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Class 745 Stadler FLIRTs

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ashkeba

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I cannot agree with your view on this. The mark 3 coaches were well past their prime, being noisy, tatty and with awkward fixed armrests and rediculous door-opening arrangement. I find 745s quiet, fast and quite comfortable enough for a 2 hour journey. FLIRTS operate similar services all over Switzerland and I've never had any complaints when over there.
Indeed. Intercity is as much about onbord services and timetable as the rolling material! Skipping small stops, no stops >5 minutes (why XC is not IC), catering, air con, >90kph unless mountains - basically the EuroCity criteria except international and multilingual.
 
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delticdave

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The 755/3s aren't too bad on diesel actually. They are nippier than what they replaced.

Makes sense, is their 1300 hp more than than the 2/3 car units previously used? I'd expect that their diesel-electric drive is more efficient than the Voith hydro-mechanical drives, but I'm not so sure how a 755/3 compares in power to weight ratios.

I've bought the most recent Marsden rolling stock book, but there are still arithmetical errors re. power outputs, & train weights.
I especially like the "fact" that a 755/3 has 3 diesel engines........
 

greyman42

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I cannot agree with your view on this. The mark 3 coaches were well past their prime, being noisy, tatty and with awkward fixed armrests and rediculous door-opening arrangement. I find 745s quiet, fast and quite comfortable enough for a 2 hour journey. FLIRTS operate similar services all over Switzerland and I've never had any complaints when over there.
I did not find the mark 3s noisy, I thought that they were well kept with comfortable seats and the armrests were a lot more comfortable than the thin solid plastic one's on new trains. As for the doors, I have opened and closed them for years so perhaps I was just familiar with them.
 

chubs

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I cannot agree with your view on this. The mark 3 coaches were well past their prime, being noisy, tatty and with awkward fixed armrests and rediculous door-opening arrangement. I find 745s quiet, fast and quite comfortable enough for a 2 hour journey. FLIRTS operate similar services all over Switzerland and I've never had any complaints when over there.

Agreed. An improvement over the life expired ratty old mk3's in every way.
 

MikePJ

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Is there any news on driver training on 745s on the West Anglia route? I'm wondering if there's a time I might be able to see one pass through Cambridge?
 

Abbo

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Is there any news on driver training on 745s on the West Anglia route? I'm wondering if there's a time I might be able to see one pass through Cambridge?
I believe that there has been a report on here of at least one such trip to Ely ?
 

james60059

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Yes they are all in all very pleasant units and just about perfect for the route they serve. I need to sample first class when normality returns.

For purely selfish reasons, I hope it's soon as I would like to sample a Class 745 too :lol: in fact just to be able to do rail rovers again
 

XCTurbostar

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Just a thread bump. Are the 745/1s anywhere closer to entering service on Stansted Express? I've also heard reports that 745101 has also donated its cab end to another unit?
 

Astro_Orbiter

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Think it'll be a while yet, corona is halting in cab driver training, which as I understand is the last big thing before wholesale introduction into service on the West.
 

Energy

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Think it'll be a while yet, corona is halting in cab driver training, which as I understand is the last big thing before wholesale introduction into service on the West.
Anyway 720 training will probably take priority, worst case if the 745s don't enter service on the stansted express till later is that the 379s have to stay a little longer which is fine as they haven't got a lease ahead of them yet.
 

Railperf

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Surely the priority is to replace the life-expired and tatty 317's from West Anglia first. And lots of WA drivers sign flirts now too. Clearly the lack of flights to/from Stansted dictates that Stansted services don't warrant 12-car trains right now. Could the 745/1's be used on London to Bishops Stortford and Cambridge? Maybe platform lengths are an issue?
The 720's seem to be testing along GEML, so that suggests the GEML will be first to get them - before WA. But why would GA pay for 745/1s that are mainly sitting around?
 

Energy

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Surely the priority is to replace the life-expired and tatty 317's from West Anglia first
Probably not, the 360s will take priority as they have a lease ahead of them. Although I imagine that drivers have already been trained on the 745s who will be driving them.
 

Bikeman78

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Surely the priority is to replace the life-expired and tatty 317's from West Anglia first. And lots of WA drivers sign flirts now too. Clearly the lack of flights to/from Stansted dictates that Stansted services don't warrant 12-car trains right now. Could the 745/1's be used on London to Bishops Stortford and Cambridge? Maybe platform lengths are an issue?
The 720's seem to be testing along GEML, so that suggests the GEML will be first to get them - before WA. But why would GA pay for 745/1s that are mainly sitting around?
There are three driver depots for Stansted Express, London, Bishop's Stortford and Cambridge. I'm sure many, possibly all, Cambridge drivers will sign 755s now. Does this mean they can also drive 745s? However, most Stansted work is covered by the other two depots. How many of those drivers have been trained?

