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Cross Country Cancellations - Emergency Timetable

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duffield

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Hate to break it to you, but it won't.

Just look at Northern at how fully nationalised makes no difference
Break what to me? That's literally what I was saying: "not because that would immediately fix the problems", that there *is* no quick fix, but even if things just stay as they are, at least if XC is nationalised ASAP taxpayers' and fare-payers' money won't be going to waste paying a private company to keep the services crawling along at the current unacceptably poor level.

As for Northern being "nationalised", it was done as an absolute last resort by a government wedded to the notion of a privatised railway. The whole setup revolved around the state being literally the "operator of last resort", and being temporary until the franchise was re-let, so there was no incentive whatsoever for OLR to innovate or improve.

Being nationalised by a government committed to public ownership of the railways cannot reasonably be assumed to be equivalent, so Northern's case should not be regarded as any sort of precedent for forthcoming nationalisations.
 
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RailUK Forums

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The new guaranteed rest day should help sort the Driver shortages out! How the DFT will view multiple Drivers sat spare on £600 may be interesting.
 

Goldfish62

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Break what to me? That's literally what I was saying: "not because that would immediately fix the problems", that there *is* no quick fix, but even if things just stay as they are, at least if XC is nationalised ASAP taxpayers' and fare-payers' money won't be going to waste paying a private company to keep the services crawling along at the current unacceptably poor level.

As for Northern being "nationalised", it was done as an absolute last resort by a government wedded to the notion of a privatised railway. The whole setup revolved around the state being literally the "operator of last resort", and being temporary until the franchise was re-let, so there was no incentive whatsoever for OLR to innovate or improve.

Being nationalised by a government committed to public ownership of the railways cannot reasonably be assumed to be equivalent, so Northern's case should not be regarded as any sort of precedent for forthcoming nationalisations.
And I imagine the last government was only too content to let Northern fester so they could say that nationalisation doesn't work.

I agree that XC should be the first to come into public ownership. Reason being that everyone will be watching it like a hawk so there will be huge pressure to sort out the current s**t-show in order to prove that "nationalisation" works. I avidly avoid XC even though it provides very convenient links for me. I just want it sorted ASAP.
 

YorksLad12

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And I imagine the last government was only too content to let Northern fester so they could say that nationalisation doesn't work.

I agree that XC should be the first to come into public ownership. Reason being that everyone will be watching it like a hawk so there will be huge pressure to sort out the current s**t-show in order to prove that "nationalisation" works. I avidly avoid XC even though it provides very convenient links for me. I just want it sorted ASAP.
I think it should be the last, for the same reason you've given. Start with the ones that work, lull people into thinking it's a good thing, then try the basket cases.
 

Trainman40083

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Hate to break it to you, but it won't.

Just look at Northern at how fully nationalised makes no difference
Exactly. Maybe the same will apply to other TOCs. They need to identify and fix the real problems. But then with Northern, you have such a mix of slow, semi fast, fast and freight services all fighting for the same space
 

Jimini

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I’m booked on the 1726 from Coventry to Reading later, and the 1626 is cancelled. That’s going to be cosy then (and of course, only a single Voyager as usual)!
 

duffield

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That wouldn't really add that many more seats. It's not as if 1st Class is normally quiet on XC.
Yes, there might be a couple of no-shows in 1st on that service but otherwise it'll probably be full. What with the galley at one end and the accessible toilet and wheelchair space at the other, converting the 1st coach to standard would only gain about 10-12 seats by my reckoning.

Of course it might relieve the overcrowding by more than the number of seats created - people who currently travel in 1st to avoid the often hellish conditions in standard would probably not downgrade to standard if no first was available, instead they'd use a different route or drive.
 
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Goldfish62

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Of course it might relieve the overcrowding by more than the number of seats created - people who currently travel in 1st to avoid the often hellish conditions in standard would probably not downgrade to standard if no first was available, instead they'd use a different route or drive.
Excellent point, and that's probably why 1st is so often full despite the eye-watering fares.
 

Lewisham2221

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Not just the seats, having the additional standing space, whilst far from ideal, would make things slightly more comfortable/allow more people to board*

(* Delete as appropriate)
 

Trainman40083

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Not just the seats, having the additional standing space, whilst far from ideal, would make things slightly more comfortable/allow more people to board*

(* Delete as appropriate)
Certainly no fun, standing opposite the toilet door. Worse on a hot day with lack of Aircon.
 

