Crowd Management at Liverpool Lime Street after Parade

[Typewind]

Hi everyone,

Just wondering if anyone knows what’s happening at Liverpool Lime Street station this evening. There are thousands of people queueing outside in the rain, and no one is being allowed inside the station.

It’s quite chaotic, especially following such a large public event that brought so many people into the city. If anyone has any information or context about the situation, I’d really appreciate it. It seems surprising that there wouldn’t be a clear plan in place for managing the crowd after an event of this scale.

Thanks in advance for any insights.

---
Edit: I have posted a similar question in 2019 (I'm a Liverpool supporter obviously), and sadly, the situation went worse 6 years later.

Extra service for special events (like Liverpool FC parade)?

Last Sunday (2nd June, 2019) numerous fans came back to Liverpool for the UCL champion parade. When I rush to Liverpool Lime Street at 8pm, there were thousands of passengers (I guess 20,000 ish) outside the station and not allowed to enter due to safety issue. I haven't catch-up my train to...

www.railforums.co.uk

 

[Bevan Price]

Hi everyone,

Just wondering if anyone knows what’s happening at Liverpool Lime Street station this evening. There are thousands of people queueing outside in the rain, and no one is being allowed inside the station.

It’s quite chaotic, especially following such a large public event that brought so many people into the city. If anyone has any information or context about the situation, I’d really appreciate it. It seems surprising that there wouldn’t be a clear plan in place for managing the crowd after an event of this scale.

Thanks in advance for any insights.

The emergency services are probably more concerned about the serious event in Water Street (car driven into crowds)

 

[Typewind]

The emergency services are probably more concerned about the serious event in Water Street (car driven into crowds)

Agreed. I assume that could be one of the reasons of closing the station.

 

[bunnahabhain]

Its the usual event plan for Lime Street, queuing in the car park/taxi rank on the P10 side of the station, that's the only entrance you'll be able to enter the station.

 

[Crossover]

Its the usual event plan for Lime Street, queuing in the car park/taxi rank on the P10 side of the station, that's the only entrance you'll be able to enter the station.

I’m not sure if Lime St is completely closed?

 

[bunnahabhain]

I’m not sure if Lime St is completely closed?

It isn't that I'm aware of, but access is heavily restricted to just the single entrance point on Skelhorne Street, adjacent to P10.

 

[RHolmes]

I’m not sure if Lime St is completely closed?

There has been partial closures of the station to manage crowding indoors, on the platforms and also to prevent crush-loading of services. (Just like how London Underground manage stations like Oxford Circus in the peak)

However the station is fully operational, trains continue to depart as normal albeit with delays.

 

[Crossover]

It isn't that I'm aware of, but access is heavily restricted to just the single entrance point on Skelhorne Street, adjacent to P10.

There has been partial closures of the station to manage crowding indoors, on the platforms and also to prevent crush-loading of services. (Just like how London Underground manage stations like Oxford Circus in the peak)

However the station is fully operational, trains continue to depart as normal albeit with delays.

Thanks both - I stand corrected. Just seen posts elsewhere about people struggling to get out of Liverpool and thought it was related to the other police incident, but it seems not

 

[RHolmes]

Thanks both - I stand corrected. Just seen posts elsewhere about people struggling to get out of Liverpool and thought it was related to the other police incident, but it seems not

The struggle to leave the city is more to do with the fact huge numbers of people are trying to attempt to leave the city at roughly the exact same time (post-parade) and the demand for public transport is far outweighing the available service provision.

Local buses around the city were also struggling with long delays and bunching despite additional services operating too.

The police incident you have alluded to also wouldn’t have helped matters as people would be more likely to cut their visit short and want to return home sooner rather than later

 

[Lampshade]

I was there, complete operational failure by the station staff, occasion too big for them maybe?

 

[AlterEgo]

I was there, complete operational failure by the station staff, occasion too big for them maybe?

The city has one very large and successful football club, they will have dealt with many parades and events before.

 

[Lampshade]

The city has one very large and successful football club, they will have dealt with many parades and events before.

They clearly forgot how to on this occasion, it was an utter shambles at Lime Street.

 

[Horizon22]

I was there, complete operational failure by the station staff, occasion too big for them maybe?

No it will be standard station crowd control. No passenger service in the country copes with an influx of tens of thousands late at night and to prevent dangerous crushes, people are moved into stations at a steady rate.

They clearly forgot how to on this occasion, it was an utter shambles at Lime Street.

In your opinion.

 

[bunnahabhain]

They clearly forgot how to on this occasion, it was an utter shambles at Lime Street.

What they're doing is putting safety first. Its a tried and tested plan that works to get people home, and get them there safely. Traincrew were advised their trains would be held until full and then sent, regardless of whether that would delay the service departing.

 

[enginedin]

The city has one very large and successful football club,

it also has LFC.

snigger snigger

(and yes, I'm an Evertonian )

 

[Energy]

I was there, complete operational failure by the station staff, occasion too big for them maybe?

It's worth noting that this bank holiday weekend has had Radio 1 Big Weekend, the Parade, and a few other smaller events. It's been very busy.

 

[Robbouk]

It was chaos, I was told the station was closed and ended up in a taxi back to Nottingham. However other people I know were able to get in and get the train. The poor security person I spoke to said she was getting told loads of conflicting information.

 

[Red Devil]

No it will be standard station crowd control. No passenger service in the country copes with an influx of tens of thousands late at night and to prevent dangerous crushes, people are moved into stations at a steady rate.



In your opinion.

On this occasion their opinion is right. Complete shambles. I know as I work there

 

[Kite159]

.

