Class 8̶0̶4̶ 810 for East Midlands Railway Construction/Introduction Updates

Discussion in 'Traction & Rolling Stock' started by Jozhua, 12 Nov 2019.

  1. greatvoyager

    greatvoyager Established Member

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    I just hope they get the layout right.
     
  2. whhistle

    whhistle On Moderation

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    Railway Herald reports that EMR have confirmed the sets will be Class 800s.

    Do the current Class 800s have shorter coaches?

    I would have thought a new nose profile and shorter coaches would warrant a new classification.

    Perhaps it's been reported wrong, or EMR have backtracked on the nose design change.
     
  3. Doomotron

    Doomotron Member

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    Considering how much the DFT likes to give minor design changes completely new and wild classifications, I find it hard to believe they'll be 800s:
    • New front design
    • Maybe the (ugly) new designs that AWC are getting
    • Shorter coaches
    • More engines/more powerful engines
     
  4. Speed43125

    Speed43125 Member

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    Different coach length warrants a new class, even in the days of BR MUs with different carriage lengths would never be numbered together.
     
  5. Domh245

    Domh245 Established Member

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    Reported as "according to an EMR spokesman". I would be amazed if they were 800s, after all the 802s and 800s are near enough identical from a physical point of view yet have different numbers, so for a shorter train with a reported completely different formation to get lumped as an 800 would be crazy.
     
  6. PG

    PG Member

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    My bolding above - well they aren't nicknamed DaFt for nothing... ;)
     
  7. samuelmorris

    samuelmorris Established Member

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    More to the point, the 800 is primarily to designate the DfT-specified trains. If they do reuse an existing class number (which they shouldn't, but then TOPS classes defy all logic) then it ought to be 802.
     
  8. D365

    D365 Established Member

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    Link to the Railway Herald article here for those interested.

     
  9. greatvoyager

    greatvoyager Established Member

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    Agreed, 802s have only a few changes to 800s, yet are a different class. The EMR version is even more of a radical change, so surely needs a different classification.
     
  10. greatvoyager

    greatvoyager Established Member

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    That was my understanding too.
     
  11. 323217

    323217 New Member

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    I've spoken to a colleague over at East Midlands who said that that they're definitely not 804s - make of that what you will!
     
  12. Snow1964

    Snow1964 Member

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    I wonder if DfT means 800 series rather than 800 (absolute)
    effectively using generic name for all variants

    The technical differences warrant different class (and sub class) numbers,
     
  13. bastien

    bastien Member

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    It'll probably be class 888 or something daft like that.
     
  14. squizzler

    squizzler Member

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    Cue comments about unleavened chair cushions...
     
  15. Meerkat

    Meerkat Established Member

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    808 (State)
     
  16. Doomotron

    Doomotron Member

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    Maybe 810 as the new ones are significantly different to the 80x that have already been built?

    I highly doubt that they'll be 800s, even if Johnny Spokesperson says they will be.
     
  17. anamyd

    anamyd On Moderation

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    I noticed on Wikipedia that both the 804 article and the EMR article are like "804 but will be 800" (using that fishy-sounding source) which suggests that the editors are complying with "verifiability not truth" (although the former is questionable) but know that they won't really be "800s".

    Seeing as:

    800 - Intercity Express Programme bi-mode
    801 - Intercity Express Programme EMU
    802 - "conventionally procured" bi-mode
    803 - "conventionally procured" EMU (though not fully confirmed)

    ...804 does seem logical with the different carriage lengths (the "facelift" may even count)
    then 805 would be used for an EMU version of the 804 (if it even is the 804 :lol:)

    I've noticed 802s sometimes incorrectly being referred to as "800s" ("800s" seems to be a "catch-all" misnomer for the 80x AT300s)
     
    Last edited: 26 Jan 2020
  18. D365

    D365 Established Member

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    OT but the decision to classify the Class 397s under the 39x range was strange in itself...
     
  19. anamyd

    anamyd On Moderation

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    even more OT - 398s/399s...
     
  20. Energy

    Energy Member

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    I would say it makes sense, its a high speed intercity style emu, like the 390 and 395 which are in the 39x range. Although 399 is an odd choice.
     
  21. swt_passenger

    swt_passenger Veteran Member

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    The reason people are saying that it doesn’t seem to make sense is because the changed railway group standard had already been published before the CAF trains for TPE were ordered, and it clearly places such stock, ie any 125 mph fixed formation trains, whether EMU or DMU, in the 800-899 range.
     
  22. Energy

    Energy Member

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    ahh, makes sense
     
  23. Doomotron

    Doomotron Member

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    However it isn't always taken notice of, like the 331s and 345s (should be 7xx) and the 195s (should be 6xx).
     
  24. swt_passenger

    swt_passenger Veteran Member

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    I disagree. The standard doesn’t actually prevent use of spare 3xx or 4xx class numbers. But we’re going off-topic now...
     
  25. whhistle

    whhistle On Moderation

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    There's been a suggestion internally that the new Hitachi trains will be very modern and like nothing seen in the UK so far.

    No yellow front.

    Champagne colour scheme inside (I guess this is the creamy colour already seen in the brand) with potentially brown leather stitched seating.
     
  26. Laketop

    Laketop Member

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    Not sure if this image has been released earlier, but it shows what looks to be a couple of changes versus previously released imagery.

    These include a silver and not golden cone, the decals on the side are also different compared to their previous imagery, the top light is more horizontal than circular and the door is more flush, the cone is more pointed and this picture now shows digital cut-outs for carriage screens.

    Source: https://www.eventbrite.co.uk/e/east...ent-open-evening-tickets-90617478317?ref=estw

    [​IMG]
     
  27. Meerkat

    Meerkat Established Member

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    I think that cone is the same gold as the door.
    What is that sticking out next to the light - is that a lamp iron?!
    They need to have a word with the PW bods about the ballast depth...
     
  28. rdlover777

    rdlover777 Member

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    Not too surprising, 395s have lamp irons, it just for if its dragged by a loco. I've seen the SERefurbed 375s with a electric tail lamp on the lampiron when dragged to Ramsgate by ROG's 37
     
  29. NewSt

    NewSt Member

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    Love the silver nose cone!
     
  30. Domh245

    Domh245 Established Member

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    It might just be my eyes, but those look a lot more like plug doors than the usual sliding affairs.
     

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