Early 1960s Newcastle to Leeds

[RyanOPlasty]

As a young child, I travelled with my parents between Leeds and Newcastle a few times up to about 1965.
I can remember on one occasion being taken to the front of the train at the water troughs which must have been Wiske Moor so that journey would have been via York
Would there also have been a direct service via Ripon at that time?

 

[Gloster]

As a young child, I travelled with my parents between Leeds and Newcastle a few times up to about 1965.
I can remember on one occasion being taken to the front of the train at the water troughs which must have been Wiske Moor so that journey would have been via York
Would there also have been a direct service via Ripon at that time?

There are a couple of North Eastern Region timetables on timetableworld. In the summer of 1964 it looks like a roughly two-hourly service northbound, but a bit more ragged southbound, plus a few trains that didn’t run north of Ripon.

 

[Western Sunset]

The "Queen of Scots" Pullman also took the Harrogate/Ripon route between Leeds and Newcastle.

 

[Harvester]

As a young child, I travelled with my parents between Leeds and Newcastle a few times up to about 1965.
I can remember on one occasion being taken to the front of the train at the water troughs which must have been Wiske Moor so that journey would have been via York
Would there also have been a direct service via Ripon at that time?

Wiske Moor troughs were north of Northallerton, so you could have gone via Ripon on that occasion, although not via the Durham coast. Many summer Saturday extras used the coast line and the Harrogate/Ripon route between Newcastle and Leeds and vice versa around that time.

 

[Bevan Price]

Until Harrogate - Ripon - Northallerton closed, several Liverpool / Newcastle services ran that way. In steam days (up to 1961), they reversed and changed locos at Leeds (City). When diesels took over, they ran via Wetherby to Harrogate ( which route was also closed), avoiding the need for a reversal & loco change.

 

[507020]

When we talk about “a service” any train not booked to call at York or Thirsk etc could reasonably have run via Ripon. In that case, would these have reversed at Leeds and run via Starbeck, avoiding Harrogate, or from Cross Gates/Church Fenton via Wetherby to Harrogate avoiding a reversal?

And if originating west of Leeds, would any trains running through Ripon have also used the “New” line, diverging at Heckmondwike Junction?

 

[Harvester]

The "Queen of Scots" Pullman also took the Harrogate/Ripon route between Leeds and Newcastle.

It had a booked stop at Harrogate, after reversal and a loco change at Leeds Central. Could never understand why it continued to use this route via Leeds, rather than going direct from Kings Cross to Edinburgh via Doncaster-York-Newcastle!

 

[Western Sunset]

If I recall, I think it was quicker, (or at least not overtaken) by the following KX-Edin service.

 

[Bevan Price]

When we talk about “a service” any train not booked to call at York or Thirsk etc could reasonably have run via Ripon. In that case, would these have reversed at Leeds and run via Starbeck, avoiding Harrogate, or from Cross Gates/Church Fenton via Wetherby to Harrogate avoiding a reversal?

And if originating west of Leeds, would any trains running through Ripon have also used the “New” line, diverging at Heckmondwike Junction?

The answer to the last question is "maybe". My few journeys on the new line were all after dieselisation, but I don't have a WTT for that era to see which trains were booked that way.
(And further west, some trains might use the Micklehurst loop rather than go via Greenfield & Mossley. )

 

[Harvester]

One of the problems when the Cross Gates-Wetherby-Harrogate line was used for Liverpool-Newcastle trains (regularly 1961-63) was poor diesel availability. Pacifics were frequently substituting for failed or unavailable Type 4s, but were not really suited for the route. The gradients between Cross Gates and Wetherby, in both directions, were troublesome in wet conditions, with heavy eleven/twelve coach Pacific hauled trains stalling and needing assistance.

 

[70014IronDuke]

It had a booked stop at Harrogate, after reversal and a loco change at Leeds Central. Could never understand why it continued to use this route via Leeds, rather than going direct from Kings Cross to Edinburgh via Doncaster-York-Newcastle!

Perhaps you remember the Ian Allan "Named Trains" series? I think they were 9d or some such.

One was about "The Queen of Scots" - one of the few I bought (I have no idea why I chose that) and I remember it mentioned that it went via Harrogate.

I believe it said (in so many words) that this was to attract the well-heeled spa traffic, which was presumably considered lucrative for BR(E/NE).

OF course, I have no idea if the author made this up or if it was accurate, at least at the time.

 

[Harvester]

Perhaps you remember the Ian Allan "Named Trains" series? I think they were 9d or some such.

One was about "The Queen of Scots" - one of the few I bought (I have no idea why I chose that) and I remember it mentioned that it went via Harrogate.

I believe it said (in so many words) that this was to attract the well-heeled spa traffic, which was presumably considered lucrative for BR(E/NE).

Seems the well-to-do were spoilt for choice southbound! In addition to the QoS on weekdays, Harrogate was also served by a portion of ‘The Yorkshire Pullman’ and SuO ‘The Harrogate Sunday Pullman’.