Coaches With Compartments

[RichmondCommu]

G'day,

Just curious to know which were the last BR coach deigns to be built with corridors? I'm pretty sure that i travelled in mk2 airconditioned first class stock that was fitted with compartments but i can't remember for sure.

Thanks in advance,

Richmond Commuter

 

[colchesterken]

yes we had compartments in the first class only on GEML mk 2 c or d
the last i remember were the 302 307s which were re furbed into walk through the train
in I think mid 70 s

 

[Daimler]

Surely that would be the Class 442s - built in 1988 with compartments for first class passengers (requested by commuters on the South Western). Sadly, the compartments were victims of their recent refurbishment.

EDIT: Just realised 'coach designs' were specified. I really should learn to read posts properly... :roll:

 

[jopsuk]

I take it "Mark 3 Sleepers" doesn't count?

 

[sprinterguy]

Surely that would be the Class 442s - built in 1988 with compartments for first class passengers (requested by commuters on the South Western). Sadly, the compartments were victims of their recent refurbishment.

EDIT: Just realised 'coach designs' were specified. I really should learn to read posts properly... :roll:

I think the 442s have to count as the last built BR compartment stock: Multiple units count as "coaching stock" in my eyes, and the 442s can hold the title by a long shot.

The last built compartment carriages I can find are a build of Mark 2D (Air con) compartment firsts in 1971 (13562-13610) and a corresponding build of Mark 2D BFK vehicles the same year (17139-17172), but there were also plenty of standard class pressure ventilated mark 2s built with compartments in the late sixties.

 

[RichmondCommu]

I take it "Mark 3 Sleepers" doesn't count?

Any thing counts! There are no rules attached to this thread! Good point though, stupidly i'd not considered those!

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Surely that would be the Class 442s - built in 1988 with compartments for first class passengers (requested by commuters on the South Western). Sadly, the compartments were victims of their recent refurbishment.

EDIT: Just realised 'coach designs' were specified. I really should learn to read posts properly... :roll:

Once again, there are no "rules" to this thread so your contribution is most welcome! I was just curious that was all! I'd forgotten all about the 442's although i'd travelled first class in them a few times. I think its incredible that compartment stock was still being built in 1988, especially given the dangers that they pose to lone travellers late at night.

 

[Flamingo]

I think its incredible that compartment stock was still being built in 1988, especially given the dangers that they pose to lone travellers late at night.

Or opportunities if travelling in pairs

 

[WestCoast]

I think its incredible that compartment stock was still being built in 1988, especially given the dangers that they pose to lone travellers late at night.

That hasn't stopped there widespread existence in mainland Europe. Almost all DB InterCity rakes have coaches with compartments in both first and standard class.

 

[RichmondCommu]

That hasn't stopped there widespread existence in mainland Europe. Almost all DB InterCity rakes have coaches with compartments in both first and standard class.

Blimey, i didn't know that! Does that include the ICE stock too? Is that from the public requesting it or "just the way its always been"? I've travelled on ICE services a few times but not in compartment coaches. Thanks for this.

 

[WestCoast]

Blimey, i didn't know that! Does that include the ICE stock too? Is that from the public requesting it or "just the way its always been"? I've travelled on ICE services a few times but not in compartment coaches. Thanks for this.

No some ICEs have a conference room, but it's not a compartment. It's specifically the InterCity stock I'm talking about - they run services marked IC in the timetable and are generally slower than ICEs. They are always popular when I travel on them, the best way to secure one is to pay for a reservation and request it.

 

[RichmondCommu]

No some ICEs have a conference room, but it's not a compartment. It's specifically the InterCity stock I'm talking about - they run services marked IC in the timetable and are generally slower than ICEs. They are always popular when I travel on them, the best way to secure one is to pay for a reservation and request it.

A conference room? Fantastic! Is that a quarter the length of a coach (i'm guessing here).

 

[WestCoast]

A conference room? Fantastic! Is that a quarter the length of a coach (i'm guessing here).

No, it's not quite that impressive, it's literally a group of six seats separated by a glass screen.

Actually the ICEs do have compartments, but only in first class. Here's a first class compartment from the ICE1 with six seats, showing the reservation display:

If you want to see pictures of the various DB coaching stock with compartments and "open-style compartments" this website is interesting - LINK, just click on the different types of stock under "DE" and "Cars".

 

[Helvellyn]

The last built compartment carriages I can find are a build of Mark 2D (Air con) compartment firsts in 1971 (13562-13610) and a corresponding build of Mark 2D BFK vehicles the same year (17139-17172), but there were also plenty of standard class pressure ventilated mark 2s built with compartments in the late sixties.

No Standard Class Mark 2 corridor stock was ever built - it was all BFKs and FKs. Quite a lot of the early Mk 2 FKs were declassified to become SKs though, as were a few BFKs, in the mid 1980s. ScotRail even converted five Mk 2C FKs into CKs!

 

[Daimler]

Once again, there are no "rules" to this thread so your contribution is most welcome! I was just curious that was all! I'd forgotten all about the 442's although i'd travelled first class in them a few times. I think its incredible that compartment stock was still being built in 1988, especially given the dangers that they pose to lone travellers late at night.

Indeed, but it's rather nice to think that BR was so obliging as to produce a design of carriage that had long since 'gone out of fashion' because regular users asked them to!

