Closed/ Disused Railways - Potential To Be Converted to Cycle/Walking Paths

[Doctor Fegg]

There is an extreme amount of natural beauty in the world, and our country is fortunate enough to have a lot of it. We should celebrate this, and share the news about a really nice area to explore with others.

And in this particular case, North Wales does of course have hundreds of miles of beautiful, remote foot(-only) paths.

 

[LSWR Cavalier]

I'd be in two minds on that one. A section of this route south of Trawsfynydd is already a path, one of the best railway paths to be found, and part of the reason for that is it's *not* particularly well known, nor waymarked as a cycle trail. In all honesty I'd prefer to keep it that way.

Some ex railway cycleways are too busy nowadays, it's hardly a relaxing experience to hear "bing" every few seconds, which is now the typical experience on something like the Monsal Trail.

Agree, 'more cycling/walking' can be a problem. There must be some abandoned routes that were double-track with sufficient space for separate wide cycling and walking lanes, but where?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Agree, 'more cycling/walking' can be a problem. There must be some abandoned routes that were double-track with sufficient space for separate wide cycling and walking lanes, but where?

The Monsal Trail is wide enough to do that but they've chosen not to. Like MK's Redways it works fine shared if people will be considerate enough to avoid walking/cycling across the full width so passing is easily possible.

 

[bramling]

That just feels a bit elitist to me, perhaps a bit of 'I don't want anyone using this route but me'. Which is understandable to some extent, it is nice to have a nice bit of scenery that isn't well used, even I like to find a path/road not heavily used but fun to cycle along. I have a number of such favourites around here.

To not want others to visit and enjoy the same beauty as you do already, that's not good. Yes I understand it must be frustrating, I get frustrated by groups of dog walkers on a sector nearby that seem to get in the way on purpose, or families that take up the whole width of the path. Said frustration usually disappears very quickly, especially when it dawns on me that they are also out for the same purpose as I am. That is, to get out and about in the fresh air and away from the traffic with all the dangers it brings.

Would I try my best to keep a favourite route hidden? I would consider it, no doubt, but not for long as I would also much more strongly think about how much fun it would be to share the route and the experience with others.

There is an extreme amount of natural beauty in the world, and our country is fortunate enough to have a lot of it. We should celebrate this, and share the news about a really nice area to explore with others.

As for the Monsal Trail, yes it is no doubt often busy but is that a bad thing? This clearly shows it is popular, I haven't been myself yet, but it will happen in due course. I am fortunate I get to go in the middle of the week, when the schools and so forth are in session, so I can enjoy it when it is quieter. Not everyone is as blessed as I am with that possibility, so I understand it must be annoying if you're hearing bells every few minutes. My view then is what would you do if it wasn't popular, and well supported, and left to go to ruin as many paths do when not looked after? As it is a popular route, it is no doubt well cared for, which makes for a better experience for everyone. If this was to change, and no-one cared enough to look after it and it was not well used as a result, what would then be your concern? I would say it is likely that you would then be concerned at the state of the route and want it kept in good condition.

I hope you see what I'm saying, that trying to keep your preferred route in North Wales a secret, and it's going well because even when I looked at the North Wales map yesterday I didn't see such a route available, well it's just not good for humanity as a whole. I'd love others to come down and experience my local routes, there's some really nice areas to explore!

So, closed railways I'd like to convert to a cycle route. Despite it being in sparsely populated territory, I'd love to see the old railway formation between New Radnor, Kington, Leominster and Bromyard (even to Worcester actually too) with a cycle route in its place. It would be well used for leisure cycling, not really much at all for commuting and, unfortunately, there's significant changes to the old formation so it could never re-open fully and absolutely never as a railway. A shared-use path would do in some places, such as Kington where the bypass takes over a fair chunk of route. Similar could be done at New Radnor (the terminus of the railway, it was meant to continue west but it never did), the site is now a caravan park. The rest of the route I'm not too sure on these days, I don't know what's happening at Titley Junction now as once upon a time they were looking to build a heritage railway up there.

Other local choices would be Hereford to Hay on Wye. Another sparsely populated route, and the formation I can't comment on as I've forgot some of the details, but no chance of a railway there again. No commuting available as a sensible option, and the route out of Hereford has been redeveloped in multiple places, same in Credenhill.

I can't think of any others right now, I'm actually due to get up in around 5 hours time to go exploring an old railway amongst other things so I'd best get some sleep!

