Class 810 for East Midlands Railway Construction/Introduction Updates

[43096]

Me too

Alstom Belfort sits in my memory

They were built at various sites in France, Belgium and the UK (buffet cars at Washwood Heath from memory; all the power cars were built at Belfort) and vehicles then moved around and formed up at either Belfort or Washwood Heath.

 

[Pit_buzzer]

They were built at various sites in France, Belgium and the UK (buffet cars at Washwood Heath from memory; all the power cars were built at Belfort) and vehicles then moved around and formed up at either Belfort or Washwood Heath.

Thanks for filling in the blanks, it's funny how bits of information stick in the mind

 

[Prestige15]

I look on enviously......I can't help but hate the fact that decent seating will be introduced on 80x fleets where journeys will be under 2 hours and yet on GWR South west routes where journeys are anything from 2 to 5 hours, standard class seats are dire. If only the new GBR would allocate the appropriate seating to the more appropriate routes.....

Very much how the 222's had better interior for journey of 2-3 hours than the Voyagers with journeys from 2-13 hours

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

I thought the 373s were built in France (which AFAIK isn't part of the UK!)

It was a complicated build with several factories involved, most now owned by Alstom.
Some of the sets were assembled at Washwood Heath, just as the later Pendolinos were.

In both cases the electrics came from Preston (ex-EE/GEC).

 

[Ethan1852]

Another sight of a 810 body shell in this hs2 Video at 00:37.

Another video has also been posted by EMR.

 

[grumpyoldman01]

It was a complicated build with several factories involved, most now owned by Alstom.
Some of the sets were assembled at Washwood Heath, just as the later Pendolinos were.

In both cases the electrics came from Preston (ex-EE/GEC).

All of the power cars were made at Belfort; cars 1/18 were built by BN at Bruges in Belgium and cars 9/10 by De Dietrich at Reichshoffen (France), and the bodyshells for all other vehicles were made at Aytre (near La Rochelle in France). The bodyshells for the French 373s were fitted out at Aytre and the British/Belgian ones were fitted out at Washwood Heath, and the complete British/Belgian sets were assembled here in the UK.

What I'll call the traction control equipment was designed at Preston, and they certainly made some of it, but I can't remember if they produced it all; the traction motors were designed by Brush, and manufacture was shared between Loughborough and the ALSTHOM factory at Tarbes. Transformers were designed by ALSTHOM and manufacture was shared between them at St Denis and GEC at Rugby (or was it Stafford?)

Some of the styling (including the power car cab ends and the buffet cars) was done by Jones Garrard of Leicester, and some of the manufacturing drawings were produced by RFS Projects at Belper

It would be interesting to see how the British content of a 373 compares with an 810; although they were recognised as internationally built trains, from memory approaching 50% of the price for each 373 was paid in Sterling

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Yes, that was a really complex but very successful build.
Some of those plants have been in and out of Alstom (and Bombardier) ownership since, or sold off to people like CAF.

Hitachi at one point did detail all the European-supplied parts of the IEP (class 80x) build and it was significant (bogies, brakes, diesel rafts, seats etc).
But the UK content looked like just the components that were unique to the NR network, mostly in the cab (TPWS, ATP etc), plus some peripheral items like pantographs and windscreen wipers.
Then there's whether you count MTU (diesel racks) as German, where the factory is, or British, as it's owned by Roll-Royce - not a factor for HS2 obviously.
Then there's where you assemble the things, with Hitachi showing it can produce complete trains for the UK at Kasado, Newton Aycliffe and Pistoia.
With production some 4-8 years away, it remains to be seen what other work both Hitachi and Alstom will have in parallel to the HS2 build.

 

[hwl]

Then there's whether you count MTU (diesel rafts) as German, where the factory is, or British, as it's owned by Roll-Royce - not a factor for HS2 obviously.

And the traction alternators on those rafts from Austria and the exhaust system (e.g. catalytic bits) from the UK.

 

[bnsf734]

Another sight of a 810 body shell in this hs2 Video at 00:37.

Whose are the white trains in the video - Avanti?

 

[MML]

I hope the new seats are going to be covered in a hard wearing moquette. The cloth trim on the Meridian units is filthy, frayed, stained and tatty. It will be a false economy to use a flat cloth trim again.

 

[Ilovetrains43]

Whose are the white trains in the video - Avanti?

No, the white trains are more EMR aren't they

 

[Doomotron]

No, the white trains are more EMR aren't they

The EMR 810s will be purple.

