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Discussion in 'Traction & Rolling Stock' started by Jozhua, 12 Nov 2019.
I just hope they get the layout right.
Railway Herald reports that EMR have confirmed the sets will be Class 800s.
Do the current Class 800s have shorter coaches?
I would have thought a new nose profile and shorter coaches would warrant a new classification.
Perhaps it's been reported wrong, or EMR have backtracked on the nose design change.
Considering how much the DFT likes to give minor design changes completely new and wild classifications, I find it hard to believe they'll be 800s:
New front design
Maybe the (ugly) new designs that AWC are getting
More engines/more powerful engines
Different coach length warrants a new class, even in the days of BR MUs with different carriage lengths would never be numbered together.
Reported as "according to an EMR spokesman". I would be amazed if they were 800s, after all the 802s and 800s are near enough identical from a physical point of view yet have different numbers, so for a shorter train with a reported completely different formation to get lumped as an 800 would be crazy.
My bolding above - well they aren't nicknamed DaFt for nothing...
More to the point, the 800 is primarily to designate the DfT-specified trains. If they do reuse an existing class number (which they shouldn't, but then TOPS classes defy all logic) then it ought to be 802.
Link to the Railway Herald article here for those interested.
Agreed, 802s have only a few changes to 800s, yet are a different class. The EMR version is even more of a radical change, so surely needs a different classification.
That was my understanding too.
I've spoken to a colleague over at East Midlands who said that that they're definitely not 804s - make of that what you will!
I wonder if DfT means 800 series rather than 800 (absolute)
effectively using generic name for all variants
The technical differences warrant different class (and sub class) numbers,
It'll probably be class 888 or something daft like that.
Cue comments about unleavened chair cushions...
Maybe 810 as the new ones are significantly different to the 80x that have already been built?
I highly doubt that they'll be 800s, even if Johnny Spokesperson says they will be.
I noticed on Wikipedia that both the 804 article and the EMR article are like "804 but will be 800" (using that fishy-sounding source) which suggests that the editors are complying with "verifiability not truth" (although the former is questionable) but know that they won't really be "800s".
800 - Intercity Express Programme bi-mode
801 - Intercity Express Programme EMU
802 - "conventionally procured" bi-mode
803 - "conventionally procured" EMU (though not fully confirmed)
...804 does seem logical with the different carriage lengths (the "facelift" may even count)
then 805 would be used for an EMU version of the 804 (if it even is the 804 )
I've noticed 802s sometimes incorrectly being referred to as "800s" ("800s" seems to be a "catch-all" misnomer for the 80x AT300s)
OT but the decision to classify the Class 397s under the 39x range was strange in itself...
even more OT - 398s/399s...
I would say it makes sense, its a high speed intercity style emu, like the 390 and 395 which are in the 39x range. Although 399 is an odd choice.
The reason people are saying that it doesn’t seem to make sense is because the changed railway group standard had already been published before the CAF trains for TPE were ordered, and it clearly places such stock, ie any 125 mph fixed formation trains, whether EMU or DMU, in the 800-899 range.
ahh, makes sense
However it isn't always taken notice of, like the 331s and 345s (should be 7xx) and the 195s (should be 6xx).
I disagree. The standard doesn’t actually prevent use of spare 3xx or 4xx class numbers. But we’re going off-topic now...
There's been a suggestion internally that the new Hitachi trains will be very modern and like nothing seen in the UK so far.
No yellow front.
Champagne colour scheme inside (I guess this is the creamy colour already seen in the brand) with potentially brown leather stitched seating.
Not sure if this image has been released earlier, but it shows what looks to be a couple of changes versus previously released imagery.
These include a silver and not golden cone, the decals on the side are also different compared to their previous imagery, the top light is more horizontal than circular and the door is more flush, the cone is more pointed and this picture now shows digital cut-outs for carriage screens.
I think that cone is the same gold as the door.
What is that sticking out next to the light - is that a lamp iron?!
They need to have a word with the PW bods about the ballast depth...
Not too surprising, 395s have lamp irons, it just for if its dragged by a loco. I've seen the SERefurbed 375s with a electric tail lamp on the lampiron when dragged to Ramsgate by ROG's 37
Love the silver nose cone!
It might just be my eyes, but those look a lot more like plug doors than the usual sliding affairs.