Could long term social distancing require a shift in how public transport and motoring is allocated?

[squizzler]

Long term social distancing requires a shift in how public transport and motoring is allocated.

Young and healthy people still using cars need to switch to bicycles, walking and public transport. Anyone old or with weak immune systems (and a valid car licence) still using public transport should utilise the motoring capacity thus liberated.

I feel this would be best achieved by reallocating parking en-mass to disabled, and giving a new category of blue badge to at risk groups.

Essentially such a scheme would totally invert the role of cars within the transport system from the old Clarksonian vision of a means to "get ahead in life" to a more compassionate (and better all round, I say) role as lifeboats for those who have reason for travelling separate to the public, as well as for those whose itinerary and number of accoutrements they need to take prevent them using public networks.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Substantially increasing the price of parking, but making it free for those who are in any of the vulnerable groups or who can prove they work in a role where public transport won't provide for their journey (e.g. NHS workers on shifts), would basically achieve that.

 

[Mintona]

Wait so young people aren’t allowed to drive anymore? Jesus Christ. Might as well raise the driving age limit to 45 at the same time.

 

[squizzler]

Wait so young people aren’t allowed to drive anymore? Jesus Christ. Might as well raise the driving age limit to 45 at the same time.

Now you mention it, that would save more lives from crashing than it would from coronavirus, young drivers being more prone to collisions as they are.

 

[yorkie]

Long term social distancing requires a shift in how public transport and motoring is allocated....

I don't think social distancing will be that long term; it can't be.

I've split this proposal into a new thread, though I'd like to remind anyone that we have numerous other threads (for example please don't use this thread to discuss the 2m vs 1m social distancing proposals, nor face masks please), so if anyone wishes to discuss any of the following topics, do use the relevant thread; a selection can be found below:

• Is it time to relax the 2m social distancing guideline? (WHO guidance is 1m)
• Could mandatory mask-wearing replace social distancing on public transport, thus increasing capacity?
• What are your observations of face coverings wearing on public transport?
• (and many more)

 

[talldave]

Well whilst we're forgetting what lockdown was for and casually not noticing that its objectives have been met we could jump on the "zeroists" bandwagon and keep us all under house arrest until road deaths reach zero as well?

 

[dan5324]

Policies that punish car users in this country Generally go down like a bucket of sick. Which is probably why fuel duty has remained static for as long as it has. As a young and relatively healthy 29 year old, I’ll stick to my car thanks.

 

[Scrotnig]

People have to get to work and thanks to successive governments most people have to travel some distance to get to to their job.

Cycling seven miles to work might (to some) sound appealing at this time of year. Come back to me in December and see how it feels.

 

[anthony263]

Long term social distancing requires a shift in how public transport and motoring is allocated.

Young and healthy people still using cars need to switch to bicycles, walking and public transport. Anyone old or with weak immune systems (and a valid car licence) still using public transport should utilise the motoring capacity thus liberated.

I feel this would be best achieved by reallocating parking en-mass to disabled, and giving a new category of blue badge to at risk groups.

Essentially such a scheme would totally invert the role of cars within the transport system from the old Clarksonian vision of a means to "get ahead in life" to a more compassionate (and better all round, I say) role as lifeboats for those who have reason for travelling separate to the public, as well as for those whose itinerary and number of accoutrements they need to take prevent them using public networks.

Slight problem if the young person is a bus driver and needs a car to get to and from work like myself

 

[computerSaysNo]

Anyone old or with weak immune systems (and a valid car licence) still using public transport should utilise the motoring capacity thus liberated.

How many 70/80/90 year olds who currently get the bus are still fit to drive?

 

[squizzler]

Without getting bogged down by specific examples, as we move into a (hopefully) more compassionate society going forward, the debate about mobility needs to identify who would be best served by different modes, as well as realising the pressing need to retain the 'lockdown' air quality people see now as their entitlement.

Of course various municipalities are not waiting for this debate to take place and are ripping up their carriageways anyhow as discussed in this thread. But, rather than playing a game of musical chairs of limited street and passenger space during the spell of 'social distancing' (yes it is a ghastly term) we would do better to set the ground rules as to who gets the limited number of spaces in the bus and who has to drive.

 

[Scrotnig]

as well as realising the pressing need to retain the 'lockdown' air quality people see now as their entitlement.

Given that we now have a national, state-sanctioned campaign to bully people OFF public transport, that air quality will be worse than before this started within weeks.

 

[Cardiff123]

What about people in the vulnerable/shielding group (like myself) who cannot drive? Am I banned from public transport until there's a vaccine?

Whilst there most definitely needs to be fewer people driving in the long term, to protect people's health and the environment, I doubt even a Labour government would think about putting people into groups and then telling them how they are allowed to travel.

 

[Llanigraham]

Might work in an urban setting, now tell me how it would work in a rural area?

 

[squizzler]

Given that we now have a national, state-sanctioned campaign to bully people OFF public transport, that air quality will be worse than before this started within weeks.

Maybe not, with the more independent municipalities implementing a motoring version of musical chairs where they progressively reduce carriageway and parking provide more space to the green travel.

What about people in the vulnerable/shielding group (like myself) who cannot drive? Am I banned from public transport until there's a vaccine?

Whilst there most definitely needs to be fewer people driving in the long term, to protect people's health and the environment, I doubt even a Labour government would think about putting people into groups and then telling them how they are allowed to travel.