AGA are clearly hedging their bets. They could easily run the reduced timetable with PRM class 317s and class 379s. I thought the whole phase 2 fleet might disappear when lockdown started but that hasn't been the case. Most of the fleet is still active.
 

dk1

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There are three driver depots for Stansted Express, London, Bishop's Stortford and Cambridge. I'm sure many, possibly all, Cambridge drivers will sign 755s now. Does this mean they can also drive 745s? However, most Stansted work is covered by the other two depots. How many of those drivers have been trained?
Yes if you sign 755s which are more complex then you also sign 745s. There is one depot on the GE side that will however sign 745s but not 755s as they do not have any disgrammed work for the latter.
 

Shunter_69

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Yes if you sign 755s which are more complex then you also sign 745s. There is one depot on the GE side that will however sign 745s but not 755s as they do not have any disgrammed work for the latter.
Assume that’s Liverpool Street.
 

Class 170101

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Yes if you sign 755s which are more complex then you also sign 745s. There is one depot on the GE side that will however sign 745s but not 755s as they do not have any disgrammed work for the latter.

Assume that’s Liverpool Street.

Yes mate, Anglia Drivers.

Totally stupid, they should sign both and drive the proposed (as per franchise agreement) London to Lowestoft services south of Ipswich.
 

RailWonderer

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Totally stupid, they should sign both and drive the proposed (as per franchise agreement) London to Lowestoft services south of Ipswich.
As is the case for any ToC, only the necessary drivers and crew will be trained for a particular traction. I e-mailed GA about the Lowestofts and they said only when the timetable is recast following all rolling stock being introduced will those services restart. Somehow I don't think a 755 will ever carry a passenger south of Marks Tey.
Assuming they do run the 4tpd (I assume two up trains and two down) only Crown Point drivers will need to sign them if both are evening down trains that won't require London drivers.
 

dk1

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Totally stupid, they should sign both and drive the proposed (as per franchise agreement) London to Lowestoft services south of Ipswich.
Ridiculous comment. They never have signed that route. Only Ipswich/Norwich drivers work the East Suffolk route anyway. I don't thing the franchise agreement is worth the paper it's printed on anymore.
 

dk1

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As is the case for any ToC, only the necessary drivers and crew will be trained for a particular traction. I e-mailed GA about the Lowestofts and they said only when the timetable is recast following all rolling stock being introduced will those services restart. Somehow I don't think a 755 will ever carry a passenger south of Marks Tey.
Assuming they do run the 4tpd (I assume two up trains and two down) only Crown Point drivers will need to sign them if both are evening down trains that won't require London drivers.
Do you mean Norwich/Ipswich drivers rather than Crown Point?
 

Shunter_69

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Totally stupid, they should sign both and drive the proposed (as per franchise agreement) London to Lowestoft services south of Ipswich.
Norwich, Ipswich and Colchester drivers all sign 755 so any of these could drive these trains South of Ipswich if they are introduced.
 

306024

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Norwich, Ipswich and Colchester drivers all sign 755 so any of these could drive these trains South of Ipswich if they are introduced.

Indeed. There is no obvious need for any other depot to be involved assuming these services balance from the Ipswich end and don’t have a unit overnight in London. When the 170s used to work through to Liverpool St in NXEA days Liverpool St drivers worked a lot of those trains, but there were two units stabled at the London end each night so the work balanced differently.
 

samuelmorris

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Ridiculous comment. They never have signed that route. Only Ipswich/Norwich drivers work the East Suffolk route anyway. I don't thing the franchise agreement is worth the paper it's printed on anymore.
Indeed not. If there weren't more important things going on in the world right now it's the sort of thing I'd call for an inquiry into.
 

Alfie1014

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Assuming they do run the 4tpd (I assume two up trains and two down) only Crown Point drivers will need to sign them if both are evening down trains that won't require London drivers.

The Train Service Requirement (TSR3) as originally drafted required 4 trains per day in each direction.
 

Shunter_69

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I think the original franchise agreement has been killed off by COVID 19. If the government ask Abellio to go back to it with no amendments when the emergency agreement finishes I’m fairly confident the keys will be handed back instantly.
 

dk1

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The Train Service Requirement (TSR3) as originally drafted required 4 trains per day in each direction.
Well there has been so much confusion over this. The way it's been quoted many times including from user groups is that it's interpreted as 4 through trains, 2 each way per day.
 

dk1

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I think the original franchise agreement has been killed off by COVID 19. If the government ask Abellio to go back to it with no amendments when the emergency agreement finishes I’m fairly confident the keys will be handed back instantly.
I do wonder that but remember the government will really be up against it with so many other national issues. It could be that it's easier to continue with some sort of management contract that is guaranteed income with no risk to the train operators leaving one less headache for Westminster to deal with right now. All of the TOCs are going to be in the same boat & without support goodness knows what the Open Access lot are going to do.
 
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