The problem is, these paths simply don't work well once usage passes a certain level, especially where the path is narrow (which many are). Two people can't walk side-by-side, as there will be a constant stream of cyclists wanting to pass, many of whom can be pretty aggressive. Likewise even something simply like stopping to take a photo or doing up a shoelace is likely to lead to being sworn at by a cyclist. Hence why, to be honest, less development and publicity is absolutely not a bad thing. Just one of those facts of life, I don't see it as elitist, those who take the trouble to explore get the rewards.

I'm pretty pro-cycling, but being brutally honest the behaviour of many cyclists on these trails has led me to understand why cyclists in general have such a bad reputation.

 

[Techniquest]

The problem is, these paths simply don't work well once usage passes a certain level, especially where the path is narrow (which many are). Two people can't walk side-by-side, as there will be a constant stream of cyclists wanting to pass, many of whom can be pretty aggressive. Likewise even something simply like stopping to take a photo or doing up a shoelace is likely to lead to being sworn at by a cyclist. Hence why, to be honest, less development and publicity is absolutely not a bad thing. Just one of those facts of life, I don't see it as elitist, those who take the trouble to explore get the rewards.

I'm pretty pro-cycling, but being brutally honest the behaviour of many cyclists on these trails has led me to understand why cyclists in general have such a bad reputation.

I hope you realise, and it sounds like you do, that we are by far and away not all like that! Unfortunately, I too see why many tar all cyclists with the same brush, there are some nutcases out there. Scratch that, too many to count actually. The majority of us are sensible though, and are as considerate as physically possible.

Of course, it does work the other way around, some walkers are very rude, inconsiderate, verbally abusive etc. I do both walking and cycling, so I get the worst of both worlds in places. I know not everyone is like that, so while I get frustrated I usually let it go whoosh over the head soon after.

I'm no saint, there can be no question of that, but I hope you know some of us are there to enjoy the route and the beauty around us, not treating it as if it's the Tour de France!

 

[bramling]

I hope you realise, and it sounds like you do, that we are by far and away not all like that! Unfortunately, I too see why many tar all cyclists with the same brush, there are some nutcases out there. Scratch that, too many to count actually. The majority of us are sensible though, and are as considerate as physically possible.

Of course, it does work the other way around, some walkers are very rude, inconsiderate, verbally abusive etc. I do both walking and cycling, so I get the worst of both worlds in places. I know not everyone is like that, so while I get frustrated I usually let it go whoosh over the head soon after.

I'm no saint, there can be no question of that, but I hope you know some of us are there to enjoy the route and the beauty around us, not treating it as if it's the Tour de France!

To be honest, it isn't even the "roadie" cyclists who are the problem - they tend to come out at quiet times like the evening, and in most cases don't cause problems. In my experience, the absolute worst offenders are the grockle types who turn up (in their car, of course) at 10:00, hire a set of cycles or unload them off the back of their car, and feel that they've a God-given day out where the whole place revolves around their couple of miles up the trail and back. These types are quite distinguishable, you can guarantee the seat will be too low and the tyres under-inflated!

Which takes me back to why it really is nicer to keep these places lower key, quite simply it avoids all this. Those in the know can enjoy them, and those that aren't are none the wiser.

 

[Techniquest]

To be honest, it isn't even the "roadie" cyclists who are the problem - they tend to come out at quiet times like the evening, and in most cases don't cause problems. In my experience, the absolute worst offenders are the grockle types who turn up (in their car, of course) at 10:00, hire a set of cycles or unload them off the back of their car, and feel that they've a God-given day out where the whole place revolves around their couple of miles up the trail and back. These types are quite distinguishable, you can guarantee the seat will be too low and the tyres under-inflated!

Which takes me back to why it really is nicer to keep these places lower key, quite simply it avoids all this. Those in the know can enjoy them, and those that aren't are none the wiser.

That's a valid point, there are some like that, very much self-entitled but not a clue what they're doing.

I have to say you've painted quite a grim picture for when I eventually head up to do the Monsal and Tissington Trails!

 

[Bletchleyite]

I found them absolutely fine but then I'm used to the Redways.

 

[bramling]

That's a valid point, there are some like that, very much self-entitled but not a clue what they're doing.

I have to say you've painted quite a grim picture for when I eventually head up to do the Monsal and Tissington Trails!