 

[Ilovetrains43]

The EMR 810s will be purple.

I meant to be painted, just in undercoat as of now.

 

[DanNCL]

Whose are the white trains in the video - Avanti?

No, the white trains are more EMR aren't they

The white ones seen in the video are 805s and 807s for Avanti West Coast.

 

[STINT47]

I hope the new seats are going to be covered in a hard wearing moquette. The cloth trim on the Meridian units is filthy, frayed, stained and tatty. It will be a false economy to use a flat cloth trim again.

I think the seat covers on the 222s was good and lasted ok but it's just been left on for far to long.

If you leave any train for ten years or more with no work being done it will look tatty. In all honesty all of the 22x (except for Avanti) trains are long overdue a refurbishment.

Also EMR seem to have cut back maintenance to a minimum, EMT weren't anything special but did seem to do a better job with internal and external train presentation.

Hopefully the 810s will be much better and more importantly kept in that condition in the years to come.

 

[NoOnesFool]

But when first introduced, it looked amazing. The STDs looked up to First Class standards. I think the problem was maintenance and cleaning. There was a lot of deep dirt around the head rests that should have been dry cleaned on a regular basis.

I hope the new seats are going to be covered in a hard wearing moquette. The cloth trim on the Meridian units is filthy, frayed, stained and tatty. It will be a false economy to use a flat cloth trim again.

 

[Nym]

But when first introduced, it looked amazing. The STDs looked up to First Class standards. I think the problem was maintenance and cleaning. There was a lot of deep dirt around the head rests that should have been dry cleaned on a regular basis.

Not to mention that most of the padding is long since gone, in the standard and first seats, you can feel the support wires in it.

 

[LowLevel]

But when first introduced, it looked amazing. The STDs looked up to First Class standards. I think the problem was maintenance and cleaning. There was a lot of deep dirt around the head rests that should have been dry cleaned on a regular basis.

They were revolutionary when introduced under MML after the 170s and compared to Virgin's Voyagers and still look smart after the EMT overhaul - however the flat cloth has never been the best seat covering and even under MML the purple stained very quickly.

It doesn't help that the seats being a single double make it much more of a job to swap out damaged covers compared to more standard seat designs where you have individual seats and bases that can be quickly and easily removed.

A full interior overhaul would be great but they're never going to get that under EMR with only a couple of years left, in theory anyway.

I'm still waiting for an announcement that the 170s and possibly the 360s will be de scoped to just a refurbishment of the existing interior, however (though I hope I'm wrong as the plans look very nice).

 

[43055]

BBC are reporting that the work on upgrading for the 810's Etches Park has started. A drawing of the work is in the article which looks like 4 lines will be created between the current class 222 shed (one closest to Derby station) and the main lines. One of which will have a overhead wires and another will have a shed.

Work starts on £35m Derby rail depot project

East Midlands Railway says the changes will help cement Derby's "proud railway heritage".

www.bbc.co.uk

Work starts on £35m Derby rail depot project
By Jennifer Harby
BBC News

Published11 hours ago
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IMAGE SOURCE,EAST MIDLANDS RAILWAY
Image caption,
The depot is being extended to accommodate East Midlands Railway's new Aurora train fleet
A £35m project to extend a rail depot has got under way, a train company has said.
East Midlands Railway (EMR) said it had begun work on its Etches Park depot in Derby in preparation for its new Aurora train fleet.
The project will involve reconfiguring the track, as well as extending its sheds and installing a new electric overhead line.
EMR said the changes would help cement the city's "proud railway heritage".

'Massive improvements'​

EMR's new fleet of 33 five-carriage trains, which will be able to run on electricity and diesel, is being built by Hitachi Rail in County Durham.
EMR said the trains would enter service in 2023 and have more seats and modern interiors.
It will also be installing a new vehicle monitoring system in Derby so it can follow its trains in real time to help plan maintenance.
Lisa Angus, EMR's transitions and projects director, said: "These massive improvements to Etches Park are great news for the city of Derby.
"Using the latest technology and techniques, we will be able to operate our new Aurora fleet as efficiently as possible, while also maintaining specialist engineering jobs in the city for decades to come - helping to cement Derby's proud railway heritage."

