaker, GA are going to remove all the generator cars, and insert 2 x Class 37s.

Are you telling me this is only a rumour?? Blast I must've dreamt that then haha. Oh well, let's see what we can top these tales with then.

 

[dk1]

Yes but via Seven sisters, not Tottenham Hale, and hence not through the fast platforms at Hackney Downs.
Presumably if you are both so confident they will work on the WAML you can tell us all the date they will be in service, or will they remain at the mid Norfolk to rust away.

All in good time. Another 3-car was brought back yesterday to try to speed things up but there have been plenty of unseen hurdles. There is nothing more sinister to their introduction than that.

 

[47421]

@dk1 & @Bald Rick happy to take rumours with large pinch of salt, but presumably there is a reason why no Stansted unit has not been to Stansted 6 months after they arrived in UK? Do you know what it is and can you share?

 

[dk1]

@dk1 & @Bald Rick happy to take rumours with large pinch of salt, but presumably there is a reason why no Stansted unit has not been to Stansted 6 months after they arrived in UK? Do you know what it is and can you share?

To be fair they haven't even made it to Liverpool Street that much & the GEML is where they are gaining their mileage & acceptance. Several issues with the fleet that are being overcome & have set things back. It's only Norwich based DIs that sign them & they would need route conductors to pop up & down the WA lines. Late 2019 early 2020 somebody mentioned last week.