Delay Repay - 3 different operators, multiple tickets (advanced singles and anytime returns)

[Breamish]

Hello all. I've recently starting taking the train much more often and the pricing of tickets completely baffles me (but that's for a separate post).

Essentially, I travel from Glasgow to Bolton, sometimes over two days, sometimes there and back in one day. My specific route is from Anniesland (within Glasgow) to Glasgow Central (Scotrail); from Glasgow Central to Preston (Avanti) and finally Preston to Bolton (Northern). Generally, I've found the cheapest way (by some margin) is to buy these as 3 separate tickets each way (unless I'm going there and back in a day, in which case I usually get Anniesland to Glasgow Central and Bolton to Preston as anytime return tickets).

So in summary I get:

1. Anniesland to Glasgow: Anytime return (this is the same price as a single)
2. Glasgow to Preston: Advanced Single
3. Preston to Bolton: Advanced Single (or Anytime Single (if similar price as advanced), or Anytime Return (if doing it in one day)

Today, I've done a there and back. My 6:30am Glasgow to Preston train was cancelled and we were put on the next service (7:36am, I believe). This was also delayed en route, so I got to Preston at 11am instead of 8:59am as I would have had the 6:30am ran and been on time. As a result, I got to Bolton (my final destination) at 11:39am (instead of 9:34am had all gone to plan). Tonight, my Bolton to Preston train was delayed, and arrived into Preston at 19:26 instead of 19:00, but that's enough time to make the 19:42 to Glasgow, which is ALSO delayed. I'm on that train now and currently scheduled to get into Central 27 minutes late.

My question is, how on earth do I do my Delay Repay in this case? Assuming this train does arrive 27 minutes late.

Thanks for any help. I'll write up a post at some stage to see if anyone can explain the bizarre pricing of this particular route.

 

[Gaelan]

I believe you submit two claims, for the trip there and the trip back. Each claim goes to the first operator that meaningfully delayed you, so the outbound claim goes to Avanti and the inbound claim goes to Northern.

Some operators have an explicit option to claim for split tickets; if not, just submit a picture of all the tickets together and fill in the "ticket number" field with 00000 or similar.

Don't be surprised if your claim gets rejected on your first attempt, and you need to appeal; in my experience, calling the train company on the phone (the helpful people are usually behind whichever option has the word "complaint" in it) works wonders.

 

[Breamish]

I believe you submit two claims, for the trip there and the trip back. Each claim goes to the first operator that meaningfully delayed you, so the outbound claim goes to Avanti and the inbound claim goes to Northern.

Some operators have an explicit option to claim for split tickets; if not, just submit a picture of all the tickets together and fill in the "ticket number" field with 00000 or similar.

Don't be surprised if your claim gets rejected on your first attempt, and you need to appeal; in my experience, calling the train company on the phone (the helpful people are usually behind whichever option has the word "complaint" in it) works wonders.

Thanks for this. Does the fact that my particular tickets today are as below confuse things?

• Advanced Single: Glasgow to Preston
• Anytime Return: Preston to Bolton
• Advanced Single: Preston to Glasgow

I think I'm due a 100% refund for the way down (over 120 mins late), but that's half of the return. And on the way back up, the Bolton to Preston return leg was delayed, but because the Preston to Glasgow one is too, I made it? Sorry, I'm tired and therefore probably not explaining this well at all.

 

[JBuchananGB]

For your outward journey today you claim from Avanti for the whole journey from Anniesland to Bolton. Their process at http://delayrepay.avantiwestcoast.co.uk asks for your intended itinerary, and if more than one ticket was used for the journey, you have to enter each of them. I have used the Avanti DR system, admittedly not with split tickets.
Your return journey, I would argue against a claim to Northern because you made a successful connection to your intended train at Preston. I would advise a claim against Avanti, based on your actual eventual arrival at Anniesland. If Avanti don't like it they might pass it over to Northern. As I write your train is expected into Glasgow P4 at 22.35, with the departure to Anniesland at 22.40 from P17. Best of luck with that.

 

[yorkie]

I believe you submit two claims, for the trip there and the trip back. Each claim goes to the first operator that meaningfully delayed you, so the outbound claim goes to Avanti and the inbound claim goes to Northern.

If you bought it as one journey from our website, we would have issued one PDF and one itinerary which can result in such claims, and the legitimately of the itinerary, being easier to argue.

If you bought each ticket separately and have no through itinerary issued in conjunction with the purchase, but it's a valid itinerary and valid combination you put together yourself, your claim is no less valid. It's just you may find it harder to argue your case and you would be on your own in the event of a dispute.

 

[MrJeeves]

I think I'm due a 100% refund for the way down (over 120 mins late), but that's half of the return.

Advance tickets count as singles for the purpose of the railway. If you're delayed for 60 mins, you're due 100% of a single ticket or 50% of a return.

You should supply all tickets for your journey. Not all delay repay websites are good at this. Some will ask if you've used multiple tickets and get you to upload each separately. Others won't. For the latter, you should photograph all tickets together (or combine them into one image for a screenshot), them upload that one image with the total cost where it asks for the price and 00000 for a ticket number (or some other obvious placeholder).