They clearly forgot how to on this occasion, it was an utter shambles at Lime Street.

Well it has been a good number of years since Liverpool won the league title and were able to celebrate it without Covid restrictions

 

[TUC]

What they're doing is putting safety first. Its a tried and tested plan that works to get people home, and get them there safely. Traincrew were advised their trains would be held until full and then sent, regardless of whether that would delay the service departing.

What about longer distance services. Were they all held?

 

[norbitonflyer]

How do these measures work with Advance tickets, if you are denied access to the station until after the only train on which your ticket is valid has left.

 

[DarloRich]

How do these measures work with Advance tickets, if you are denied access to the station until after the only train on which your ticket is valid has left.

Obviously a practical approach will be taken

 

[Bletchleyite]

Obviously a practical approach will be taken

WMT if I recall said any ticket for yesterday from Liverpool is valid until 1200 today.

 

[TUC]

WMT if I recall said any ticket for yesterday from Liverpool is valid until 1200 today.

That doesn't sound sufficient though. If you had a ticket and a reservation for a service last night, were in the queue outside the station, and those in front of you in the queue without these were allowed to board and the train departed because it was full, that doesn't sound very satisfactory.

 

[Energy]

That doesn't sound sufficient though. If you had a ticket and a reservation for a service last night, were in the queue outside the station, and those in front of you in the queue without these were allowed to board and the train departed because it was full, that doesn't sound very satisfactory.

WMT/LNWR doesn't offer seat reservations.

Even if they did, it isn't practical to honour them as it would significantly slow operations if you ensured that everyone had the correct seat rather than people taking any seat.

 

[TUC]

WMT/LNWR doesn't offer seat reservations.

Even if they did, it isn't practical to honour them as it would significantly slow operations if you ensured that everyone had the correct seat rather than people taking any seat.

I’m talking generally about the services at Lime Street last night, not just WMT/LNWR.

I wasn’t meaning ensuring people were occupying their correct seat. I mean that passengers would have a reasonable expectation if they had a reservation for a given service, they would be a greater priority than others in the queue, and especially if it was the final service of the day to their destination.

 

[sjm77]

I WAS AT LIVERPOOL LIME STREET

We arrived ~18:00 expecting a queue which there was, fine.

We queued with thousands of others on the steps to the main entrance occasionally inching forward. There were ZERO staff, announcements, or signage that only the side (Skelhorne Street?) entrance was to be used. We slowly inched our way up the steps to see that the shutters were down but again no signage or instruction. I saw a Northern train pull in displaying a Blackpool North destination (according to real time trains the delayed 18:39 departure from platform 8). Before it left I witnessed around 50 people run in from the side entrance onto the platform. This train could have taken hundreds more seated, let alone standing. I also saw that the departure board was ticking over regularly with the concourse empty. We came to the conclusion that trains were leaving empty whilst thousands were trapped outside the station. At this point there was a great sense of uneasiness, thoughts of Hillsborough, and the road between Lime Street and St.George’s hall blocked by people trying to access Lime Street. Meanwhile lots of fresh air was regularly departing from the platforms.

With some local knowledge we elected to walk 30 minutes to Edge Hill. This was a risk because if trains were departing Lime Street full it would have been impossible to board. Our first sight on arrival was to witness a 6 car TPEx 185 run through completely empty (from real time trains the 19:27 from Liverpool to Manchester Victoria), an additional crowd buster provided by TPEx to their credit and I do not say that very often. As trains only run through Edge Hill at 30 mph it is easy to see who is onboard. This train could have taken upto 1,000 people in a crowded loading, but this ‘crowd buster’ left empty with thousands kettled outside of Lime Street instead. A TOTAL AND ABJECT FAILURE.

We were able to join the stopper to Manchester Oxford Road, a 4 car C156. It arrived with ~100 seats taken (out of 300), nobody standing. We were not the only ones to have made the trek to Edge Hill where the train filled up, it was comfortably full but could have taken more given the circumstances

I appreciate that Merseyside Police were dealing with a suspected terrorist incident on Water Street at the time (thankfully not so), but this would not have effected the resources on BTP or Network Rail.

If you were actually at the station and have different opinions to me then that is fine, I would be interested to hear them of course.

 

[Lampshade]

The above is my experience as well, none of us had any mobile data, there was no communication from station staff, people at the glass doors were putting their phones up to the door with notes to the staff begging them to liaise with police (even before the other incident) to establish some sort of order - to which they simply shrugged.

 

[VItraveller]

just another reason to completely avoid public transport to and from major sporting events, first with Chiltern not running any services to Wembley Stadium and now this.
Yes, you’ll have to pay more for parking and be stuck in traffick, but at least you’ll be warm and comfortable while you wait.

 

[Bletchleyite]

The above is my experience as well, none of us had any mobile data, there was no communication from station staff, people at the glass doors were putting their phones up to the door with notes to the staff begging them to liaise with police (even before the other incident) to establish some sort of order - to which they simply shrugged.

Which TOC provides the main staff at Lime St these days? I know Avanti/Virgin has form at Preston for terrible management of crowds and disruption. I still haven't forgiven them for the debacle when that bridge washed away near Carlisle years back, and thoroughly enjoyed stinging them for hundreds of quid's worth of Delay Repay over it.

just another reason to completely avoid public transport to and from major sporting events, first with Chiltern not running any services to Wembley Stadium and now this.
Yes, you’ll have to pay more for parking and be stuck in traffick, but at least you’ll be warm and comfortable while you wait.

I can't imagine the roads and parking having been much fun. And if you park somewhere outside you're back to trying to get on a train.