IMAGE SOURCE,EAST MIDLANDS RAILWAY
Image caption,
The company said the work would help retain specialist engineering jobs in the city
Elaine Clark, chief executive officer of industry body Rail Forum Midlands, said: "It is great to see the preparations for the arrival of the Aurora fleet taking shape.
"This is great news, not just for passengers and EMR, but also for ensuring skilled jobs are retained and helping to encourage further investment for the city."

 

[YSTrains]

Brilliant work. A manifestation that things are on track and not delayed any further.

 

[Western Sunset]

Is the new Etches Park depot on the site of where #4 Shed used to be?

 

[grumpyoldman01]

Is the new Etches Park depot on the site of where #4 Shed used to be?

Approximately

 

[43055]

The EMR website also has an article with an additional drawing for the area on the other side of the shed.

Derby train depot to get biggest improvement in more than a decade | EMR

www.eastmidlandsrailway.co.uk

Derby train depot to get biggest improvement in more than a decade​

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Tuesday, 8 March 2022

• Multi-million pound investment in Derby depot announced
• Maintains specialist engineering jobs in the city
• Work underway to accommodate new Aurora bi-mode fleet

Work has begun to transform East Midlands Railway’s (EMR) Etches Park depot in Derby in preparation for the arrival of the companies’ new Aurora train fleet.
The £35 million pound project, which is largely funded by rolling stock company RockRail, will be delivered in two phases, firstly to upgrade the site to accommodate the new bi-mode Aurora fleet and secondly the construction of new train cleaning areas, replacement offices and staff facilities at the sites' South Shed.
The first phase of works, which comes at a cost of £15 million and will be undertaken by Buckingham Group Contracting Ltd (Buckingham), will involve reconfiguring the current track layout at the site – helping to improve operational flexibility and greater train movements across the depot.
Alongside these works, the North Shed, where trains are maintained at the depot, will also be extended and a new electric overhead line will be fitted so the new bi-mode fleet can easily be tested.
Further to this, a new carriage wash system will be built at the site, all fuelling and servicing equipment will be upgraded, and the depots' fuel road will be extended – helping to accommodate 2 x 5 car units.
New technology will play a key role in the future of the depot, including the use of a new Vehicle Equipment Monitoring System. This system feeds back numerous levels of detailed data to EMR so it can quickly monitor its trains in real-time – helping to plan preventative maintenance at the depot and leading to an enhanced performance of its trains.
When they enter service in 2023, the Aurora trains will offer significant advances on EMR’s existing fleet, with passengers benefiting from more seats and modern interiors. The new Aurora fleet is currently being manufactured at Hitachi Rail’s UK factory.
The trains, which will have the ability to run on overhead electric lines, will also include features that passengers have said they want to see, including air conditioning, free WiFi throughout, plug sockets and better passenger information screens.

Lisa Angus, Transitions and Projects Director at East Midlands Railway, said: “These massive improvements to Etches Park are great news for the city of Derby and the customers we serve.
"Using the latest technology and techniques, we will be able to operate our new Aurora fleet as efficiently as possible, while also maintaining specialist engineering jobs in the city for decades to come - helping to cement Derby’s proud railway heritage.
“Everyone at EMR is very excited to begin operating our new Aurora trains for our customers in the East Midlands and South Yorkshire and these new improvements are another important step on our journey to bring the new trains to the regions we serve.”
Mark Swindell, Founder and CEO of Rock Rail, said the company is providing £30m of funding in an innovative, flexible and customer focused manner.
He said: "Rock Rail is delighted to support EMR and this important investment into Derby Etches Park, which when coupled with the new Aurora units, will deliver a great improvement for customers and the railway.
"We are bringing together track and train investment to deliver a system improvement. Improvements to Etches Park will facilitate the new bi-modes unit and allow flexibility to operate in diesel or electric mode. Rock is committed to this flexible solution as the EMR network develops over time."
Elaine Clark, Chief Executive Officer of Rail Forum Midlands, said: "It is great to see the preparations for the arrival of the Aurora fleet taking shape with the investment in the Etches Park Depot in Derby. This is great news, not just for passengers and EMR, but also for ensuring skilled jobs are retained and helping to encourage further investment for the city."
Marc Riley, Managing Director, Rail for Buckingham, said: “Buckingham is delighted to have secured this important project and we look forward to working closely with East Midlands Railway and the team at the depot to safely deliver the improvements at Etches Park. We know that investments like this are essential to improve the passenger experience and the railway whilst at the same time protecting highly skilled engineering jobs.
"Our team will focus on delivering the improvements on time, to the quality standards demanded and work closely with the depot team to protect the ongoing operations of the depot and the safety of depot personnel.”

