Do bus schedulers take account of road, etc., capacity?

[GusB]

Let's get back to the original topic, please!

 

[Roger1973]

Oh, and something else relevent . . . TfL contracts specify that "buses must pass point X every 6 minutes between 0730 and 0830" . . . this is how they ensure sufficient buses are provided for expected loadings. That is another constraint for the compiler to meet.

Ah yes, I remember them. They add to the fun.

Although for anyone wondering what it's all about, it means that on a route where running time is getting longer at the start of morning or evening peak, a - for example - 6 minute headway between departures at one end of the route might mean more than a 6 minute headway by the time buses reach the middle of the route which could be one of the busiest points.

There's one fairly obvious one on southbound route 1 in the morning peak for a 10 minute headway either at Waterloo or Elephant (route chosen as it's the first one I came to, not through any personal involvement) - see attached.

Where I worked (I'm no longer involved in London) we had one once where point X wasn't on the line of route so we had to contact and ask tactfully what the heck they meant. Think someone had copied and pasted without due care and attention.

 

[RJ]

Oh, and something else relevent . . . TfL contracts specify that "buses must pass point X every 6 minutes between 0730 and 0830" . . . this is how they ensure sufficient buses are provided for expected loadings. That is another constraint for the compiler to meet.

Yes, the bus service planners specify the “pinch point”, or “anchor point” where the headline frequency must be delivered. Often it will be at a timing point close to the busiest point, but sometimes it will be further along the route depending on where the traffic buildup is.

 

[greenline712]

Yes, the bus service planners specify the “pinch point”, or “anchor point” where the headline frequency must be delivered. Often it will be at a timing point close to the busiest point, but sometimes it will be further along the route depending on where the traffic buildup is.

And sometimes it's just towards the end of the route.
On Route 43 (London Bridge-Friern Barnet) northbound, the pinch point was at Highgate Tube .... in the AM peak it would have required buses ex LB every 3-4 minutes from 0630 to meet a 12 BPH target!!
I met the target by running some starting buses from HT garage in service rather than dead .... not strictly correct, but it saved 2 hours driver time for each bus .... ISTR 4 buses, so that was a duty cost saved!!
Nobody at London Buses knew why, but it had always been there ... and probably still is!!
Happy days ....

 

[Roger1973]

Nobody at London Buses knew why, but it had always been there ... and probably still is!!

There appear to be some journeys on the 43 that start at Archway Station in both directions still - a few on Saturday and Sunday as well (timetable on London Bus Routes here.)

I didn't realise there were any routes that still did that, as thought TFL disapproved of it.

 

[asb]

I would have thought starting short is fine, it's terminating short that they don't like.

 

[matt_world2004]

One Thing TfL has been very interested in recently is pavement capacity outside bus stops. I think it comes from the merging of the rail planning and bus planning directorate where the importance of things like how passengers flow through stations and stand on platforms has been transferred to the bus planning teams.

They will not increase a frequency of the route if they believe that it is going to cause the pavement to become too crowded. I know it formed part of the business case for the x140/140/278 service changes . Particularly around Harlington corner although to me the changes in these routes made pavement crowding worse

 

[Roger1973]

One Thing TfL has been very interested in recently is pavement capacity outside bus stops. I think it comes from the merging of the rail planning and bus planning directorate where the importance of things like how passengers flow through stations and stand on platforms has been transferred to the bus planning teams.

They will not increase a frequency of the route if they believe that it is going to cause the pavement to become too crowded. I know it formed part of the business case for the x140/140/278 service changes . Particularly around Harlington corner although to me the changes in these routes made pavement crowding worse

i'm aware that TFL have a bus stop design guide which includes an ideal for maximum number of buses per hour at any single stop, which seems reasonable - having multiple buses arrive at the same stop together can cause congestion if the bus stop isn't big enough, can lead to people having to get off somewhere unsuitable, and can mean that people with sight or mobility difficulties miss out on seeing / being able to reach the bus that pulls up at the back of the stop.

But not doing a frequency increase because that would 'cause the pavement to become too crowded' seems counter-intuitive from where i'm sitting - while an increased frequency will (in general) generate some passenger growth, surely having an service that's inadequate will result in longer queues at key stops.

Or have I misunderstood something here?