You're not allowed to claim more than the cost of your tickets.

Your 120m+ delay will give you the full cost of the first return, the advance Avanti ticket, and the last ticket you used.

The 27m claim will give you 12.5% of the return, 25% of the Avanti advance, and 12.5%/25% of the last depending on if it's a return or single appropriately.

The whole thing is a complex mess, and I'm not surprised if you struggle to understand it the first time around (or if one of the TOCs rejects your claim or passes it on to a TOC that shouldn't be the one to pay out).

• Advanced Single: Glasgow to Preston
• Anytime Return: Preston to Bolton
• Advanced Single: Preston to Glasgow

I'm not sure why you haven't mentioned your ticket to Anniesland above, but it's important you claim for the full journey you made to get what you're entitled to.

The most important part of delay repay is that your itinerary meets the minimum connection times needed. If it doesn't, your claim could be rejected as you don't technically have a valid through journey from A to B.

As Yorkie says above, that's where the forum's site comes in rather useful.

 

[Gaelan]

Thanks for this. Does the fact that my particular tickets today are as below confuse things?

In principle, it's not an issue at all; the return tickets just get half the refund otherwise due.

It's likely you'll end up dealing with confused staff, however, judging by how a similar claim (with LNER) went for me a few weeks ago.

 

[Breamish]

Advance tickets count as singles for the purpose of the railway. If you're delayed for 60 mins, you're due 100% of a single ticket or 50% of a return.

You should supply all tickets for your journey. Not all delay repay websites are good at this. Some will ask if you've used multiple tickets and get you to upload each separately. Others won't. For the latter, you should photograph all tickets together (or combine them into one image for a screenshot), them upload that one image with the total cost where it asks for the price and 00000 for a ticket number (or some other obvious placeholder).

You're not allowed to claim more than the cost of your tickets.

Your 120m+ delay will give you the full cost of the first return, the advance Avanti ticket, and the last ticket you used.

The 27m claim will give you 12.5% of the return, 25% of the Avanti advance, and 12.5%/25% of the last depending on if it's a return or single appropriately.

The whole thing is a complex mess, and I'm not surprised if you struggle to understand it the first time around (or if one of the TOCs rejects your claim or passes it on to a TOC that shouldn't be the one to pay out).


I'm not sure why you haven't mentioned your ticket to Anniesland above, but it's important you claim for the full journey you made to get what you're entitled to.

The most important part of delay repay is that your itinerary meets the minimum connection times needed. If it doesn't, your claim could be rejected as you don't technically have a valid through journey from A to B.

As Yorkie says above, that's where the forum's site comes in rather useful.

Thanks very much for all this - you’re absolutely correct that it’s complex and difficult to understand!

So, in the end, despite both my Northern train from Bolton, and my Avanti train from Preston being delayed, I’ve actually got the final train to Anniesland that I intended to (also, ironically because it is late and I’m fit enough to march across the station to make the connection!), so presumably I’m due zero compensation on the return leg, which I’m absolutely fine with.

Of course, if I was a less moral passenger, I could pretend that Glasgow central was my final destination and claim the 26ish min delay. Obviously I won’t, but the system seems ripe for abuse. I can’t help but think a simpler fare system would help operators and passengers in this regard.

I'm not sure why you haven't mentioned your ticket to Anniesland above, but it's important you claim for the full journey you made to get what you're entitled to.

You’re right, I will include it in my claim for the outward journey. i always sort of separate it in my head because it’s such a cheap and quick part of the whole journey.

 

[MrJeeves]

Of course, if I was a less moral passenger, I could pretend that Glasgow central was my final destination and claim the 26ish min delay. Obviously I won’t, but the system seems ripe for abuse. I can’t help but think a simpler fare system would help operators and passengers in this regard.

Yep, you could and it is. And some do.

With a flexible through ticket to Anniesland, you could even claim you ended short at Glasgow to get that extra delay repay money.

The definition of a journey is tough, and is one that nothing readily defines clearly, but it's a question of one's morals, I suppose.

 

[Breamish]

If you bought it as one journey from our website, we would have issued one PDF and one itinerary which can result in such claims, and the legitimately of the itinerary, being easier to argue.

If you bought each ticket separately and have no through itinerary issued in conjunction with the purchase, but it's a valid itinerary and valid combination you put together yourself, your claim is no less valid. It's just you may find it harder to argue your case and you would be on your own in the event of a dispute.

When I get home/possibly tomorrow, I have a question about this. It seems if I start my journey from Anniesland, I don’t seem to get the option of the split journey that I “manually” buy myself. It seems the Anniesland portion does something odd with the fares.

 

[yorkie]

When I get home/possibly tomorrow, I have a question about this. It seems if I start my journey from Anniesland, I don’t seem to get the option of the split journey that I “manually” buy myself. It seems the Anniesland portion does something odd with the fares.

Send me a PM with the details and I will look into it.