Jimini

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Just departed 10 mins late, and as expected it’s packed to the rafters and left people behind at Coventry. Plenty of disgruntled people heading the other way as the northbound 1730 is terminating short at New Street instead of Manchester.
 

cslusarc

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Doesn't anyone else think that there might be another "Emergency Timetable" at XC between Epiphany (Jan 6th) and Ash Wednesday (March 5th) to further more staff training?
 

XC victim

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Doesn't anyone else think that there might be another "Emergency Timetable" at XC between Epiphany (Jan 6th) and Ash Wednesday (March 5th) to further more staff training?
Has there been any improvement to services since the last “Emergency Timetable “? Did CrossCountry achieve anything?
 

occone

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They can barely keep the lights on in this coach - it feels very metaphorical.

Lots of other services today have been cancelled but this one is at least running even if we are in comparative gloom with no down lights reading lights or luggage rack lights working.
 

GoneSouth

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Is this the worst day so far for XC out of Cardiff?

1048 Nottingham full cancellation
1145 Nottingham full cancellation
1245 Nottingham cancelled CDF-BHM
1345 Nottingham cancelled BHM-NOT
1445 Nottingham cancelled BHM-NOT
1545 Nottingham ran full route
1645 Nottingham full cancellation
1745 Nottingham cancelled CDF-BHM
1845 Nottingham full cancellation
1945 Leicester cancelled CDF-BHM
2045 Birmingham ran full route

That’s a grand total of:

1(ONE) complete Cardiff to Nottingham service today out of a possible 9
4(FOUR) Cardiff to Birminham services out of a possible 11
4(FOUR) Fully cancelled services out of a possible 11
5(FIVE) partially cancelled services out of a possible 11

Which all means just 2 out of 11 services ran as advertised today.

I believe the modern term for such a showing would be ‘A complete sh** show’

What a mess!
 

duffield

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Is this the worst day so far for XC out of Cardiff?

1048 Nottingham full cancellation
1145 Nottingham full cancellation
1245 Nottingham cancelled CDF-BHM
1345 Nottingham cancelled BHM-NOT
1445 Nottingham cancelled BHM-NOT
1545 Nottingham ran full route
1645 Nottingham full cancellation
1745 Nottingham cancelled CDF-BHM
1845 Nottingham full cancellation
1945 Leicester cancelled CDF-BHM
2045 Birmingham ran full route

That’s a grand total of:

1(ONE) complete Cardiff to Nottingham service today out of a possible 9
4(FOUR) Cardiff to Birminham services out of a possible 11
4(FOUR) Fully cancelled services out of a possible 11
5(FIVE) partially cancelled services out of a possible 11

Which all means just 2 out of 11 services ran as advertised today.

I believe the modern term for such a showing would be ‘A complete sh** show’

What a mess!
The general impression I get is since the emergency timetable ended the service is both worse than during the emergency timetable and and worse than it was in the period before, which the emergency timetable was introduced to address.

What's happened, have they trained 10 new drivers but had 20 old ones retire during the same period? o_O
 

A S Leib

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Of the 150 CrossCountry services at Birmingham New Street today, around eighty were delayed by over 15 minutes or wholly or partially cancelled.
 

Mugby

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On Saturday evening the 1627 Plymouth to Leeds service was terminated at Derby, all passengers turfed off and told to use other services to travel further north.
I did see the set depart north from Derby just after 2100 so it probably ran as empty stock to Leeds.
 

Jimini

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This doesn't sound like fun:


Punches thrown and staff assaulted as 'worst journey ever' leaves train looking like a blood bath​

The train had to stop at Tiverton Parkway for police to intervene​

Football fans and other train passengers returning to Devon and Cornwall from Bristol have described their "worst train journey ever".

Hundreds of fans crammed on to trains home following Plymouth Argyle 's 0-4 defeat to Bristol City on Saturday and have described incidents of overcrowding and even a fight breaking out, which caused services to be disrupted and delayed.