No, of course you would't be banned. I envision that as a democracy the tools at our disposal are more likely to involve nudges by means of public messaging and fiscal incentives. My opinion is, if we as a society are going to be more humane going forward and preserve the air quality without restricting people's freedoms, we need to be more serious about encouraging those who don't need the cars to leave them to those who do. Just as they are in the social distancing phase encouraging people to leave the (what was formerly known as) mass transport to those who need it.

Might work in an urban setting, now tell me how it would work in a rural area?

Why would it work any different?

 

[Scrotnig]

Maybe not, with the more independent municipalities implementing a motoring version of musical chairs where they progressively reduce carriageway and parking provide more space to the green travel.

That won't work. All they seem to be doing is making space for cycling. I'm sorry but for the vast majority, cycling is not an alternative to either the car or public transport. Most people live too far away, and plus it's a nice idea in the height of summer, let's see how many keep it up in howling gales and driving rain in the winter.

My council have put up electronic signs everywhere saying "warning: more people cycling" - which is nonsense, hardly anybody is.

 

[squizzler]

I was wondering if there is merit in straightening out bus routes that currently deviate into housing. I am familiar with rural routes where the bus might depart from the highway into villages. Often these excursions are totally fruitless with no business served but costing several minutes.

With the elderly discouraged from travelling, there is less need for the bus to go to the doorstep of those with less mobility. Straighter routes will be faster, reducing exposure time on the bus, and attract new business from the fit who can still travel at will. It will be more like a railway in that regard: you go to the route rather than expect the route to come into your housing zone.

 

[westv]

Are the elderly being discouraged from travelling?

 

[al78]

That won't work. All they seem to be doing is making space for cycling. I'm sorry but for the vast majority, cycling is not an alternative to either the car or public transport. Most people live too far away, and plus it's a nice idea in the height of summer, let's see how many keep it up in howling gales and driving rain in the winter.

I managed this, a 19 mile round trip to work with hills during the stormy 2013/14 winter. My conclusion is you are right, expecting all but the most enthusiastic cyclists to regularly use a bicycle for utility transport in such conditions is a fantasy.

Stormy periods are not the worst weather conditions for cycling. I found the extreme cold/snowy spells like December 2010 far worse, because of the snow that stayed on the grouind and was compacted into an inch of ice in places, and many drivers were struggling on the minor roads which don't get treated. No-one is confidently cycling it that without studded tyres.

 

[al78]

Long term social distancing requires a shift in how public transport and motoring is allocated.

Young and healthy people still using cars need to switch to bicycles, walking and public transport. Anyone old or with weak immune systems (and a valid car licence) still using public transport should utilise the motoring capacity thus liberated.

I feel this would be best achieved by reallocating parking en-mass to disabled, and giving a new category of blue badge to at risk groups.

Essentially such a scheme would totally invert the role of cars within the transport system from the old Clarksonian vision of a means to "get ahead in life" to a more compassionate (and better all round, I say) role as lifeboats for those who have reason for travelling separate to the public, as well as for those whose itinerary and number of accoutrements they need to take prevent them using public networks.

The young and healthy people may need to make a journey by car if they have a heavy/bulky load to carry.

 

[Belperpete]

I don't think social distancing will be that long term; it can't be.

Agreed, social distancing is purely a short-term measure. Places that have got the virus under control no longer require social distancing. As happened with SARS, for which there is still no vaccine.

 

[Huntergreed]

Agreed, social distancing is purely a short-term measure. Places that have got the virus under control no longer require social distancing. As happened with SARS, for which there is still no vaccine.

Exactly.

Social distancing cannot and must not continue beyond September, at the expense of thousands of livelihoods, and potentially lives lost to mental wellbeing. Our society isn’t built for social distancing and, no matter how hard we try, we can’t run a working, economically sustainable society with it in place.

 

[Islineclear3_1]

Long term social distancing requires a shift in how public transport and motoring is allocated.

Young and healthy people still using cars need to switch to bicycles, walking and public transport. Anyone old or with weak immune systems (and a valid car licence) still using public transport should utilise the motoring capacity thus liberated.

And how do you propose using the bus in London when you've waited for two or three and they all have "Bus Full" because it has the "maximum capacity" of 10 passengers for a single decker and 20 passengers for a double decker?

 

[DB]

Young and healthy people still using cars need to switch to bicycles, walking and public transport. Anyone old or with weak immune systems (and a valid car licence) still using public transport should utilise the motoring capacity thus liberated.

Just not going to happen.

At our work sites, I can (and do) walk to one of them. The others are too far to walk or cycle (as in over 40 miles away). Up until now, I have been using trains in most cases, occasionally picking up a pool car where it's the only option. The way this situation has been handled has resulted in my view on public transport changing - the hostile messaging and over-the-top restrictions mean that I simply don't want to use it any more. Similar will apply to many people - this situation and how it has been mishandled has set back any aims to reduce car use by years, if not decades.

You also miss the point that many older people will be retired, so will have less need to travel and not have to be at work for a specific time - unlike most younger people. So what will the younger people do do? Wait for a bus which takes twice as long, and might refuse to allow them on because it's "full" (in reality, less than half full), or just drive? Not difficult to guess, is it?

The current situation is unworkable, and the longer it carries on the more long-term damage will be done to the concept of public transport.