With regards to safety, I suppose the long-distance routes 442s operated on (and the fact that guards were always on board) meant that it wasn't too much of an issue. For those worried, there was also a small 'open' section of first class, I believe.

I myself have happy memories of skirting the coast near Poole in a first class compartment of a 442 as a small(ish) child...now sadly impossible.

 

[sprinterguy]

No Standard Class Mark 2 corridor stock was ever built - it was all BFKs and FKs. Quite a lot of the early Mk 2 FKs were declassified to become SKs though, as were a few BFKs, in the mid 1980s. ScotRail even converted five Mk 2C FKs into CKs!

Ah, good point: I've got an Ian Allan book from '87 and having looked again, the SK and BSK vehicles are all converts from first class stock.

I believe Scotrail also operated a few (About 6?) mark 3 composite vehicles (non-compartment of course but interesting nonetheless), semi-converted from FO carriages.

 

[theblackwatch]

Or opportunities if travelling in pairs

Or group's if you're into that sort of thing!
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I believe Scotrail also operated a few (About 6?) mark 3 composite vehicles (non-compartment of course but interesting nonetheless), semi-converted from FO carriages.

Yes, these CO vehicles were numbered in the 119xx series, converted from 110xx. On transfer to the LMR some reverted to FO configuration, others were converted to SO. Can't remember hearing people complain about them as they have done so on here with regard to the composite vehicles on EMT's Meridians.

 

[sprinterguy]

Can't remember hearing people complain about them as they have done so on here with regard to the composite vehicles on EMT's Meridians.

I'd thought about that as well: What was the division between first and standard in the mark 3 COs like, for anyone who can remember that far back: Any partition doors?
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Or group's if you're into that sort of thing!

Anywhere up to six people can be accomodated comfortably in a typical mark 1 compartment, which I'm sure would be enough to satisfy anyone's desires

 

[Peter Mugridge]

I'd thought about that as well: What was the division between first and standard in the mark 3 COs like, for anyone who can remember that far back: Any partition doors?

I remember those on the shuttle! Yes, there was a full width partition with a door.

 

[RichmondCommu]

No, it's not quite that impressive, it's literally a group of six seats separated by a glass screen.

Actually the ICEs do have compartments, but only in first class. Here's a first class compartment from the ICE1 with six seats, showing the reservation display:

If you want to see pictures of the various DB coaching stock with compartments and "open-style compartments" this website is interesting - LINK, just click on the different types of stock under "DE" and "Cars".

Thanks for this, i'm amazed! I've only ever travelled standard class on ICE services. Just out interest which services do the ICE1 trains operate?

 

[Wyvern]

I think its incredible that compartment stock was still being built in 1988, especially given the dangers that they pose to lone travellers late at night.

Mr Briggs' Hat: A Sensational Account of Britain's First Railway Murder by Kate Colquhoun

This happened in 1864. Trains continued to have compartments and people still travelled in them.

Great for me back in 1959-60 between Derby and Bristol on a Sunday evening. I could pull the blind down, switch out the light and settle down for a snooze. Even better when they got rid of the "all doors" corridor coaches so nobody opened the door from the platform.

 

[Anne O'Rak]

That compartment posted by WestCoast is just amazing. I wish we had those here.

I guess it just shows how much investment we need in the UK rail system when you see the majority of delapidated old carriages we have to use.

 

[Helvellyn]

The Class 471 units, that were planned by Network SouthEast to replace the 4-CEPs and 4-VEPs on Kent Coast services were going to have First Class compartments too.

 

[Marklund]

Actually the ICEs do have compartments, but only in first class.

ICEs did have compartments in Second Class. Whether they've still got them is another question.

 

[colchesterken]

compartments with a walkway down the side are not what i think of as true compartment coaches
the ones i likes were the ones with a slam door on each side and 6 seats either side
they had them on steam southend trains and a few in the un refurbed 302/307 s
and the surban kings cross and moorgate stock
was great get in there with a few friends and all sorts of things could happen

 

[Greenback]

Yes, that's probably why they were withdrawn. Imagine getting trapped in one of those with a nutter!

 

[WestCoast]

ICEs did have compartments in Second Class. Whether they've still got them is another question.

Unrefurbished ICE1/2 do/did have them, but I don't think there is too many of them left. Later generations from ICE3 were built with open compartments in 2nd class from the beginning.
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Thanks for this, i'm amazed! I've only ever travelled standard class on ICE services. Just out interest which services do the ICE1 trains operate?

Too many to list - there is wiki page somewhere about it! I can look up individual routes.

 

[starrymarkb]

No, it's not quite that impressive, it's literally a group of six seats separated by a glass screen.

Actually the ICEs do have compartments, but only in first class. Here's a first class compartment from the ICE1 with six seats, showing the reservation display:

If you want to see pictures of the various DB coaching stock with compartments and "open-style compartments" this website is interesting - LINK, just click on the different types of stock under "DE" and "Cars".

The ICE1 had them in standard too, though IIRC the ICE2 didn't have them as the coaches were put on a diet! (ICE1 coaches weigh 50-60t!)

 

[WestCoast]

The ICE1 had them in standard too, though IIRC the ICE2 didn't have them as the coaches were put on a diet! (ICE1 coaches weigh 50-60t!)

Yes, the ICE1s did have them in 2nd class pre-refurbishment, after the refurb, which brought the ICE1s up to a modern standard, they were removed.

Thanks for clarifying about the ICE2s, couldn't remember whether they did or not.