One CrossCountry service which departed Bristol at 6.45pm was delayed for more than one hour when it was forced to stop at Tiverton Parkway so police and paramedics could deal with the incidents. CrossCountry says a passenger lashed out and seriously assaulted their train manager, which is why British Transport Police had to be called in at Tiverton.

One Argyle supporter said he had travelled up to Bristol with some mates to make a day out of it. The 40-year-old, who works in retail, said the journey up country was incident free.

However when it came to making his way home, he said the experience is not one he wants to repeat in a hurry. The Argyle fan, who only wanted to be known as Stuart, said: "We were packed like sardines on that train. All four carriages on the train were full.

"The whole train was stuffed to the rafters with passengers. In all honesty it was the worst train journey I've had in my life."


Stuart said that he'd booked a seat in first class in the hope it'd be less crowded on the way back but could not even reach his carriage because of the hordes of passengers everywhere. "I tried to get to my seat but one of the assistants just told me to go anywhere as it was too busy.

"It was back to back and front to front in the carriageways. You couldn't go anywhere. With hundreds of fans onboard you can imagine how hot it got in there.

"It was sweltering. There were families too who'd gone up to Bristol for some shopping. It was horrendous. I don't think CrossCountry had really planned for it."

Stuart said that a fight broke out as tempers flared and police and paramedics had to intervene. As a result the service stopped at Tiverton Parkway and people were asked to get off.

Trainline said the disturbance was first reported at around 8.32pm. Stuart said one person had been punching people on board including fellow passengers and staff, and reported that he saw blood on the floor of the carriage.

Stuart said: "There were people drinking, vaping on board. There was no control.

"I have asked for a refund because I wasn't able to have the seat I paid for. It was just chaos.

"In the end I got off at Newton Abbot and got my partner to come and pick me up. I just couldn't stomach to stay on that train."

Another passenger affected by the delays told DevonLive: "Train disruption at Tiverton Parkway tonight. British transport police have been called to sort out a large disturbance on a service to Plymouth.

"All trains west are backing up behind the incident train."

National Rail confirmed that the incident was cleared at Tiverton after about an hour and the journey resumed with services from CrossCountry and GWR to Plymouth and into Cornwall delayed throughout the evening.

A taxi driver who was parked outside Tiverton Parkway at the time of the incident said she was dropping off a passenger who was bound for London. She said: "My passenger was really worried she might not make it because of it. There was a lot going on outside the station.

"The police were there. An ambulance was there.

"I spoke to one of the Argyle fans who said to me a fight had broken out on board the train. His words to me were 'it was a blood bath'."

At the time of the incident Trainline said: "CrossCountry between Edinburgh and Plymouth and also between Bristol Temple Meads and Paington were affected. Great Western Railway between London Paddington and Exeter St Davids / Plymouth / Penzance, between Cardiff Central and Exeter St Davids, and also between Bristol Temple Meads and Exeter Central, have also been affected.

"There was some disruption caused by passengers causing a disturbance on a train at Tiverton Parkway which has now ended."
Steve Hopkinson, CrossCountry’s service delivery director, said: "We're sorry to those affected by disruption this weekend due to train crew constraints, which has lead to short notice changes and cancellations including on our routes in the South West.

“However, harassment and assault of our onboard colleagues - working tirelessly to get people where they want to be - is unacceptable and will not be tolerated. We work with the British Transport Police to ensure that anybody engaging in violent behaviour on the rail network is prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.”

British Transport Police has been contacted for comment.
 

Harpo

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duffield

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Meanwhile, today on journey check we have just one cancellation and four truncations "due to driver shortage", only two of them on the Birmingham/Cheltenham/Cardiff route, so I suppose if that's as bad as it gets, it's what passes for a good day
 

geoffk

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Thoughts to the train manager and I hope they make a good recovery. Nobody goes to work to be assaulted.
While none of us on this Forum would condone this behaviour, the trouble resulted from the inadequacy of a four-car Voyager to cope with regular Saturday numbers plus football fans.
 

Mugby

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There are no trains at all out of Wigan Wallgate on New Year's Day, all bustitution. Is this because of engineering work or because Northern anticipate not being able to crew any trains?

There are no trains out of Wigan North Western on NYD either but why should that affect the Wallgate services?
 
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