 

[WesternLancer]

When might it be worth starting a thread to detail EMR regional fleet refurbishments? Have they started any yet? Had a few years to have got going but....

 

[DDB]

When might it be worth starting a thread to detail EMR regional fleet refurbishments? Have they started any yet? Had a few years to have got going but....

I belive they are currently using fleet shortages as the excuse for why they aren't providing a train service to Spondon other than 1 before 6am and 1 after 11pm so they can't spare any to refurbish.

 

[STINT47]

I belive they are currently using fleet shortages as the excuse for why they aren't providing a train service to Spondon other than 1 before 6am and 1 after 11pm so they can't spare any to refurbish.

When I asked about the reduced service it was due to a shortage of train staff due to covid. Now they seem to have suddenly lost some rolling stock.

The cynic n me detects excuses

 

[43055]

When I asked about the reduced service it was due to a shortage of train staff due to covid. Now they seem to have suddenly lost some rolling stock.

The cynic n me detects excuses

All the 153s and 4 156s have left in December but nothing has arrived in there place.

 

[QSK19]

Given that we seem to have gone quiet on the 810s, firstly does anybody have any updates on build progress? I half suspect that hearing nothing means there’ll be an inevitable delay - either that or no news means that things are progressing as planned and hence nothing major to report.

Anyway, assuming that the cost of the 33 units was the reported £400m, this works out at £2.42m per car. The Anonymous Widow website covered this topic in 2019 (https://anonw.com/2019/07/31/rock-rail-wins-again/amp/) and stated that the LNER deal worked out at £4m per car - and Hull’s 802s worked out at £2.4m per car.

Therefore, in view of the various prices, do you think EMR/Rock Rail got a very good deal (and the LNER trains were a rip off)? Or do you think the 810s are being built on the cheap given that their highly-bespoke nature necessitates more specialism compared to the “off-the-shelf” 802s?

 

[800001]

Given that we seem to have gone quiet on the 810s, firstly does anybody have any updates on build progress? I half suspect that hearing nothing means there’ll be an inevitable delay - either that or no news means that things are progressing as planned and hence nothing major to report.

Anyway, assuming that the cost of the 33 units was the reported £400m, this works out at £2.42m per car. The Anonymous Widow website covered this topic in 2019 (https://anonw.com/2019/07/31/rock-rail-wins-again/amp/) and stated that the LNER deal worked out at £4m per car - and Hull’s 802s worked out at £2.4m per car.

Therefore, in view of the various prices, do you think EMR/Rock Rail got a very good deal (and the LNER trains were a rip off)? Or do you think the 810s are being built on the cheap given that their highly-bespoke nature necessitates more specialism compared to the “off-the-shelf” 802s?

Very hard to compare GWR and LNER prices, as that is priced including the train maintenance and loads of other costs over a 27 year period, am sure a few others can explain better.

As for build rate going quite, they are in production, slightly different to previous builds, so first few will take longer than previous builds.

To note, Avanti units, the first carriages are due to enter single car testing by the end of month, can imagine EMR being about 4-6 weeks behind that.

 

[Energy]

Given that we seem to have gone quiet on the 810s, firstly does anybody have any updates on build progress? I half suspect that hearing nothing means there’ll be an inevitable delay - either that or no news means that things are progressing as planned and hence nothing major to report.

Anyway, assuming that the cost of the 33 units was the reported £400m, this works out at £2.42m per car. The Anonymous Widow website covered this topic in 2019 (https://anonw.com/2019/07/31/rock-rail-wins-again/amp/) and stated that the LNER deal worked out at £4m per car - and Hull’s 802s worked out at £2.4m per car.

Therefore, in view of the various prices, do you think EMR/Rock Rail got a very good deal (and the LNER trains were a rip off)? Or do you think the 810s are being built on the cheap given that their highly-bespoke nature necessitates more specialism compared to the “off-the-shelf” 802s?

The Hull/TPE order was a tag on order to the GWR 802s, which themselves would have been cheaper than IETs since almost all of the design work was done for the IETs. Also remember the 800s and 801s included a 27.5 year maintenance deal.

I suspect EMR will have gotten a really good deal, partly because of so much design work being done in previous orders but also because of the increased competition. Bombardier vs Hitachi for the order was pretty public and other manufacturers, like Stadler, were bidding as well.