Derby Station Remodeling plans?

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RichmondCommu

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G'day,

I've read on here that as part of the electrification of the MML there are plans to remodel Derby station and I'm curious to know what they have in mind. I travel up to Derby at least once a month and all too often are held just outside the station due to conflicting movements but its not obvious as to how this could ever change.

Your thoughts on this would be most welcome.

Richmond Commuter
 
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DDB

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Derby Station layout has always struck me as odd as the lines from Birmingham and Nottingham meet coming down to a single up down pair. They then split up again to the platforms. This means effectively the junction is south of the station.

I would of thought it would be better to move junction north of the station such that trains to/from London use one side of the station and those to/from Birmingham use the other. There will still need to be some connections south of the station for flexibility and to allow the Birmingham Nottingham trains to come in one way and out the other.

DDB
 
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swt_passenger

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This is all I could find so far - in the CP5 proposals of 2011:

To provide a remodelled layout at Derby, as a once in life time opportunity aligned to planned signalling and track renewals in the area. Specifically, to provide a layout that reduces the interaction between services approaching Derby from the North and the services approaching from the south by segregating the routes through Derby station that will:
 reduce journey times;
 improve performance;
 improve operational flexibility; and
 maintain declared infrastructure capability regarding rolling stock gauge.
Scope of works
 Signalling renewal and remodelling in the station area and beyond (see boundaries of scheme listed in assumptions);
 track renewal and remodelling in the station area and beyond (see boundaries of scheme listed in assumptions);
 incremental enhancement to track and signalling layout to segregate flows;
 possibility of minor alterations to station platforms in order to facilitate track layout; and
 provision of a new platform and associated access for all provision
 

MarkyT

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This is all I could find so far - in the CP5 proposals of 2011:
To avoid reversal of the Birmingham - Nottingham trains, a link from the north of the station to the Nottingham line could be provided/reinstated. This used to exist, but was severed as a though route, though the western end is still there as sidings. New construction would be required at the eastern end, though there appears to be a bridge under Derwent Parade that might be utilised.
 

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RichmondCommu

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Derby Station layout has always struck me as odd as the lines from Birmingham and Nottingham meet coming down to a single up down pair. They then split up again to the platforms. This means effectively the junction is south of the station.

I would of thought it would be better to move junction north of the station such that trains to/from London use one side of the station and those to/from Birmingham use the other. There will still need to be some connections south of the station for flexibility and to allow the Birmingham Nottingham trains to come in one way and out the other.

DDB
The problem is space constraints make it impossible to separate the two opposing routes south of the station.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
To avoid reversal of the Birmingham - Nottingham trains, a link from the north of the station to the Nottingham line could be provided/reinstated. This used to exist, but was severed as a though route, though the western end is still there as sidings. New construction would be required at the eastern end, though there appears to be a bridge under Derwent Parade that might be utilised.
All of the ex-railway land has now been built on. Not only that but Pride Park stadium, the home of my beloved Derby County stands in the way and no one is getting their mits on that!
 

MarkyT

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The problem is space constraints make it impossible to separate the two opposing routes south of the station.
Depends on how radical the layout reorganisation is surely. If the separate goods lines were dispensed with the 'London' lines might be slewed across into the easternmost platforms

All of the ex-railway land has now been built on. Not only that but Pride Park stadium, the home of my beloved Derby County stands in the way and no one is getting their mits on that!
Did you look at the attachment? My proposal diverts from the former route at it's eastern end to avoid the built-up area and crosses what appears to be undeveloped wasteland to the east of the Derwent just after its 90 degree bend under the Derwent Parade bridge as shown on Google Earth, Street View and Bing maps. I accept that these images are not bang up to date, but I don't have any more up-to-date sources and can't afford to visit Derby to check. Note the route does not go through the stadium, although passes close enough such that a dedicated station just over the river might be possible.
 

kjhskj75

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I believe it may be possible to do something even without losing the Goods Lines, if it is OK to sever the southern end of the carriage sidings. Then connect platform 6 to the northbound goods north of the crossover, and trains from Platform 6 can reach the Main lines over the "Connecting line".

Also connect Platform 1 to one of the St.Andrews Sidings. This would impose a speed restriction, but trains are stooping at the platform anyway.

My additions are in red on the attached image.

With this many more parallel moves are possible.
 

tbtc

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If you can sort out the south end tracks into two separate routes (that will allow a Burton bound departure to leave without getting in the way of an arrival from Long Eaton) then the best thing would be to have...

...two western through platforms for the two Burton - Duffield services an hour (the XC trains from Birmingham to Sheffield)...

...two central platforms (which could even be bay platforms) for the two Long Eaton to Burton services an hour (the XC trains from Nottingham to Birmingham)...

...and two eastern through platforms for the three Long Eaton to Duffield services an hour (the two London to Sheffield ones plus the Nottingham - Matlock one...

...plus a western bay for the Crewe service.

But for that you'd need to alter the platform arrangement as well as the junction at the southern end of the station.
 

The Planner

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It isn't at a phase where a single option has been selected yet, just the "Value Management" stage so things are still getting chucked about and drawn on fag packets.
 

kjhskj75

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That's 7 -- you'd need to build another island.

You could probably just get a small bay at the foot of platform 1.

Changes are also needed at the north end. Currently it's set up so 1 & 2 are northbound and 3,4&6 are southbound. And 5 tracks are reduced to 2 within feet of the platform ends. Again the goods lines constrain the layout.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
It isn't at a phase where a single option has been selected yet, just the "Value Management" stage so things are still getting chucked about and drawn on fag packets.
Which is what we're doing here.
 

brianthegiant

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Here's my 'fag packet' layout suggestion for Derby:
http://www.townend.me/files/derby.pdf
For a moment I thought your new 'Pride Park' station was where the new NR depot is going, but having seen your aerial photo up the thread I see they're in 2 different locations, with the NR depot (if my understanding is correct?) going in the triangular shaped bit of land SE of your yellow line.
Which also means part of your proposed bit of reinstated line is happening anyway :)
 
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