They're okay on a weekday providing it isn't school holidays (or, at least, this *was* the case before Covid). But they can be a total nightmare at times.

Quiet as a mouse in the evening, of course, but this isn't always helpful if one wants to take photos.

The other thing which I find utterly infuriating is if you stop to look at something, you can guarantee within seconds you'll hear the squeak of cycle brakes, as a couple of grockles play sheep. Of course, they will have no idea what they're actually looking at, no interest even if they did, and you could fool them by looking at an empty patch of grass.

 

[Techniquest]

I found them absolutely fine but then I'm used to the Redways.

I really must get over to your part of the world some time and do those. I do a lot of riding up and down shared paths in Hereford, one of which in particular is really useful if I'm heading south out of town and avoids some roads which get jammed up as soon as a feather lands on the road.

They're okay on a weekday providing it isn't school holidays (or, at least, this *was* the case before Covid). But they can be a total nightmare at times.

Quiet as a mouse in the evening, of course, but this isn't always helpful if one wants to take photos.

Mental note made on that, my useful days off (for going out exploring etc, my Sundays are focused on important things) each week are currently in the middle of the week so I should be fine.

 

[Train Maniac]

The problem is, these paths simply don't work well once usage passes a certain level, especially where the path is narrow (which many are). Two people can't walk side-by-side, as there will be a constant stream of cyclists wanting to pass, many of whom can be pretty aggressive. Likewise even something simply like stopping to take a photo or doing up a shoelace is likely to lead to being sworn at by a cyclist. Hence why, to be honest, less development and publicity is absolutely not a bad thing. Just one of those facts of life, I don't see it as elitist, those who take the trouble to explore get the rewards.

I'm pretty pro-cycling, but being brutally honest the behaviour of many cyclists on these trails has led me to understand why cyclists in general have such a bad reputation.

It very much works both ways.

To name a few: Dogs on leashes straying across the path, Children (not on leashes, mind you and familes in general who spread themselves out across the whole path, and then completely ignore you even after you give them a polite "Ping Ping'. After 15 minutes of cycling the Avon gorge it starts to rather grate on the nerves, repeatedly stopping and starting, which then leads to the rudeness you have encountered. At the end of the day its sometimes easier cycling along paralell roads.

All that being said, to answer the original question, any disused railway that hasnt been built on should be considered for conversion, promoting healthy living and transport options

 

[30907]

A chunk of it is already fairly walkable. The biggest challenge that I can foresee would be the River Aire near Skipton where the reasonable alternative routes are quite substantial.

You could use Heslaker Lane, then a new path cutting across the Ings to the footbridge on the Skipton to Carleton path (not that I've walked it!).

 

[bramling]

It very much works both ways.

To name a few: Dogs on leashes straying across the path, Children (not on leashes, mind you and familes in general who spread themselves out across the whole path, and then completely ignore you even after you give them a polite "Ping Ping'. After 15 minutes of cycling the Avon gorge it starts to rather grate on the nerves, repeatedly stopping and starting, which then leads to the rudeness you have encountered. At the end of the day its sometimes easier cycling along paralell roads.

This is essentially the point I'm trying to make, namely that these shared paths simply don't work well unless (1) very lightly used, or (2) very wide.

 

[Doctor Fegg]

The Tarka Trail is several times busier than either the Monsal or Tissington, and it's been absolutely fine every time I've used it - whether as a solo touring cyclist or with the (5-70) family in tow.

The most likely scenario for conflict IME is where a route is used for mass commuting as well as both walking and cycling leisure. The Bristol–Bath Railway Path and the Regent's Canal towpath are probably the most obvious examples of this. Sustrans is trialling some new approaches to encourage coexistence on the BBRP.

 

[TheBigD]

It very much works both ways.

To name a few: Dogs on leashes straying across the path, Children (not on leashes, mind you and familes in general who spread themselves out across the whole path, and then completely ignore you even after you give them a polite "Ping Ping'. After 15 minutes of cycling the Avon gorge it starts to rather grate on the nerves, repeatedly stopping and starting, which then leads to the rudeness you have encountered. At the end of the day its sometimes easier cycling along paralell roads.

All that being said, to answer the original question, any disused railway that hasnt been built on should be considered for conversion, promoting healthy living and transport options

Ah, the extendable dog lead. Despised by cyclists and joggers alike!